Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

China vs US

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 5>
Author
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: China vs US
    Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 00:09
Im very curious that if a war broke out between China and the US who most likely win and why?
So please explain in detail and dont just pick a side.
Back to Top
TheOrcRemix View Drop Down
Consul
Consul
Avatar

Joined: 28-Dec-2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 369
  Quote TheOrcRemix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 01:08
prob usa, they got the worldwide support, the nukes, and more devleoped military technology.
True peace is not the absence of tension, but the presence of justice.
Sir Francis Drake is the REAL Pirate of the Caribbean
Back to Top
Gubook Janggoon View Drop Down
Sultan
Sultan
Avatar
Retired Global Moderator

Joined: 08-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2187
  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 01:17
Originally posted by maineak

Im very curious that if a war broke out between China and the US who most likely win and why?
So please explain in detail and dont just pick a side.


No one wins in nuclear war.
Back to Top
coolstorm View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 11-Nov-2004
Location: Hong Kong
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1066
  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 03:28

Both will lose.

It's estimated that China got enough nukes to destroy the US 2 times, and the US got enough nukes to destroy China 10 times, but 1 time is all you need.

The US certainly does not get the support from world-wide such as Russia, France, and Germany.

���DZj�~�� ��������
�� �� �C �q �D �� �� �� �� �T �� �� �g �A �� �� �� �� �� �U �N �� ��
Back to Top
Paul View Drop Down
General
General
Avatar
AE Immoderator

Joined: 21-Aug-2004
Location: Hyperborea
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 952
  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 10:21

There's several kinds of wars they could have,

 

Nuclear: problably a score draw (wipe each other out)

though maybe China's second strike capability isn't too good and there's a chance for a US win if they launch a successful surprise strike.

 

Conventional: No score draw. (US invades China it will lose, China invades US it will lose.)

 

Cold: (most likely) 60 years down the line I would guess the Chinese economy would triumph.



Edited by Paul
Light blue touch paper and stand well back

http://www.maquahuitl.co.uk

http://www.toltecitztli.co.uk
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 10:56
Hmmm
China vs USA is a classic already. And it hasn't even started!
Back to Top
aknc View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 12-Mar-2005
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1449
  Quote aknc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 11:06
Everone loses.EVERYONE.Both countries will probably use all their nuclear wepons and half of the the world will be gone.
"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
              
Back to Top
coolstorm View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 11-Nov-2004
Location: Hong Kong
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1066
  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 11:26
in fact, all of the world will be gone.
���DZj�~�� ��������
�� �� �C �q �D �� �� �� �� �T �� �� �g �A �� �� �� �� �� �U �N �� ��
Back to Top
Idanthyrus View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 03-Feb-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 188
  Quote Idanthyrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 15:35

Depends on the circumstances. With regards to nuclear weapons I have heard only a few of China's missles have the range to hit US eastern seaboard cities. As to invading one another the US doesnt have the neccisary resources while everything is being diverted to Iraq, and China doesnt have the capacity to invade Taiwan much less to invade the US.

Depending on the circumstances there is definatly a possibility that Europe and Russia would get involved. Hard to say at the moment.

Back to Top
strategos View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 09-Mar-2005
Location: Denmark
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1096
  Quote strategos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 20:19
Originally posted by coolstorm

.

The US certainly does not get the support from world-wide such as Russia, France, and Germany.

These countries would pick the US no doubt compared to picking China in a war.. better relations than with China.

Back to Top
Riain View Drop Down
Knight
Knight
Avatar

Joined: 10-Feb-2005
Location: Australia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 84
  Quote Riain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 20:47

The USA would flog China in about 20 minutes, conventional or nuke. IN the first seconds China would be crawling with 100+ US heavy bombers which they would be powerless to stop. China doesn't have the numbers of AEW&C and tankers to adequately defend its huge territory against B1s, let alone B2s. Then there would be the rest of the USAF,USN and army aviation to contend with. American army mobilty would be so great that the PLA would have to gaurd everything of importance, yet they would be vulnerable to defeat in detail at the vital targets that US ground forces choose to attack. The USN would sink Chinese ships like it was going out of style and US control of the air after the initial days would be all encompasing.

I think between attack and defence Chinas nuke threat to ConUS would be drastically reduced.

China's only chance would be an all encompassing conventional and assymetric pre-emptive attack on the US, focussing on its long range mobilty assets and force multipliers such as AWACS and tankers.

Back to Top
Tobodai View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar
Avatar
Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 03-Aug-2004
Location: Antarctica
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4310
  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 22:24

I dont think there will be war..too much economic interdependance...but if this forum is reflective of real up and coming Chinese generation expect China to have a facist government in the future and who knows what well happen.

Right now China is a paper tiger, its air force is too small, its navy not very good..its army is all thats good.  In modern war air supremacy means everything though and a large well trained army can simply be bombed from the sky.  Numbers no longer matter in modern conventional war.

Give China a few decades and wed have a more intresting match.

"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
Back to Top
Paul View Drop Down
General
General
Avatar
AE Immoderator

Joined: 21-Aug-2004
Location: Hyperborea
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 952
  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 22:29
Originally posted by Riain

The USA would flog China in about 20 minutes, conventional or nuke. IN the first seconds China would be crawling with 100+ US heavy bombers which they would be powerless to stop. China doesn't have the numbers of AEW&C and tankers to adequately defend its huge territory against B1s, let alone B2s. Then there would be the rest of the USAF,USN and army aviation to contend with. American army mobilty would be so great that the PLA would have to gaurd everything of importance, yet they would be vulnerable to defeat in detail at the vital targets that US ground forces choose to attack. The USN would sink Chinese ships like it was going out of style and US control of the air after the initial days would be all encompasing.

I think between attack and defence Chinas nuke threat to ConUS would be drastically reduced.

China's only chance would be an all encompassing conventional and assymetric pre-emptive attack on the US, focussing on its long range mobilty assets and force multipliers such as AWACS and tankers.

I suppose not only will they pull 5 million fully trained soldiers out of a hat, they'll teach em to walk on water across the Pacific.

Light blue touch paper and stand well back

http://www.maquahuitl.co.uk

http://www.toltecitztli.co.uk
Back to Top
Genghis View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 02-Aug-2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2656
  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2005 at 23:53

I think America could win a war with china after 4 to 6 years of hard struggle. All they have is cannon fodder. We can still produce more than they can, and we would very soon move production to Southeast Asia and the like to make up for that lost producer. The Chinese air force and navy would cease to exist as fighting forces within a month of a war. Their army would probably not be too difficult to deal with unless we totally bungled it.

Also, speaking economically, Chinese would lose it's main market, and American warships would cut off all Chinese trade, their main source of money. China is also now the world's biggest consumer and a net importer of oil. With control of the seas, America can starve the Chinese very well.

I predict any battle with the Chinese would look a lot like the Battle of Agincourt in 1415. King Henry V and the English (representing the US) hunkered down behind strong fortifications and let the French move across open terrain where they were decimated with thousands of arrows fired by English longbowmen.

A battle with the Chinese I think would see American and Chinese forces coming into contact with eachother, then the Americans would dig in and construct strong defensive fortifications. We would then force the Chinese to expose themselves to attack us, or to mass to defend against any American attack, making them extremely vulnerable to American artillery and airpower.

Keep in mind, this would all be while the Chinese power grid, rail system, dams, and industry are being attacked by the American air force. We can only hope that we will use air superiority more effective than we did in WWII, but given current technology I don't think it would be hard to have a few bombs cripple a factory until major repairs have been done.

I don't think the Chinese would use nukes if they were rational (but they could very well do something irrational). They can only strike the far West Coast. We can attack all of their country. A full 90% of the Chinese population also lives on 10% of Chinese territory, which would make them incredibly vulnerable to retaliatory strikes using nuclear or chemical weapons.

If I were them, I would just try to make the Americans bleed as much as possible. I would probably try to pull off a Stalingrad type battle against us. Bring us in really close so that our heavy fire support has to be used with more caution (in the days of smart weapons this might not be as effective as it was in 1943) and then bleed us in a long battle of attrition (against troops with land warrior this might also be difficult, but street fighting still probably offers the Chinese the greatest chance of success).

But then again, the qualitative advantage of the modern US Army over the PLA is still far greater than that of the Wehrmacht against the Red Army. America still has a larger economy than China and we're lightyears ahead in technology, advantages denied to the Wehrmacht which was outproduced by Soviet Russia and had not as great a lead over the Russians as America does. The USSR had a well-respected group of scientists and engineers which occasionally outclassed the Germans, something the Chinese, who are reliant on technological imports, would have an almost impossible time achieving.

I personally think China needs to be dealt with. They are exerting more and more force in the world, and I think we should smother this potential rival in it's cradle before it grows up and becomes harder to deal with.

Member of IAEA
Back to Top
coolstorm View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 11-Nov-2004
Location: Hong Kong
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1066
  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 00:02

I am a military person.

I am telling everyone here a war between the US and China will not have a winner but two losers.

In modern warfare, both sides will lose with huge losses.

And, please do not compare China with Iraq as China afterall has the second largest military budget in the world.

���DZj�~�� ��������
�� �� �C �q �D �� �� �� �� �T �� �� �g �A �� �� �� �� �� �U �N �� ��
Back to Top
Gubook Janggoon View Drop Down
Sultan
Sultan
Avatar
Retired Global Moderator

Joined: 08-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2187
  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 00:07
Originally posted by coolstorm

And, please do not compare China with Iraq as China afterall has the second largest military budget in the world.



Who did that?
Back to Top
coolstorm View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 11-Nov-2004
Location: Hong Kong
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1066
  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 00:36

he was using the iraqi street fight tactics to refer to china.

for any information about the chinese military, visit

www.sinodefence.com

there's a forum also

���DZj�~�� ��������
�� �� �C �q �D �� �� �� �� �T �� �� �g �A �� �� �� �� �� �U �N �� ��
Back to Top
Idanthyrus View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian


Joined: 03-Feb-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 188
  Quote Idanthyrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 00:38

As far as I know China has the world third largest airforce, but it is supplied mostly with obsolete Q-5s and J-7s. The most advanced heavy bomber they have is the indiginously produced version of the Russian Badger which was already obsolete by the early 60's. China is working on production of the J-10 and the licenced Su-27 however.

It does bear mind that large scale high-tempo, high-tech warfare is exactly what the modern US Armed Forces has been planning and preparing for since the beginning of the cold war. Thats where all our main strengths in deployment, technology and tactics come into play. We really can't cope with guerilla style warfare however as history has shown, (and is still showing).

If China could manage to force the U.S. to constantly adapt to it own tactics they could definatly manage to make things tough going for the US, even today.

Back to Top
coolstorm View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 11-Nov-2004
Location: Hong Kong
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1066
  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 00:46

The air force today mainly relies on SU30MK, SU27SMK, and J10.

There are approximiately 150 SU27SMK, 50 SU30MK, and 20 J10 serving with the Chinese air force now. The number of J10 is expected to be 1000 by 2010. Approximately 100 new SU27SMK, and a newer variant is expected to go into service by 2008. Another patch of 150 SU30MK is expected to enter service by 2008 as well.

The new generation, J12, is also under development.

���DZj�~�� ��������
�� �� �C �q �D �� �� �� �� �T �� �� �g �A �� �� �� �� �� �U �N �� ��
Back to Top
Tobodai View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar
Avatar
Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 03-Aug-2004
Location: Antarctica
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4310
  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2005 at 02:42
the air force and the navy are stil no match for the US, the army is the only thing that could reist well, but iwth control of the skies they would simply be bombed to oblivion fromt eh sky.
"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 5>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.125 seconds.