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Topic: Effects of the Arab Revolt on Turkish Defeat Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 06:46 |
So what do the esteemed members think about its effects, did it have a tangible contribution to the Turkish collaspse of 1917-18? Or was it just another irritant or maybe a symptom not a cause of the end of the Ottomon Empire.
Opinions?
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Lmprs
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 07:05 |
From Lawrence of Arabia, one of my favourite movies:
General Murray: [on the Arab Revolt] It's a storm in a tea cup, Mr. Dryden - a sideshow. If you want my own opinion, this whole theater of operations is a sideshow! The real war's not being fought against the Turks, but the Germans. And not here, but on the Western front in the trenches! Your Bedouin Army - or whatever it calls itself - would be a sideshow of a sideshow!
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 07:09 |
A movie? IMO it did play a role, there was a great reduction in manpower available to the Turks.
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mamikon
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 07:40 |
Ottoman Empire sustained barely 300,000 death as a result of the war, about 4-5 times less than the other world powers you cant help but notice that General Murray could be right
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Lmprs
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 08:07 |
Between 1914 and 1918, Ottoman Empire suffered 800,000 military casualties, more than the combined casualties of UK and USA during the Second World War.
But most of them were either killed in Dardanelles or Eastern Anatolia, I think. Arab revolt was carried out by a few thousand irregular cavalries.
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Evrenosgazi
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 11:56 |
The arab revolt was a general revolt, they hit the ottomans from their supply lines and back. Like the armenian in eastern anatolia. So they effected the war.
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mamikon
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 15:32 |
Except Armenians did not revolt....but thank you for opening the pandora's box.
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 15:56 |
Thats a banned topic remember?
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Lmprs
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 17:35 |
Originally posted by Evrenosgazi
The arab revolt was a general revolt, they hit the ottomans from their supply lines and back. |
Did Ottoman army have any major garrison in Arabian peninsula? Arabs may have sabotaged some railroads etc., but I don't think it's that significant.
British army could eventually beat Ottoman Turks without Arabic support, whereas Turks could crush Arab revolt if it wasn't sponsored by the British. What's the big deal then?
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mamikon
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 17:47 |
Originally posted by Feanor
Between 1914 and 1918, Ottoman Empire suffered 800,000 military
casualties, more than the combined casualties of UK and USA during the
Second World War.
But most of them were either killed in Dardanelles or Eastern
Anatolia, I think. Arab revolt was carried out by a few thousand
irregular cavalries. |
True, military casualties did reach 800,000 thats why I referred to the actual number of death http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I_casualties#_note-21scroll down to footnotes: 22 but you are wrong about Britain suffering less losses http://www.ysursa.com/history/West%20Civ/Textbook/WWI-casualties.htmhttp://europeanhistory.about.com/library/weekly/blww1castable.htmhttp://www.worldwar1.com/tlcrates.htm
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Lmprs
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 18:01 |
Originally posted by mamikon
but you are wrong about Britain suffering less losses |
Originally posted by Feanor
...more than the combined casualties of UK and USA during the Second World War. |
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mamikon
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Posted: 09-Aug-2007 at 18:10 |
ah true, I misread, pardon
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 07:03 |
The Arab revolt's semed to have occured at just the wrong time for the Ottomons. Say what you will about the Armenian issue (and please remember that topic is still blacklisted) the Turks reacted quickly and decicivly to it. Not the case with the Arab Revolt.
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mamikon
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 11:48 |
Thats because the Arab revolt was an actual revolt. They were also relatively far away from Anatolia and also had low Turkish population in the vicinity. They also had a far greater number of men who were armed and could oppose the Turkish army with relatively small foreign assistance. And don't forget, they also had the advantage of being muslim...
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 12:03 |
Being muslim has never helped anybody, ask the Bengalis, you can simply declare the acts unislamic.
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Al Jassas
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 13:29 |
Hello to You all.
Well, the effect of the Arab revolt is a matter of controversy. On the one hand, it was a stab in the back of the Turks that diverted their resources from the main battlefields of eastern Anatolia and Iraq. On the other hand, the revolt was not as big as it has been portrayed. Sherif Hussain (the real leader of the revolt) and his sons rallied the Arab tribes (my own tribe was one of them) of Hijaz, Syria and Iraq to join a revolt against the bloody Turks. Now no matter was has been said, the only reason for these tribes to join this revolt was money and booty. The sheikhs and the general population were far too preoccupied with making a living in those terrible days than to have the luxury of which state to support and what form of government to choose. The Sherif took advantage of their need and urged them to revolt promising them wealth, booty and revenge from the Turks whom some of the tribes had old vendettas. Despite that, the Turks were not stupid and immediately know the effect these tribes might have and made shore that they also benefit from them as well and they succeeded. In Iraq for example the Turks successfully made the shia religious authorities issue fatwas for the tribes to fight against the British and they succeeded in gathering many tribes under their umbrella and those tribes made impressive victories early in the campaign. Also in Arabia one of the biggest tribes there Shammar which was loyal to their leader who was at the same time the prince of Hail sided with the Turks against both Abdul Aziz ibn Saud (who took part in the revolt a fact that few know) and Sherif Hussain. Sherif Hussain would have definitely lost early on in the revolt if it werent for the uncoordinated interference of ibn Saud who took Qassim the only province between him and Hail and had seriously threatened Hail several times though he couldnt occupy it. Later on ibn Saud will take Hijaz from Sherif Ali (Hessians son) without any objection from the British who abandoned their former ally. However, in my opinion the revolt did help divert the Turkish resources in a very large and underdeveloped theatre of operations instead of concerting their effort in fight the Brits successfully in Iraq.
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 15:08 |
Good post. So dose anyone have figures to show how many troops the Turks diverted to the Hijaz and other areas?
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mamikon
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 18:43 |
Originally posted by Sparten
Being muslim has never helped anybody, ask the Bengalis, you can simply declare the acts unislamic. |
ah but it does, in "muslim" empire at least, why do you think Kurds were "tolerated" after their "betrayel" in 1920 (except the fact that they were too disorganized to serioulsy challange the Ottoman Empire/Turkish Republic)
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Lmprs
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Posted: 10-Aug-2007 at 18:45 |
...
Edited by Feanor - 07-Oct-2008 at 10:10
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kurt
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Posted: 12-Aug-2007 at 07:07 |
Would the Ottomans have won the Middle Eastern front if the arabs hadn't revolted?
Furthermore, why did the Arabs join the British, after the caliph declared jihad on them?
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