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minchickie
Shogun
Joined: 03-Jul-2005
Location: Hungary
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 241
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Topic: TURANIANS Posted: 23-Jul-2005 at 02:12 |
HELLOOOOO!!!
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Ironheart
Immortal Guard
Joined: 31-Jul-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
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Posted: 31-Jul-2005 at 17:34 |
Originally posted by kroglu
And a Turk without Turanid influence:
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Who is this? Manken Zeki?
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Pax Ottomanica
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Seljuk
Knight
Joined: 14-Jan-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 80
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Posted: 31-Jul-2005 at 18:36 |
Originally posted by Ironheart
Originally posted by kroglu
And a Turk without Turanid influence:
| Who is this? Manken Zeki? |
isnt he Volkan the reserve goalkeeper of Fenerbahe?
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Tangriberdi
Earl
Joined: 03-Aug-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 267
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Posted: 03-Aug-2005 at 08:15 |
Originally posted by Zagros Purya
AtaTurk:
He was half Jewish I believe.
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Do not insult our nation and its leader. If you that will not be the same as calling Azeri Turks in Iran Torke Hari, The donkey Turk
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erci
Chieftain
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1426
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Posted: 03-Aug-2005 at 14:22 |
he didn't insult Ataturk.it is ok not to know about him well, if you're Not-Turkish
Edited by erci
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 03-Aug-2005 at 18:14 |
Reading all you brother's posts makes me proud of my Turanian/Turkish heritage. Thank you.
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kroglu
Knight
Suspended
Joined: 14-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 85
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Posted: 04-Aug-2005 at 20:41 |
Originally posted by Kalender
Reading all you brother's posts makes me proud of my Turanian/Turkish heritage. Thank you.
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Senin gibiler sagola gardash!
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The Guardian
Shogun
Joined: 12-Jul-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 237
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Posted: 04-Aug-2005 at 20:43 |
Originally posted by Tangriberdi
Originally posted by Zagros Purya
AtaTurk:
He was half Jewish I believe.
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Do not insult our nation and its leader. If you that will not be the same as calling Azeri Turks in Iran Torke Hari, The donkey Turk
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It is not an insult to call someone jewish
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It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up.
&nb
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Tangriberdi
Earl
Joined: 03-Aug-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 267
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Posted: 05-Aug-2005 at 10:34 |
Originally posted by The Guardian
Originally posted by Tangriberdi
Originally posted by Zagros Purya
AtaTurk:
He was half Jewish I believe.
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Do not insult our nation and its leader. If you that will not be the same as calling Azeri Turks in Iran Torke Hari, The donkey Turk
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It is not an insult to call someone jewish
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What's wrong with being a Jew/Jewish ? Of cpourse nothing ! But insult here is that speaking something incorrect for someone.
He is no way a Jew, He is a Turk.
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 05-Aug-2005 at 11:34 |
Being Jew doesnt mean he wasnt a Turk. "Jew" refers to a religion, not specific ethnicity, even if it originally does.
From his father's side, he had Jewish origins. So what? Gagavuz Turks are still Christian, also some Kazakhs. Karaim Turks are also Jewish. Dont you remember the Khazar Turks? Your religion doesnt identify your ethnicity.
But to enlighten the uninformed minds: Ataturk wasnt a Jew, his family was totally Muslims. And Ataturk wasnt a religious person. His origins may possibly have Jewish influence, but I dont think religion matters at all. We arent mullahs to jdge people according to their religious pasts. I prefer a smart, wise Jew to rule me rather than a fanatic Shia mullah.
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The Guardian
Shogun
Joined: 12-Jul-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 237
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Posted: 05-Aug-2005 at 12:00 |
Originally posted by Tangriberdi
But insult here is that speaking something incorrect for someone. |
I say you are 6 feet tall.Is that an insult?
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It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up.
&nb
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niceone928
Immortal Guard
Joined: 10-Aug-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
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Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:40 |
As far as I know Ata Turk was half a jew. Another thing, there is something wrong with Jewish newspapers, that's all I ever get in the USA.
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OSMANLI
Colonel
Joined: 24-Nov-2004
Location: North Cyprus
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 740
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Posted: 30-Aug-2005 at 10:01 |
Ataturk having Jewish heretiage. Yes i have heard this as well, although do not know why this is said.
Some even say that he was working on behalf ofthe Jews to break the TUrks Islam. NOT MY WORDS, i read it once in a book. It did not have enough evidence to back there thoughts.
Who was ment to have Jewish blood his mum or dad?
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kroglu
Knight
Suspended
Joined: 14-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 85
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Posted: 30-Aug-2005 at 11:10 |
Here is a picture of Ataturks father Ali Riza...
As you can see he looks pretty much like a Turanian, so stop this sh*t
Edited by kroglu
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Hak-Khan
Pretorian
Joined: 28-Aug-2005
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 164
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 00:54 |
mirkelam(singer)
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Hak-Khan
Pretorian
Joined: 28-Aug-2005
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 164
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 01:02 |
fenerbahce and volkan=reserv taem's reserv player
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Alparslan
Colonel
Joined: 07-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 517
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 13:31 |
People who want to relate Ataturk with Jews ancestors are the ones who oppose his religious reforms and laik Turkey.
They want to show Ataturk as a Jews puppet who has been used to break down Islam in Turkey.
These claims are not true. Ataturk was a Turk and Muslim. He was a Bektashi - Alevi. But after seeing Arabs sided with British against Ottomans and Caliphe became a puppet of allied forces he decided to establish a modern state without a religious influence. But one sign has left. We have Bektashi - Turkish symbole on Turkish passeports. They wanted to eliminate religious dogmas from social life.
This picture has been taken from an Hungarian web. Look at the Bekhtasi dervishe's symbol that he carries. And look at the second page of your Turkish passeports if you have one and see the symbol under the moon and croissant. You will see the same symbol on every pages with letters TC; Turkiye Cumhuriyeti..... This is one of the symbols of Turks which is used along with moon and croissant during history.........
Edited by Alparslan
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 17:31 |
Wow, I didnt know he was an Alevi like me. I thought his father, Ali Riza Efendi was a Turk of Thesellanoiki, altough his origins were Turkish, he had Jewish influence. But he was a Muslim. Ataturk was a Muslim, but he wasnt a religious person at all. So I guess he may be an Alevi...
Anyway, I wouldnt care if he was a Jew or even a Buddhist. We have suffered the "loyal" actions of lots of fellow Sunnite Muslims in history, so maybe him not being a Sunnite was better.
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erci
Chieftain
Joined: 22-Jun-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1426
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 18:14 |
didn't know about the symbol on Turkish Passport.I know 12 pointed star symbolize the 12 imams.
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"When one hears such music, what can one say, but .... Salieri?"
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Phallanx
Chieftain
Joined: 07-Feb-2005
Location: Greece
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1283
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Posted: 31-Aug-2005 at 19:13 |
Some sources that support his Jewish ancestry.
Ataturk, The Rebirth of a Nation,
Lord Kinross, 1965, p. 437
For Kemal, Islam and civilization were a contradiction in terms.
"If only," he once said of the Turks, with a flash of cynical insight,
"we could make them Christians!" His was not to be the reformed
Islamic state for which the Faithful were waiting: it was to be a
strictly lay state, with a centralized Government as strong as
the Sultan's, backed by the army and run by his own intellectual
bureaucracy.
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Turkey, Emil Lengyel, 1941, pp. 140-141
During the early days of Kemal's career, many of his followers
were under the impression that he was a champion of Islam and that
they were fighting the Christians. "Ghazi, Destroyer of Christians"
was the name they gave him. Had they been aware of his real intentions,
they would have called him "Ghazi, Destroyer of Islam."
-------------------------
Grey Wolf, Mustafa Kemal, An Intimate Study of a Dictator,
H.C. Armstrong, 1934
p. 241:
"For five hundred years these rules and theories of an Arab sheik," he
said, "and the interpretations of generations of lazy, good-for-nothing
priests have decided the civil and the criminal law of Turkey."
"They had decided the form of the constitution, the details of the
lives of each Turk, his food, his hours of rising and sleeping, the
shape of his clothes, the routine of the midwife who produced his
children, what he learnt in his schools, his customs, his thoughts,
even his most intimate habits."
"Islam, this theology of an immoral Arab, is a dead thing." Possibly
it might have suited tribes of nomads in the desert. It was no good for
a modern progressive State.
"God's revelation!" There was no God. That was one of the chains by
which the priests and bad rulers bound the people down.
"A ruler who needs religion to help him rule is a weakling. No weakling
should rule.."
And the priests! How he hated them. The lazy, unproductive priests
who ate up the sustenance of the people. He would chase them out of
their mosques and monasteries to work like men.
Religion! He would tear religion from Turkey as one might tear the
throttling ivy away to save a young tree
p. 243
Further, it was public knowledge that he was irreligious, broke all
the rules of decency, and scoffed at sacred things. He had chased the
Sheik-ul-Islam, the High Priest of Islam, out of his office and thrown
the Koran after him. He had forced the women in Angora to unveil. He had
encouraged them to dance body close to body with accursed foreign men and
Christians.
------------------------
Turkey,
Emil Lengyel,
1941, p. 134
Kemal cared nothing about Allah; he was interested in himself
and in Turkey. He hated Allah and made him responsible for Turkey's
misfortune. It was Allah's tyrannical rule that paralyzed the hands
of the Turk. But he knew that Allah was real to the Turkish peasant,
while nationalism meant nothing to him. He decided, therefore, to
draft Allah into his service as the publicity director of his national
cause. Through Allah's aid his people must cease to be Mohammedans and
become Turks. Then, after Allah had served Kemal's purpose, he could
discard him.
-------------------------
Ataturk, The Rebirth of a Nation,
Lord Kinross, 1965, p. 437
For Kemal, Islam and civilization were a contradiction in terms.
"If only," he once said of the Turks, with a flash of cynical insight,
"we could make them Christians!" His was not to be the reformed
Islamic state for which the Faithful were waiting: it was to be a
strictly lay state, with a centralized Government as strong as
the Sultan's, backed by the army and run by his own intellectual
bureaucracy.
---------------------
Oguz,
Well your comment about his being from Thessaloniki actually supports
the connection. If you ever look up the area his house was, you'll find
that it was right in the center of the Jewish community of Thessaloniki.
Edited by Phallanx
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To the gods we mortals are all ignorant.Those old traditions from our ancestors, the ones we've had as long as time itself, no argument will ever overthrow, in spite of subtleties sharp minds invent.
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