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Topic ClosedIsrael attack Gaza, December 2008

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Israel attack Gaza, December 2008
    Posted: 06-Jan-2009 at 22:44
The Horror
 
 
 
Israel rains fire on Gaza with phosphorus shells
 
 

Strike at Gaza school 'kills 30'

...

The UN aid agency in Gaza, Unrwa, said three artillery shells had landed close to the al-Fakhura school on Tuesday afternoon, spraying shrapnel on people both inside and outside the building.

 
About 350 people had sought refuge at the school in an effort to escape the fighting between Israeli soldiers and militants on the outskirts of the Jabaliya refugee camp, to the east of Gaza City.
 
 
This last news remind me the ancient stories about churchs burned with people inside Angry
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jan-2009 at 09:19
just like its bigger brother the US, remember Fallujah ?



article

The fog of war: white phosphorus, Fallujah and some burning questions

video documentary (waring this is graphic) here
discussed on this forum here

for the record


Protocol on Prohibitions or Restrictions on the Use of Incendiary Weapons (Protocol III). Geneva, 10 October 1980.

Definitions

For the purpose of this Protocol:
1. "Incendiary weapon" means any weapon or munition which is primarily designed to set fire to objects or to cause burn injury to persons through the action of flame, heat, or combination thereof, produced by a chemical reaction of a substance delivered on the target. (a) Incendiary weapons can take the form of, for example, flame throwers, fougasses, shells, rockets, grenades, mines, bombs and other containers of incendiary substances.
(b) Incendiary weapons do not include:
(i) Munitions which may have incidental incendiary effects, such as illuminants, tracers, smoke or signalling systems;
(ii) Munitions designed to combine penetration, blast or fragmentation effects with an additional incendiary effect, such as armour-piercing projectiles, fragmentation shells, explosive bombs and similar combined-effects munitions in which the incendiary effect is not specifically designed to cause burn injury to persons, but to be used against military objectives, such as armoured vehicles, aircraft and installations or facilities.
2. "Concentration of civilians" means any concentration of civilians, be it permanent or temporary, such as in inhabited parts of cities, or inhabited towns or villages, or as in camps or columns of refugees or evacuees, or groups of nomads.
3. "Military objective" means, so far as objects are concerned, any object which by its nature, location, purpose or use makes an effective contribution to military action and whose total or partial destruction, capture or neutralization, in the circumstances ruling at the time, offers a definite military advantage.
4. "Civilian objects" are all objects which are not military objectives as defined in paragraph 3.
5. "Feasible precautions" are those precautions which are practicable or practically possible taking into account all circumstances ruling at the time, including humanitarian and military considerations.


Article 2
Protection of civilians and civilian objects

1. It is prohibited in all circumstances to make the civilian population as such, individual civilians or civilian objects the object of attack by incendiary weapons.
2. It is prohibited in all circumstances to make any military objective located within a concentration of civilians the object of attack by air-delivered incendiary weapons.
3. It is further prohibited to make any military objective located within a concentration of civilians the object of attack by means of incendiary weapons other than air-delivered incendiary weapons, except when such military objective is clearly separated from the concentration of civilians and all feasible precautions are taken with a view to limiting the incendiary effects to the military objective and to avoiding, and in any event to minimizing, incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians and damage to civilian objects.
4. It is prohibited to make forests or other kinds of plant cover the object of attack by incendiary weapons except when such natural elements are used to cover, conceal or camouflage combatants or other military objectives, or are themselves military objectives.

http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/FULL/515?OpenDocument

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article590894.ece


Edited by Leonidas - 07-Jan-2009 at 09:38
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2009 at 00:58
Originally posted by Dolphin

Hamas needs to take a large proportion of responsibility for this situation. If the Israeli attacks are deemed 'disproportionate', then the assumption is that the cost of human life is equated in increasing numerical terms, not on the actual objectives of the perpetrator, which is to kill as many of the other as possible. When one innocent Israeli dies in a general-direction missile attack, and the Israelis retaliate with better equipment and better weapons, killing twenty innocent Palistinians, most people say that it is Israel that is perpetuating the violence. But every successive retaliation from both sides perpetuates the violence, and a ruling body such as Hamas calling for a "Day of wrath" from its people is just as despicable as any action the Israelis have perpetrated.

Should the attacks by Hamas and Palestinian militias stop, Israel would cease its ground assault quickly under international pressure, and the issue of their superior firepower and thus higher casualties would not be made so much of. Hiding among civilians is not the behaviour anyone should engage in.

Saying that, today a twenty-two year old Palestinian man today was shot in the head by Israelis for throwing stones, this is only going to make the situation worse, and it is these "small" things that can escalate the violence a lot more than larger political conflicts.


The Israeli Zionist regime was killing Palestinian babies long before Hamas existed.  What sparked this was most probably a Mossad false flag op.  Hamas is just another convenient excuse for the systematic and long term ethnic cleansing strategy of the Palestinian nation from its lands underway for over 60 years.  

There is nothing more to it.  Everything else you hear is just a pointless chit-chat inducing smokescreen.  

The perpetrators of this are brainwashed, cold blooded, ruthless savages whom I don't consider human.  How can you justify punishing 1,5 million people for the crimes of a handful of terrorists? I don't call them ZioNazis without good reason.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2009 at 07:08
The Hizbullah just fired at Israel...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2009 at 07:30
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

The Hizbullah just fired at Israel...
thats not confirmed, we know that three rockets were fired and only a couple of days ago I remember people were caught by the UN or something like that, trying to launch the rockets and they were not Hezbi forces.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2009 at 07:41
That's true, I spoke too soon.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2009 at 07:58
Oh it wasn't a coupe days ago it was a two weeks ago, they found eight Katyusha rockets in the coastal region between Naqura and Tair Harfa.


Israeli planners were this morning anxiously trying to work out who might have been responsible for the katyusha strikes.

Two weeks ago Lebanese security forces said they had found rockets in the south of the country aimed at Israel and set to be fired by automatic timer.

The assessment then was they were the work of Palestinian militants and not Hizbollah.

link


and while i was looking for that news grab, a palitisntian group climed responisbility, for a small attack in 2007

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 00:42

UN aid agency suspends work after Gaza strike

Martin Fletcher in Jerusalem and Philippe Naughton

The main UN aid agency in the Gaza Strip said today that it was suspending operations after an Israeli tank shell hit one of its convoys during the ceasefire period, killing two drivers.

The United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) made the announcement as the death toll from Israel’s war on Hamas shot up to 763 after new raids and dozens of bodies were found during a suspension in Israel’s bombing.

“UNRWA decided to suspend all its operations in the Gaza Strip because of the increasing hostile actions against its premises and personnel,” Adnan Abu Hasna, the agency’s Gaza-based spokesman, said.

Richard Miron, a UN spokesman, said the Israeli army had been notified in advance about the UNRWA convoy, which was hit as it approached the Erez crossing with Israel. Two Palestinian forklift drivers were killed.

With the Czech Republic currently holding the EU presidency, its foreign minister Karel Schwarzenberg said: “After the striking of the UN school, this is another terrible episode, which moreover occurred during the three-hour ceasefire declared by Israel.

“This is yet another proof that all wars necessarily mean tragic deaths of innocent people. That is why we reiterate our appeal: a ceasefire must not be further delayed."

Meanwhile, the 13-day conflict threatened to spread after militants in Lebanon fired at least three rockets into northern Israel, injuring two Israeli civilians and prompting military retaliation.

The Katyusha rockets were fired at the resort town of Nahariya, five miles south of the border. Israel responded with artillery fire. The authorities closed schools in the area and advised residents to stay close to shelters.

It was not immediately clear whether the rockets were fired by radical Palestinian groups based in Lebanon or by Hizbollah, a militant Islamic organisation allied to Hamas, the group Israel is trying to crush in the Gaza Strip.

Hizbollah had no immediate comment. Hamas, which fired rockets from the Gaza Strip into southern Israel almost simultaneously, denied responsibility.

Unifil, the UN peacekeeping force which controls the border area of southern Lebanon, said it was investigating.

In 2006 Israel invaded southern Lebanon and fought a bloody but inconclusive 34-day war against Hezbollah. Since then there have been only occasional rockets fired into northern Israel, but Israel has been on high alert for any attempt by Hezbollah to relieve the pressure on Hamas during Operation Cast Lead - the codename given to the assault on Gaza - by opening a second front and has warned of dire consequences if attacked.

The United Nations has already demanded an investigation into Israel’s shelling of a UN school in Gaza that killed more than 40 people earlier this week. Israel claimed that Hamas militants were operating in the area at the time.

The UN provides food aid to around 750,000 Gaza residents, and runs dozens of schools and clinics throughout the territory. They have some 9,000 locally-employed staffers inside Gaza, and a small team of international staffers who work there. UNRWA said it would not resume operations until Israel provided security guarantees for its staff.

In a further blow to Israel's credibility, the International Committee of the Red Cross today accused it of "unacceptable" conduct and breaching international humanitarian law after discovering four emaciated children living next to the corpses of their mothers and other adults in bomb-shattered houses in Gaza City.

The ICRC said that it had spent four days seeking Israeli guarantees of safe passage so that it could gain access to the houses in the badly damaged Zaytun neighbourhood of the city. It was finally allowed to send in a rescue team and four Palestine Red Crescent Society ambulances yesterday afternoon.

In one house they discovered four small children, alive but too weak to stand, next to the bodies of their dead mothers. In all there were 12 dead bodies lying on mattresses.

In another house they found 15 survivors of the Israeli bombardment, several of them wounded, and in a third, three corpses.

"This is a shocking incident," Pierre Wettach, the ICRC's head of delegation for Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories, said. "The Israeli military must have been aware of the situation but did not assist the wounded. Neither did they make it possible for us or the Palestine Red Crescent to assist the wounded."


Angry



Edited by vulkan02 - 09-Jan-2009 at 00:43
The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 00:44

Red Cross: Israel delayed access to Gaza wounded

By FRANK JORDANS – 5 hours ago

GENEVA (AP) — The international Red Cross accused Israel on Thursday of "unacceptable" delays in letting rescue workers reach three Gaza City homes hit by shelling where they eventually found 15 dead and 18 wounded, including young children too weak to stand.

The Geneva-based International Committee of the Red Cross, or ICRC, said the Israeli army refused rescuers permission to reach the site in the Zeitoun neighborhood for four days. Ambulances could not get to the neighborhood because the Israeli army had erected large earthen barriers that blocked access.

Israel said the delay was caused by fighting in the area and accused Hamas of using Palestinian civilians as human shields. Since Wednesday, Israel has observed a daily three-hour halt in operations to allow humanitarian evacuations and aid deliveries throughout Gaza.

The ICRC normally conducts confidential negotiations with warring parties, and its accusation against Israel was a rare public criticism of one party in a conflict over a specific incident.

Eventually, rescuers from the international Red Cross and Palestine Red Crescent received permission to go into the shelled houses during the halt in fighting Wednesday, four days after the buildings were hit by Israeli shells.

"This is a shocking incident," Pierre Wettach, head of the ICRC for the region, said.

The rescue team "found four small children next to their dead mothers in one of the houses. They were too weak to stand up on their own. One man was also found alive, too weak to stand up," the statement said. "In all, there were at least 12 corpses lying on mattresses" in one of the houses, it added.

The organization said the children and the wounded had to be transported by donkey cart to ambulances.

"The Israeli military must have been aware of the situation but did not assist the wounded," the international Red Cross said. "Neither did they make it possible for us or the Palestine Red Crescent to assist the wounded."

The ICRC said it believes "in this instance, the Israeli military failed to meet its obligation under international humanitarian law to care for and evacuate the wounded."

"It considers the delay in allowing rescue services access unacceptable," the Red Cross statement said.

The organization alleged Israel also refused requests to go to other destroyed houses in the same neighborhood of Gaza City, where the ICRC had reports of more wounded people.

Red Cross medics in Gaza could not be reached for comment on the condition of the children rescued from Zeitoun. ICRC spokeswoman Dorothea Krimitsas in Geneva said the children were evacuated during Wednesday's three-hour cease-fire. The Palestine Red Crescent said the children are in the Shifa and al-Quds hospitals in Gaza City.

The Associated Press was not able to visit the hospitals because of the dangers of moving around Gaza, and it has been difficult to obtain information from the hospitals about the children because staff are overwhelmed with casualties and unable to talk with reporters.

Red Cross spokesman Iyad Nasr said emergency crews evacuated 105 more injured people from Zeitoun on Thursday and were struggling to find shelter for them. Also Thursday, a Palestinian health official said the bodies of 35 people have been found in the rubble of bombed out buildings in Gaza City during a three-hour pause in fighting, many of them in the Zeitoun neighborhood.

The Israeli military did not comment on the specifics of the Red Cross allegations, but said it is closely cooperating with international aid organizations during the Gaza fighting to assist civilians caught in the crossfire.

"The Israel Defense Forces are engaged in a battle with the Hamas terrorist organization that has deliberately used Palestinian civilians as human shields," a military statement said. "The IDF in no way intentionally targets civilians and has demonstrated its willingness to abort operations to save civilian lives and to risk injury in order to assist innocent civilians."

Israel said it would investigate any formal complaint against the army's conduct within the constraints of the current military operation.

Israel's ambassador in Geneva, Aharon Leshno-Yaar, denied his country was failing in its humanitarian obligations.

"Once the military activity was over, then it was possible for humanitarian teams to evacuate the wounded," he told The Associated Press.

Leshno-Yaar said Israel respects international humanitarian law and is working with aid groups to allow the wounded to be removed and in some cases transferred to hospitals in Israel.

But aid groups say safe passage around Gaza remains a problem.

On Thursday, the United Nations said it was halting all aid deliveries inside Gaza after gunfire from an Israeli tank killed an aid truck driver.

The international Red Cross said it would temporarily stop sending convoys outside of Gaza City after one of its vehicles came under fire from an Israeli position at the Netzarim crossing during the three-hour halt in fighting Thursday. One driver was lightly injured.

ICRC spokeswoman Dorothea Krimitsas said the convoy, which was escorting ambulances to the south of Gaza, was forced to abort its mission.

The World Health Organization said 21 Palestinian medical workers have been killed and 30 injured since Israel launched its offensive on Dec. 27.

Angry

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 01:39
Vulkan please provide links for both news stories, and update them to the blueprint of Leonidas' post above to meet our new copy/paste - and new story guidelines as outlined here.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 02:25
You know what will settle the israeli/palestinian conflict? If a man comes in between the tanks and troops with his skin dyed blue with 3 arms on each side of his torso speaking in a language totally intelligible to both groups. =0
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 03:01
Originally posted by es_bih

Vulkan please provide links for both news stories, and update them to the blueprint of Leonidas' post above to meet our new copy/paste - and new story guidelines as outlined here.


Ok ok I will keep that in mind.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 12:30
The UN has now passeda binding resolution calling for an immediate cease-fire and and Israeli withdrawal. This, of course, has been completely ignored by both sides. In combination with repeated attacks by the Israeli military against aid providers and UN institutions, the situation is looking dire.

The key question is what happens next. Israel will most certainly be reluctant to halt its assault, regardless of the UN and humanitarian consequences. If they pull out I will be greatly relieved, but it looks unlikely at this point. If the assaults proceed, could they embolden other parties and open new fronts? Any military action taken by other parties could be portrayed/seen as in support of the UN resolution or the only option after diplomacy failed. What are your thoughts on the issue?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 13:19
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

The Hizbullah just fired at Israel...


Mossad maxim: 'By Way of Deception, thou shalt do War'


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 13:33
Originally posted by Zaitsev

If the assaults proceed, could they embolden other parties and open new fronts? Any military action taken by other parties could be portrayed/seen as in support of the UN resolution or the only option after diplomacy failed. What are your thoughts on the issue?
Hizbollah hands are tied by UN peacekeepers in Lebanon. The only one who can take military action against Israel is Syria, because rest of Israeli neighbours are "de facto" allies (Jordan and Egpt).

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 15:29
Originally posted by Zaitsev

The UN has now passeda binding resolution calling for an immediate cease-fire and and Israeli withdrawal. This, of course, has been completely ignored by both sides. In combination with repeated attacks by the Israeli military against aid providers and UN institutions, the situation is looking dire.

The key question is what happens next. Israel will most certainly be reluctant to halt its assault, regardless of the UN and humanitarian consequences. If they pull out I will be greatly relieved, but it looks unlikely at this point. If the assaults proceed, could they embolden other parties and open new fronts? Any military action taken by other parties could be portrayed/seen as in support of the UN resolution or the only option after diplomacy failed. What are your thoughts on the issue?
The isreali's are in a bit of bad place.

 They stop now, they leave Hamas relatively intact, and save themselves a dirty fight and basically lose in the face of their elctorate and just as importanatly the Arab world. Not good, and hamas wil gain regonigtion it didnt have earlier.

 They don't stop, they risk more lives (themsleves i mean they don't give a toss about Gazans) fighting Hamas in the urban areas* and most probably lose anyway but might be able to damage Hamas enough (high risk in failure). They covered this (perception) a bit, by not making their objectives measerable or well defined. Either way Hamas only has to remain in power and launch even 1 rocket on the last day to win. Thats why the odds are agianst the IDF, they are the ones under pressure.

Against hezbollah they stated they wanted to 'stop' the rockets, now they say they want to limit them. They learnt something from 2006, not diplomacy though they still suck at that, and the proganda war can never be won when so much bombing kills so many childeren.  Even if they get away with it on the ground, they pretty much destroyed their image abroad (inc 2006).

*BTW Hamas has not engage them in a big way they are lying as low as possible and wanting the IDF to go deeper into the urban areas, where they stand a chance in hand to hand type fighting. This would be fustrating the IDF right now, robbed of that killer blow. but who is suprised of this outcome?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 15:59
Originally posted by Roberts

Originally posted by Zaitsev

If the assaults proceed, could they embolden other parties and open new fronts? Any military action taken by other parties could be portrayed/seen as in support of the UN resolution or the only option after diplomacy failed. What are your thoughts on the issue?
Hizbollah hands are tied by UN peacekeepers in Lebanon. The only one who can take military action against Israel is Syria, because rest of Israeli neighbours are "de facto" allies (Jordan and Egpt).

They are not so much tied by the UN, but they stand to lose the political currency they gained in domestic Lebanese politics, while Iran would not want to rock the ship when Obama is about to come in. They will attack if it suites them first.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2009 at 16:06
Hizbollah is under the comman of the Mullahs of Tehran. They are a strategic asset for them. If the US/Israel strikes Iran the Hizb with heed to neither the UN nor Lebanese government once orders came from Iran.
 
As for Syria, the only thing occupying the Syrian dictator's mind right now is how to consolidate power and eliminate competition, he doesn't give a shit about Israel or the Golan heights or even te Palestinians. There is deep trouble in Syria right now. assasinations, power struggles, an emblodened civil society and a dire economic situation. If signing the Golan will guarantee him staying in power he will sign it to the Israelis.
 
The region is going to a much bigger problem than people currently thinking. Spring is on the door and thus a new window to strike Iran is on the way to be opened. The up coming US administration is doing everything to prove that it will distroy the world and bring on a world war for the sake of Israel (previously strikes were on the tables now nuking Iran is a possibility).
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jan-2009 at 02:30
On a realistic level I don't think the UN forces on the Lebanese border enforce any restraints on Hezbollah. Their legitimacy is further reduced when their own binding resolutions on Israel are ignored. If Hezbollah so chose they could easily dispatch the forces in question. This action would lead to a LOT of political fallout, domestic and international though. Alternatively they could probably bypass the UN forces as they would be reluctant to open fire when not fired upon.

Hezbollah's involvement in the immediate future seems unlikely though as their internal authority would be greatly damaged and critical support lost. In order for them to become involved the public opinion in Lebanon would need to swing strongly in favour of intervention, which would definitely take some time.

How long do you think Israel may continue its offensive in violation of the UN resolution, and do you think UN member nations will ever intervene in support of the resolution? Of course a Security Council vote on the issue would immediately be Vetoed by the United States, so a legitimate process is quite impossible.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jan-2009 at 06:32
Hello Zaitsev
 
The UN forces can distroy the Hizb if orders came but non of the european powers want trouble.

Also, you give the Hizb more credit than they deserve. They are pure robots and do what they are told to do. They don't give a rat's ass about what people inside Lebanon including their electorate think about their action plus their electorate will always vote for them no matter what.

As for Israel, it will do as it pleases as long as it pleases. With Egypt supporting it all the way there is no need even for the US. The EU is also supporting their actions and what ever lip service they have been giving their actions prove that.
 
Time and time again the control of US policy that Israel and their cronies in the US have on US foreign policy since Bush Jr and that Israel literally hijacked the congress for its own puposes. Just look at the scandals for the last 8 years involving Israel (seling US military secrets to India and especially China, spying, blackmailing and others). Had it been Britain that was invloved in those scandals doom and gloom will fall upon it but no, it was "God's chosen people" who done all these things. If the US really wanted to force peace they would have done that years ago but they won't. Remember that the congress opposes any of the peace deal in a de fact way by giving loans to building colonies, forcing the relocation of the US embassy and voting on binding resolutions about Jerusalem. There is more pork going Israel's way in US budgets than that going to Katrina victims or the unemployed.
 
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