The Battle of Moh�cs, 1526

All the dates are in western calendar.

Then do you say if the plan had applicated,the Ottomans would have been defeated surely?

No cavalry  charge

That war lost half of its soul.

 

 

 

Hmm we have a story about mohac.( It can be about another war too)

When patisah was looking  battle field after the war, he told  one of  his vezirs, Look deaths  all of them are  young.

Vezir answered, If they are not so young, They would not be death.

So It looks like  vezir is wrong, There is  not much stupidy.

 

 

Originally posted by observer The cannon fire surely was decisive. I have read somewhere that it was actually the first time in history the cannon was directly used against infantry,cavalry.  Until then it had been used more of a siege weapon.

I think it had already used in the battlefield, if I don't remember bad at  Pav�a (1520) it was used.

Originally posted by Moustafa Pasha For your information the battle of Mohacs was very short,approximately two hours.The Hungarians first defeated the Rumelian Army but were defeated in turn by the main Ottoman Army under Sultan Suleiman. As a result Hungary was divided between Turkey and Austria. The Ottoman part was occupied for 168 years.

Not exactly. The ottoman army left Hungary in 1526. The king was dead and civil war began between the party of Ferdinand I (Habsburg) and John I (Z�polya). Ferdinand was aided by his brother the Holy Roman emperor Charles V., so King John became the vassal of the sultan was aided by Sulyeman. King John died in 1541 and his son was only a baby. The ottoman captured Southern and middle Hungary only in 1541. After this the country was divided into three part. The Royal Hungary ruled by Ferdinand, the part captured by the Ottoman Empire and the principality of Transylvania an ottoman vassal state ruled by the son of king John I.

Edited by Raider

Originally posted by Oguzoglu Is "KIRALY" in the meaning of kingdom or king? King is also "kral" in Turkish.

Kir�ly means king, and kir�lys�g means kingdom. As much as I know this word has a slavic roots. Originally it came from the name of Charlemagne. (Karl, or Carolus) (Like the word tsar, kaiser, or cs�sz�r from the name of Caesar.) The medieval form was: ker�l.

The other country names are:

Erd�lyi Fejedelems�g = Principality of Transylvania (fejedelems�g is state under a sovereign prince)

Habsburg Birodalom = Habsburg Empire

(Birodalom means a large state, generally multi ethnic, but it is not necessery ruled by an emperor. 

Lengyel Kir�lys�g = Polish Kingdom

T�r�k Birodalom = Turkish Empire

Havasalf�ld = Wallachia

 

Edited by Raider

After the mid seventeenth century, all of the MAJOR actions were won by the Europeans.  In the West:

St. Gotthard (Raab), 1664

Vienna, 1683

Buda, 1686

Nagyharsany, 1687

Belgrade, 1688

Szalankemen, 1691

Zenta, 1697

Peterwardein, 1716

Belgrade, 1717

The prince of Transylvania, as an ally of the Turks, won a battle against the Austrians at Zernyest in 1690, but Transylvania was overrun by the end of that campaigning season.

Against Poland, The Turks took a number of towns, but in the three field engagements, John Sobieski won all of them at:

Chotyn, 1673

Lwow, 1675

Zorawno, 1676

I think Peter of Russia also was able to secure Azov in the 1690s, but I am not sure of the date.

Turkey had so many distractions along her long borders...Persia, Russia, Austria, Venice, that it is remarkable how resiliant the Ottoman state was.  This was a remarkable time also for the Austro-Germans with a succession of great commanders.....(maybe a result of the experience of the pevious generation in the Thirty Years War?)

The Turks' reputation as fierce fighters was never in doubt, but by the early eighteenth century, Turkish expansion in Europe was no longer a danger.

As far as their "privates," I'll abstain  

yep

About 30 thousand strong polish and cossack army faced about 130.000 strong Turkish army supported by about 60.000 Tatars.

Correct numbers are 110,000-120,000 ottoman army (including Tatars, Vallachians and Moldovians) and 55,000-65,000 polish/lithuanian-cossack army (Poles and Lithuanias 25,000-30,000 soldiers + 28,000-35,000 Zaphorozian Cossacks).

Look "Chocim 1621" by Leszek Podhorodecki

It was clear that superiority of numbers had been a major advantage for Ottomans but discipline is still important, as Hungarian heavily armored cavalry could have smashed the light armored ottoman infantry and cavalry among with the Janissaries if they hadnt applied the orders

What Hungarians made was also a reckless charge, they showed an unneeded sign of bravery,which ended in disaster. It was like Don Quixote attacking the mills