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September 11, 1973, Chile

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: September 11, 1973, Chile
    Posted: 06-Apr-2008 at 00:43

The September 11 was a sad day for my country long time before what happened in the U.S.

A morning of September in 1973, the Chilean military decided to stop the "experiment" of marxist president Salvador Allende Gossens. Allende, elected democratically but by small margin and minoritary support, was trying to imposse a "democratic way to socialism".

It is fair to say that Allende was a well meaned man, that tried to do the best for its people. But we should recognize he couldn't control its own partidaries. By the time of the coup, street fighting and political violence was widespread, inflation was reaching 500 yearly, and the economy was chaotic.

The conspiration of the right wing, the Nixon regime, the influence of the school of the Americas, and the ineficient control of its people, all worked together against Allende.
 
I was 14 years old at the time, and I witness the events directly. I even saw with my very eyes the planes attacking the presidential house. I also listened in direct the last speach of Salvador Allende at the radio.
 
Allende dieying defending its right to be President and Democracy. He never resign, although he had the chance to escape alived from the situation. He decided to stand against the gorillas and show them a lession of honour, and he did.
 
What followed is very well known, during the years after the coup 4000 chileans were killed by the military repression. Hundred of thousand were tortured and at least a million (10% of the population) took refuge abroad. Chile was never again the same after those events, and in a very real sense, the gorilla destroyed our innocent nature of the past.
 
It is sad to remember this events. I am not ashamed of my country, but only of the bunch of brutes that took power that time. We got rid of them, and humilliated them. Chile recovered its democratic nature that has always had. However, the 11 of September is still a sad and very present event in our memories.

Pictures:

President Salvador Allende
 
The coup:
 
Military threatening to crash theirs oponents with a tank

Concentration camp in a stadium
 
 
Presidential palace bombarded. The Chilean presidential flag was still in place.
 
 
 
 
Gorilla at coup time
 
 
 
The gorilla in power
 
 
Victor Jara, musician, tortured and murdered during the coup
 
 
Curious picture of two Gorillas: Castro and Pinochet, during the visit of Cuban dictator to Chile, a while ago before the coup.
 
 
Statue honoring Salvador Allende, that is today just in front of the presidential palace.
 
 
 
 
 


Edited by pinguin - 06-Apr-2008 at 00:45
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  Quote ulrich von hutten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 11:04
Originally posted by pinguin

  

I was 14 years old at the time, and I witness the events directly.  events, and in a very real sense, the gorilla destroyed our innocent nature of the past.
 
 
Like i was then. I can remember the day, when me and my family listened to the radio, and my father, a socialist, started to cry. I was impressed, cause i hadn't seen my dad craying before. My dad told me, to pay attention to the political events on the earth and not to stop, shouting out against dictatorship and oppression.
 
 
 
 
  
 
 
 
 
 
  
 
 
 
  
 

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  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 13:05
Lets hope the next Chilean coup is a little less brutal than the last one.
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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 13:59
Just a question. Did this coup set a precedent for Chile, or did Chile already have an established history of political violence and instability?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 15:09
Originally posted by ulrich von hutten

Like i was then. I can remember the day, when me and my family listened to the radio, and my father, a socialist, started to cry. I was impressed, cause i hadn't seen my dad craying before. My dad told me, to pay attention to the political events on the earth and not to stop, shouting out against dictatorship and oppression.
 
Very interesting, Ulrich.
 
Do you mean you and your family where listening to these events in Europe, alive?
 
I never imagined that. I had the impression we were completely isolated during the coup.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 15:09
Originally posted by Paul

Lets hope the next Chilean coup is a little less brutal than the last one.
 
There won't be a next Chilean coup.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 15:21
Originally posted by Constantine XI

Just a question. Did this coup set a precedent for Chile, or did Chile already have an established history of political violence and instability?
 
Only during the 19th century something similar happened, when the President and the Congress have a civil war on constitutional matters. However, during the 20th century, although not completely peaceful, Chile was very estable all the time, which the exception of this coup.
 
This coup was an unique and very shameful event. That's why Chileans insisted in punish and humilliate the responsable. Many militaries of the time are in jail right now, and others have commited suicide. Nobody support theirs actions and are considered thugs by the average Chilean.
 
Chileans also target the U.S. because its involvement in the coup, and the old comunist satellite movements from Russia, because they were the starters of what happened here.
 
Not long ago, one U.S. agent that intervined in the chilean coup was reached by Chilean reporters in his modest house in the U.S.. The man was really terrified of been contacted, and refused to talk. He revealed like a coward. It was something very shameful for people that produced so much pain.
 
 
 
 
 


Edited by pinguin - 07-Apr-2008 at 15:24
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  Quote ulrich von hutten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 15:36
Originally posted by pinguin

Originally posted by ulrich von hutten

Like i was then. I can remember the day, when me and my family listened to the radio, and my father, a socialist, started to cry. I was impressed, cause i hadn't seen my dad craying before. My dad told me, to pay attention to the political events on the earth and not to stop, shouting out against dictatorship and oppression.
 
Very interesting, Ulrich.
 
Do you mean you and your family where listening to these events in Europe, alive?
 
I never imagined that. I had the impression we were completely isolated during the coup.
 
 
yes, there was a german reporter at a hotel in santiago who discribed the situation in chile's capital then. At that evening, my dad, my elder brother and i went to a rally in our hometown, to show our solidarity to the Chilean people.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 16:00
Originally posted by ulrich von hutten

...
yes, there was a german reporter at a hotel in santiago who discribed the situation in chile's capital then. At that evening, my dad, my elder brother and i went to a rally in our hometown, to show our solidarity to the Chilean people.
 
In the name of the Chilean people, trapped at that coup, I thanks you, your dad and brother, sincerely. You can't imagine how important for Chilean people of those times was to know somebody cared about us from abroad.
 
Besides, I really admire the courage of those reporters that sent the pictures abroad. That was some of the most dangerous tasks imaginable. And, without those records, perhaps things would have been covered up.
 
 


Edited by pinguin - 07-Apr-2008 at 16:01
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  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 16:07
Originally posted by pinguin

Originally posted by Paul

Lets hope the next Chilean coup is a little less brutal than the last one.
 
There won't be a next Chilean coup.
 
If i had a penny for everyone in Thailand who said the same to me, when I told them there would be another.
 
Of course Chileans will have another fascist dictatoriship, it's in their blood.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 16:44
Originally posted by Paul

If i had a penny for everyone in Thailand who said the same to me, when I told them there would be another.
 
Of course Chileans will have another fascist dictatoriship, it's in their blood.
 
I better ignore you, Paul.
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  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 17:08

The coup was coming regarless of what people said. The polarization was just too much during those days, at least this is what I got from reading, and Chile was on its way to a civil war if the coup didn't happen.

 
Anyway Pinguin, good job, 5000 posts Clap.
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 18:26
The ironic thing is that supporters of Pinochet often claim it 'saved Chile from a dictatorship'. Apart from the fact that Pinochet in fact imposed a dictatorship and killed the oldest and traditionally most stable democracy in Latin America, it is absolutely untrue that Allende was turning the country into a dictatorship. One has to admit that his economic policies were not always wise, but he didn't take a single measure that made Chile less democratic.

In fact I think a lot of the political unrest and guerilla wars in Latin America in the 1970's and 1980's was actually caused by the 1973 coup in Chile. The oligarchy had made it clear that they would not accept a democratic socialist government, so socialists could just as well try it the armed way.

Of course Chileans will have another fascist dictatoriship, it's in their blood.

I have to diagree with you there. Pinochet is actually an aberration in Chilean history. Apart from the first half of the 19th century and to a lesser degree the 1920s and 30s Chile has never seen much coups or dictatorships. Apart from Costa Rica and perhaps Uruguay Chile has always been the most democratic and stable country of Latin America. It also is one of the wealthiest and (by far) the least corrupt country of the region. If there is one Latin American country where a fallback to gorilla politics is not to be expected it is Chile.

On the downside it appears that Chile also has the most nazis of South America.


Edited by Mixcoatl - 07-Apr-2008 at 18:31
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  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 18:36
How many dictatorships have there been in North America? If you compare Chileans to other South Americans they are no more bloodthirsty, but if you compare them to North Americans they are pretty barbaric.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 19:54
Originally posted by Paul

How many dictatorships have there been in North America? If you compare Chileans to other South Americans they are no more bloodthirsty, but if you compare them to North Americans they are pretty barbaric.
 
Paul, I am ignoring you. Look for psyco help somewhere else, please Confused
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 19:57
Originally posted by Al Jassas

The coup was coming regarless of what people said. The polarization was just too much during those days, at least this is what I got from reading, and Chile was on its way to a civil war if the coup didn't happen.

 
Anyway Pinguin, good job, 5000 posts Clap.
 
AL-Jassas
 
Thanks Al Jassas to remember my 5K posts LOL
 
I really don't know to agree or not. In fact, a plebiscite was going to be called in a short time to decide if Allende continued or not. It is suspected the coup was hurried it up before that event happened. In any case, yes, I agree the situation was very bad at those times and that something dramatic was going to happened.
 
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2008 at 20:02
Originally posted by Mixcoatl

The ironic thing is that supporters of Pinochet often claim it 'saved Chile from a dictatorship'. Apart from the fact that Pinochet in fact imposed a dictatorship and killed the oldest and traditionally most stable democracy in Latin America, it is absolutely untrue that Allende was turning the country into a dictatorship. One has to admit that his economic policies were not always wise, but he didn't take a single measure that made Chile less democratic.
 
I agree

Originally posted by Mixcoatl


In fact I think a lot of the political unrest and guerilla wars in Latin America in the 1970's and 1980's was actually caused by the 1973 coup in Chile. The oligarchy had made it clear that they would not accept a democratic socialist government, so socialists could just as well try it the armed way.
 
I don't agree on that. There were lots of coups in the region, and guerrilla fighting as well, long before the chilean coup. I see it as just an event more in a throubled region.

Originally posted by Mixcoatl


Of course Chileans will have another fascist dictatoriship, it's in their blood.

I have to diagree with you there. Pinochet is actually an aberration in Chilean history. Apart from the first half of the 19th century and to a lesser degree the 1920s and 30s Chile has never seen much coups or dictatorships. Apart from Costa Rica and perhaps Uruguay Chile has always been the most democratic and stable country of Latin America. It also is one of the wealthiest and (by far) the least corrupt country of the region. If there is one Latin American country where a fallback to gorilla politics is not to be expected it is Chile.
 
Absolutely.
Originally posted by Mixcoatl


On the downside it appears that Chile also has the most nazis of South America.
 
They have always existed, but they are a very small minority.
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  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2008 at 10:38
Wow, way out of line there Paul. I think you should relax it a bit.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2008 at 11:15
Second that.
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2008 at 11:35
An old colleague of mine at IPC in the 'sixties (he was development director, I was manpower development director), Stafford Beer, was hired by Allende in 1970 to set up a 'cybernetic' system for running the country's economy
 
Given the clashes I had with him at IPC (nice guy, out of touch with reality) it's probably better for Chile that the system he was developing never got introduced. It's just a pity that the baby (democracy) was thrown out along with the bathwater (cybernetic control of economic systems).
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