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Lord Ram's existence----true or false.
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Guests 
Guest 
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 Topic: Lord Ram's existence----true or false.Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 09:10 |
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present Ramsetu episode in Indian politics have made certain pseudoseculaists raising doubts about Rams existence.From a historical pointof view how could Ram's existence could be proved .
Kachwaha clan (rulers of Jaipur ) claims Ram to be their ancestor . andtold to have migrated from Ayodhya to jaipur region.Moreover Guru Nanak was also told to be descendant of Ram and was a kshatriya.
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Omar al Hashim
King 
Suspended Joined: 05-Jan-2006 Online Status: Offline Posts: 5697 |
Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 09:56 |
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As this topic has the potential to get out of hand, be aware it is being closely watched.
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ashokharsana
Consul 
Joined: 05-Aug-2006 Location: India Online Status: Offline Posts: 342 |
Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 12:28 |
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What about Bargujjars then ?
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The Real Ranas, The Real Emperors of India. http://ashokharsana.proboards107.com/index.cgi?board=gurjars
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AP Singh
Earl 
Joined: 05-Sep-2006 Location: India Online Status: Offline Posts: 283 |
Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 13:36 |
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The Gujjars of Pratihar Gotra are said to be the direct descendent of Lord Rama. Please see the 9th. century historical records (stone inscriptions) in the following research papers.
Cuchwahas have stolen this Gujjars story when they achieved power by serving in Mughal courts and Gujjars were suppressed. The Bargujjars ( The Gujjars of Bara who ruled over Alwar during Gujjar Empire)are also of Pratihars gotra of Gujjars and started calling themselves as Rajputs of Sikarwars gotra to hide their real identity to save their lives from Mughal army since they refused to give their daughter to Mughals). The Mathan Deva stone inscriptions are found in Alwar to prove the fact and during Mughals period only Alwar was given to Cuchwahas.
The Leva are said to be son of Lava and Kharis are said to be the son of Kusha) which are two divisions of Gujjars even today and you wont find them in Cuchwahas). Cuchwahs are the descendents of Nishad Raj Raja Nala and under the Gujjar Pratihar Empire were serving as Vassals of Gujjar Chauhans for their Gujjar Pratihar overlords.
The East India Company ( Not the British scholars like Dr. Hoernle) extended support to this claim of Cuchwahas under their well known scheme of divide and rule and the whole history of Gujjars is written by employees of this Company in the name of Rajputs (to make the issue controversial), the name which could not be found to be used for rulers in any historical records before the arrival of Mughals.
Poet Raj Shekhar also have written about this fact, in his poetry written, in the praise of Gujjar Emperor, MahiPal.
Edited by AP Singh - 13-Dec-2007 at 13:40 |
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Vorian
Colonel 
Joined: 06-Dec-2007 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 566 |
Posted: 13-Dec-2007 at 21:16 |
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Who is Ram?
(For us completely ignorant of Indian history?) |
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ashokharsana
Consul
Joined: 05-Aug-2006 Location: India Online Status: Offline Posts: 342 |
Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 04:14 |
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Right AP Bhai,
But The bargujjar royal families still proudly call theselves Gujjars.
Princess Niharika Singh,
daughter of King Ranjeet Singh Judeo of Samthar (MP),
daughter in law of Vasundhra Raje Scindhia (CM of Rajasthan)
played a crucial role during the Gujjar agitation in Rajasthan and she was the main factor responsible for the compromise between Gurjars and the Rajasthan Govt.
And the other bargujjar royal family of Jashpur also claims to be pure Gujjars. Dileep Singh Judeo, from this family, attended the Gurjars summit in Dec, 2006 and also presented a powerful speech in support of Gujjar union. He is present in most of the gujjar meets.
This means whoever claims Bargujjars to be Rajputs is not aware of the history (and current affairs as well).
Regards Edited by ashokharsana - 14-Dec-2007 at 04:21 |
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The Real Ranas, The Real Emperors of India. http://ashokharsana.proboards107.com/index.cgi?board=gurjars
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Leonidas
Tsar 
Joined: 01-Oct-2005 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 4613 |
Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 09:17 |
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jayeshks
Earl
Joined: 04-May-2005 Location: Canada Online Status: Offline Posts: 281 |
Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 13:47 |
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Ram is the hero of the ancient Indian epic Ramayana (composed circa 500 BC). He was a king who was exiled to a forest where his wife was abducted by the king of Lanka. He eventually rescues her back with the help of a monkey army and returns to his kingdom to rule as king. It was originally an allegory transmitting philosophical teachings on how to become an ideal man (Ram) and woman (his wife Sita) and the triumph of good over evil. Over time the tale took on more overtly religious tones in future retellings. Ram and Sita were emphasized as being incarnations of the Hindu gods Vishnu and Lakshmi and the king of Lanka was emphasized as a demon (a Hades like figure actually). This has all come under scrutiny of late because there exists a submerged sliver of land (called the Adam's Bridge or Ram Setu) connecting South India with Sri Lanka which forces all ships travelling between the east and west coasts of India to have to go all the way around Sri Lanka first. The Indian govt. has approved a plan to build a canal which will destroy part of this bridge. The opposition party and several other groups contend that this is the man-made bridge mentioned in the Ramayana, constructed by Ram's army to facilitate the invasion of Lanka and is therefore a part of Indian heritage and should be off limits for construction. The govt. contends that the land bridge is a natural phenomenon and going through it would expedite shipping and provide a significant economic boost to the region. Edited by jayeshks - 14-Dec-2007 at 14:10 |
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Once you relinquish your freedom for the sake of "understood necessity,"...you cede your claim to the truth. - Heda Margolius Kovaly
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Vorian
Colonel
Joined: 06-Dec-2007 Location: Greece/Hellas Online Status: Offline Posts: 566 |
Posted: 14-Dec-2007 at 13:58 |
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I see, thank you very much.
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ashokharsana
Consul
Joined: 05-Aug-2006 Location: India Online Status: Offline Posts: 342 |
Posted: 15-Dec-2007 at 03:11 |
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What if I prove Ramayana to be a real story.
Though Ram was not any incarnation of Visnu. He was just a member of the most celebrated (and most probabaly the first ruling family of the earth.) royal family of India "The Suryavanshis".
Ramayana is a true story (except some of its parts which were added very lately).
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The Real Ranas, The Real Emperors of India. http://ashokharsana.proboards107.com/index.cgi?board=gurjars
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 18-Dec-2007 at 10:54 |
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totally wrong , bargujjars are darogas/ ravanas, an OBC community in rajasthan . they are the illegitimate offsprings of rajputs . earlier and somewhere even to this day the maid servants in rajput household belong to a particular community called darogas and the children of these maid servants fathered by rajput men are called as darogas . These darogas are the ones who are badgujjars. they even write badgujjars as their surname . these people are now in the OBC list . and originally it were the gujjaris and jatnis who used to accompany the rajput bride to her new home as domestic help . and it the children of these servants fathered by rajput men who have come to known as present day bargujjars. when kachwahas came to jaipur region this area was controlled by the meenas , a scheduled tribe of present day and notorious along with gujjars for stealing and robberies before independence .kuchwahas defeated these meenas and became the rulers. of this area also known as dundahar region comprising present day jaipur , dausa and alwar district . the alwar was a part of jaipur kingdom till 19 th century when the Naruka division of kachwahas claimed independence and formed the new princely state of Alwar and ruled it till independence and Narukas , members of royal family of Alwar are still there and have been M.P and M.L.A's from Alwar . Bhanwar Jitendra singh Naruka , scion of Alwar is a M.L.A from alwar city .
gujjars never inhabitated Alwar and gujjar population is missing from present Alwar district . as for as muslim population of Alwar and adjoining Bharatpur district is concerned they are known as Mews. and this area after them is also known as Mewat. Most of them themselves claim that they were rajputs before mughals came . they were always at loggerhead with mughals and were famous for guireela type attacks on outscirts of Delhi . it was their continued opposition of mughals that costed heavily to them and later on they were lured to Islam .
Even during present gujjar agitation for S.T status , some mews claimed that at least 10% of mews were meenas previously . amd hence demanded scheduled tribe status like meenas and also opposed gujjars demand .This very well proves that mews were never gujjars.
the chopra commission , constituted for looking into the demands of gujjars for S.T reservation has also cosidered the gujjars of jaipur region adjoining to alwar as the most backward of already backward gujjars of entire rajasthan.and recommended special treatment to them by government . So, how could these gujjars almost qualifying to be schdeuled tribe, that is sharing the same berth with nishads and other adiwasis (tribals), be rulers or descendants of royal family of Ayodhya.
Niharika singh , daughter in law of vasundhara Raje, C.M of rajasthan didn't have any role in solving gujjar crisis. she was simply there when gujjar representative came to meet C.M in june this year. gujjars are not that fool to give their agitation on request of Niharika singh . they will be content only after moving to S.T category ,their right place in the history Edited by ranaharra - 18-Dec-2007 at 11:29 |
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 18-Dec-2007 at 11:33 |
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This is going to be moved. To the theology section.
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aryanababa
Immortal Guard 
Joined: 12-Sep-2006 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
Posted: 18-Dec-2007 at 19:39 |
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Please.... .........this is not Gujjar forums, Post your gujjar related wrong/MISLEADING information somewhere else. I would prefer to see comment related to thread. Administrators please watch this guy and his intentions.
Edited by aryanababa - 18-Dec-2007 at 19:46 |
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 18-Dec-2007 at 19:55 |
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Gujjar-Rajput relations; blacklisted.
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 07-Aug-2008 at 07:35 |
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remove postings by ashok harijuana where are the moderators
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red clay
Administrator 
Tomato Master Emeritus Joined: 14-Jan-2006 Online Status: Offline Posts: 10226 |
Posted: 07-Aug-2008 at 11:18 |
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Right here, knucklehead. Thread closed.
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"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown. |
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