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TheDiplomat
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Topic: Globalization or Americanization? Posted: 25-Feb-2005 at 07:08 |
The entire world watches Holywood,the world listens to MTV.The world drinks coca-cola.The world wears blue-jeans.The world tries to live in the way the american TV programmes portray.The world speaks their language....
Are we really globalised?or Americanized?
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Aristoteles
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Posted: 25-Feb-2005 at 07:50 |
Most of the "world" is way past the Americanization-trend. Everybody that had that struck in the previous decades, that is. The word of day, culture-wise, is localisation, except the movies, of course. Hollyweird is dominant, period.
Sure, Coke and McDs exist everywhere, but that doesn't mean people are just trying to immitate the Yanks and that's why they drink coke and eat junk food.
Was it so, people in Greece would grow fat eating TV dinners in front of the soapbox... while in truth we are merrily drinking wine in Tavernes
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eaglecap
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Posted: 27-Feb-2005 at 13:44 |
I was saddened to see so much Americanization in Greece when I first visited it in 1998. I remember when I was in Meteora I was talking to a young Greek girl (14) and she was upset when I told her what I thought about Michael jackson. She seemed to worship him and she could not stand to hear the truth. The kids dressed and looked like American teens and I saw a culture disapearing or maybe evolving depending on your perspective. I saw the same in Ireland with the American rock in the pubs rather than Irish folk music, I am a wee bit Irish- 1/16.
I like the term for the people that many of us idolize from Michael Savage on the Savage Nation show-"Hollywood idiots."
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Tobodai
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Posted: 27-Feb-2005 at 16:48 |
its globalization becauser it hasnt always been amreican...in the ancient world it was Egypt, in the 19th century Britain and Germany and France....its a constant and neverending fact of life.
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"the people are nothing but a great beast...
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Turk
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Posted: 01-Mar-2005 at 05:14 |
I don't think Hollywood has much to do with it, people watch good
movies. Movies in most countries are a joke compared to the ones here.
The world and America both will become whatever the big corporations
running the game want them to...In America, corporations are much more
powerful than the government. American capitalism sucks.
But ultimately there's no way America can uproot established cultures
and countries in their way of life. Third world countries are
much easier to influence however (ex. the Arab population. I
don't care how many "radicals" you think you see on TV,
they're just a reaction to the worshipping of American culture done by
the Arab population, especially teenagers).
Or you could take into account the enormous popularity of martial arts,
philosophy, and culture of East Asia in America into account. I believe
globalisation ultimately refers to the abundance of information more
and more accessable to the rest of the world. It's up to you what
pieces of information you want to believe.
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Degredado
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Posted: 02-Mar-2005 at 13:57 |
The trend of fake boobies is something that should be spread. And I don't rely too much on MTV for my music selection.
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Cywr
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Posted: 02-Mar-2005 at 14:11 |
In the Netherlands, everyone eats shoarma and Gyros and pasta, they are clearly being Mediteraneanised
MTV is highly localised, with regional even national varients, MTV is
smart enough to realise that a bland one American size fits all will
only get itself so far.
And fashion is too, highly localised, i see slightly different trends here in the UK than in the Netherlands.
To call it all Americanisation is simplsitic, misleading, and dishonest, some of it is, but alot of it isn't.
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TheDiplomat
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Posted: 04-Mar-2005 at 06:51 |
Originally posted by Cywr
In the Netherlands, everyone eats shoarma and Gyros and pasta, they are clearly being Mediteraneanised MTV is highly localised, with regional even national varients, MTV is smart enough to realise that a bland one American size fits all will only get itself so far. And fashion is too, highly localised, i see slightly different trends here in the UK than in the Netherlands. To call it all Americanisation is simplsitic, misleading, and dishonest, some of it is, but alot of it isn't.
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For this debate,open the windows of your mind.
You can eat gyros in netherlands but what about Peru?or Indonesia?we are debating it the global perspective on this thread.Not in the axis of The netharlands-The UK.
in each part of the world,everyone belonging to the new generation knows 50 cent,britney spears,mario,beyonce etc..Many youngsters spend their lifetime for following their lifestyles..their songs...their life stories...learning their dance figures.
ofcourse hollywood makes the best movies...nothing is wrong with that...this point has not been argued in the negative sense.but do not foget %90 of the market is owned by hollywood.This means all eyes and brains are focused on there...as many would agree,cinema has a fascinating effect on people.it is fascinating because we are not aware of its effect for many times...it contributes many things to understandings,trends,as well as to the pop-culture...we have started to think in the way an American thinks.
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Cywr
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Posted: 04-Mar-2005 at 21:23 |
So its a matter of non-hollywood and non-American music making further inroads globaly, which it is.
Globalisation maybe dominated in certain niches by America, but it has
alowed for other countries to have greater reach outside their own
borders. One of the main reasons for the US's dominance is that it is
one of the first countries to truely realise the potential of global
communications, other countries are joining the bandwagon. How often
would you see a Chinese movie in a regular British cinema 20 years ago?
And how often today?
There are more players on the scene, and the numbers grow.
20 years from now, the Dutch maybe sick of Gyros and prefer Ghanian fish stew instead, who knows.
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Kalevipoeg
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Posted: 05-Mar-2005 at 12:39 |
"The entire world watches Holywood,the world listens to MTV.The world drinks coca-cola.The world wears blue-jeans.The world tries to live in the way the american TV programmes portray.The world speaks their language....
Are we really globalised?or Americanized"?
I don't watch MTV, I don't drink coca-cola, because it makes my teeth chalky and it feels like i am sanding them after drinking when i touch them with my tongue. I don't wear blue-jeans, because i think they are gey and i don't eat at McDonald's, because there is nothing to eat there. I don't think that i am thinking like an American very much, but maybe we don't know how we think anyway.
And i don't think American movies are the best, they are just the ones that are getting all of the oscars.
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cattus
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Posted: 05-Mar-2005 at 15:44 |
As an american, i cant help but notice how much of the US has infiltrated other cultures when i go abroad.
It makes me sad to go to other countries and see places i dont go to here popping up like mushrooms such as
McDonalds,KFC and Starbucks. Something is strange about going to the most remote places and the locals know more about american prime time tv than i do.
Dont like Hollywood because out of a country of 300 million it usually exports the spoiled,the flashy,the plastic and the California.
The world is getting smaller like Cywr said and perhaps this will change. Maybe get worse? Hope not.
To note, i think a cheesebuger at the Hard Rock Cafe in Barcelona once saved my life.
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Tobodai
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Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 03:02 |
from the dawn of empires to the modern day and into the future globalization will and always has been whats for the best, even if its soimetimes jarring and temporarily threratening.
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Spartakus
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Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 13:02 |
Originally posted by eaglecap
I was saddened to see so much Americanization in Greece when I first visited it in 1998. I remember when I was in Meteora I was talking to a young Greek girl (14) and she was upset when I told her what I thought about Michael jackson. She seemed to worship him and she could not stand to hear the truth. The kids dressed and looked like American teens and I saw a culture disapearing or maybe evolving depending on your perspective. I saw the same in Ireland with the American rock in the pubs rather than Irish folk music, I am a wee bit Irish- 1/16. I like the term for the people that many of us idolize from Michael Savage on the Savage Nation show-"Hollywood idiots." |
Permit me to disagree.The truth is what Aristoteles said.In Hellas there are many people who listen to foreign music like myself but there much more who like to hear Hellen singers.Young people,who are the most influenced by anything, may see American movies but their ideology is not an American one.It may be influenced but noboby can claim that is Americanized.The truth is that today Hellas is more European than an American one.Why do you think we stopped buying American weapons in the extent that we used to in the past????
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Spartakus
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Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 13:04 |
I believe that globalization is older than we think it is.It does not have to do only with America.
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--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996)
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Guests
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Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 13:55 |
I think the world is being americanised today. Just look at the youth, or tv, or the names of the shops in your street. Why do we learn and use English as an international communication language? Americanization is everywhere. Maybe you could be a non drinker of coke, but %90 of the world population drinks. There are Mcdonads even in American enemy countries. Maybe you wouldnt wear jeans, but most of the world population have at least one jeans and wears it oftenly, since it is fit, sport and fashionable of American lifestyle...
I watched a TV program that shows the medicine sell ratings in some developing countries such as some African ones and India, which has a big eastern civilized population. But what do they use most as beauty medicine? Gues what? Skin whitening creams... Even wearing, speaking and behaving like an American isnt enough for uneducated youth of developing countries. They are even trying to physically look like the singers they watch in MTV, or the superhero they watch in a movie... Look at Matrix series, and other Hollywood productions... You like them or not, most of the people at least know about lots of them... They can have better sceneries and high tech equipment use than other world movies since they are Hollywood productions, and huge budgets. American dominiance... But what do they teach? Arent they simply propogandas?
I guess everyone realizes what I'm talking about...
Edited by Oguzoglu
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Cywr
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Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 20:22 |
Jeans originated in France, and i really doubt 90% of the world drinks coke.
As for singers, black American singers are by far the most popular in
Africa, and India still likes its own music more than that of America,
so a lot of that is purely cliches. Hell, to include India in there is
dumb, India is a powerhouse of music and movies and is making inroads
into other countries, in many parts of Asia, expecialy south Asia, it
is not Hollywood that is dominant, but Bollywood.
What alot of people site as examples of American cultural dominance,
are just symbols of American economic dominance. Yes, the US is
economicly domiant, its the world's largest economy, the two tend to go
hand in hand somewhat.
But coca-cola isn't 'culture' its just a product, Jeans isn't
'culture', its a material that is used in a whole variet of different
styles all over the planet. Yes, in money terms, Hollywood is the
biggest, but if we were to measure it in terms of how many people watch
a particular movie, then Bollywood is king, and Hollywood is
increasingly depentand on non-Americans to makes its movies, whether
for fresh ideas, or experience in other genres/areas or whatever.
And so what if i can find Mcdonalds allover the planet, i can find
Chinese restauraunts all over the planet too, and where as McD's is
virtualy stagnent in many countries (indeed a think a short while back
their number of resturaunts actualy declined for the first time ever),
Chinese (and other) resturaunts are poping up everywhere.
Edited by Cywr
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Tobodai
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Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 21:54 |
if archeologists were to dig up modern day America they would assume that there was a massive Asian invasion of both coastlines in terms of stores, restaurants, and martial arts places. All cross cultural exchange is more than one way and all of it is beneficial.
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"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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coolstorm
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Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 01:38 |
The entire world watches Holywood,the world listens to MTV.The world drinks coca-cola.The world wears blue-jeans.The world tries to live in the way the american TV programmes portray.The world speaks their language....
Are we really globalised?or Americanized? |
The entire world except for America doesn't watch American football, doesn't like ice hockey as much, doesn't buy guns at walmart, doesn't believe in everything the media says.
most part of the world doesn't eat pizzas as dinner, doesn't get speeding tickets on a monthly basis because the government needs money to go to war, doesn't speak only one language, doesn't know nothing about other countries, doesn't drive cars that don't turn, doesn't recieve spams everyday.
most part of the world does care about other countries, does try to learn about other countries and other languages, does know something about others.
there are things that everyone does including the americans but there are also lots of things that people don't do except for the americans.
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Guests
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Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 10:34 |
Americanization is just a chapter of a long process of globalization started 500 years ago. In fact, Arnold Toynbee splited universal history in 2 diferent eras: pre-gamic and gamic era. He said that the first attempt to set up a global relashionship between all significant regions of the planet was produced by the portuguese in 1498
But even before the "gamic era", thers many evidences of attempts to create a kind of universal acceptance of a single civilization. For exemple, aramaic language was an "universal language" of comunication for middle east peoples before the rise of "helenistic world", when the greeck became an ID for "civilized people. The same phenomena happened around the beginning of our era (a.C), with the introdution of latin institutions (and language) on western and eastern Europe, including north africa. If you visit a small roman village in Marocco or england the resamblances are quite surprising. People from different ethnic groups, regions and backgrounds lived according the same style, with similar institutions, habits and belives. On European 16 th and 17 th centuries, spanish culture was the reference, and during 18 th and 19 th centuries french culture was essential for a "gentleman". The prominence of anglo-saxonic its recent, dating from 20th century, mainly after second world war.
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Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 10:36 |
So how do you define culture cywr? American culture is all over the world, terminating smaller or poorer cultures by its global dominiance... The truth hurts...
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