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My god, your god, his god, her god...
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Bulldog View Drop Down
Caliph
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Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: My god, your god, his god, her god...
    Posted: 03-Jul-2007 at 14:39
I always have been puzzled by how a mono-theist can say, "well that's according to your God", or "my God says this but your God may say that".
Its actually pretty ironic when you think of it.
If were mono-thiest there can only be one God and different religions are different interpretations and paths, people of different religions cannot be following a "different" god, if there is a muslim, christian, jewish, hindu God that means there are many Gods so if your mono-thiest everybody is actually following God but in different forms suited to their setting.
 
What are your thoughts?


Edited by Bulldog - 03-Jul-2007 at 14:41
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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Aelfgifu View Drop Down
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Posts: 3387 		  Quote Aelfgifu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jul-2007 at 05:29
I think there may be two reasons that are of influence here:
 
Judaism originally was a polythestic religion, which evolved into a monotheistic one. At the time the oldest books (the pentateuch) were written, this proces was not fully completed yet, and you can see it in the texts. First there is an element of schizofreny (please do not take offence at the term...Wink) to God: there is the vengeful Jaweh, and the forgiving unnamed one, already one but not quite yet blended fully. But more importantly to your point: there is no denial of the existance of other gods. There is just a denial that these other gods are worth worshipping, or have any power. There are other gods, but they are the wrong gods. Baal is the most prominent one. It would be going way to far to say this idea is still around, but as the Old Testament literally gives quotes that there may be other gods, with other wills, keeps open the options for remarks as the one you quote, within Christianity and Judaism at least.
 
On the other hand, there is the much more modern 'enligthened' idea that different ideas from ones own have a right to exist. Having to accept that one persons thruth or belief may not be the same as anothers thruth or belief, without either being proveable wrong, makes it necessary to keep options open. To reconcile the idea that your belief is the right one (as one's religion tells one) with the knowledge that others have other beliefs just as strong, and with just as much right to exist (as one's twentieth-century educated mind tells one), the solution can only be that one's god does not have to be the same as another's god.
 
That is my personal opinion anyway... Wink


Edited by Aelfgifu - 04-Jul-2007 at 05:31

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Posts: 180 		  Quote Super Goat (^_^) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jul-2007 at 19:20
I always have been puzzled by how a mono-theist can say, "well that's according to your God", or "my God says this but your God may say that".

Most of the time it's being said in a sarcastic tone, and not that one person acknowledges the existance of another's god.
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Posts: 952 		  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jul-2007 at 19:31
Aha but their god is really Satan leading them astray.

Edited by Paul - 04-Jul-2007 at 19:31
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elenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 1457 		  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jul-2007 at 23:58
Yes, the "duality" of god has always been a problem for those that don't study their history. How people or gods can be good and bad at the same time only bothers those that have led a sheltered life.  
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Posts: 300 		  Quote Boreasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jul-2007 at 22:17
Originally posted by Paul

Aha but their god is really Satan leading them astray.


May their Feet go with them.
Be good or be gone.
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elenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 1457 		  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jul-2007 at 22:47
If one loses their head over such matters, about who rules, their head would be going in one way and their feet in another!
elenos
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Aster Thrax Eupator View Drop Down
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Posts: 1929 		  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jul-2007 at 19:43
I'm personally a PanDeist, so I would agree with Bulldog on this one. I and other PanDeists follow what Spinoza taught. I would agree that all mono-theistic gods are the same fundamentally, but so are all gods. Effectivley, god was formed from man's attempts to comprehend infinity and the infinate questioning of the natural world. This idea was given a face and cultural "limpets" which gave this "idea" a different form to each culture. For those who believe in the pursuit of knowledge such as I, Infinity and the vast amounts of knowledge to be explored are increadible and important. Thus, when stripping god down to it's fundamentals, the worship of infinity is plausable if the worship of knowledge is plausable - religious conflict is over the limpets and egos to which infinity and questioning have been given. To us Pan-Deists it's irrelivant- Theists of a particular faith are those who wish to worship infinty with it's origional cultural guise, Deists and Pan-Deists are those who wish to follow the core fundamentals and Atheists are those who choose the let the core fundamentals go and not venerate anything. Except that many atheists themselves follow what Richard Dawkins called "the Einstein religion" - the feeling of wonder that scientists get about the natural world - so that would, I suppose make them latent deists. I've actually written an article on Pan-Deism - is that appropriate for the magazine at all?
 
...Also, I know that all of this philosophical and religious stuff can be offensive, and if I have offended anyone, I mean no offense.
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elenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 1457 		  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jul-2007 at 21:25
Earl Astor said  "Also, I know that all of this philosophical and religious stuff can be offensive, and if I have offended anyone, I mean no offense."

Dont worry, whatever you say about religion will offend somebody! But if they get offended then you have an equal right to get offended about them putting down your ideas that are founded on logic, reason, research and dedication to knowing the truth.

If we took all the presently known facts about this world, and compared those "suspect" beliefs against the "conventional" beliefs then the usual suspects win hands down! What if "believers" in whatever were forbidden from using what "disbelievers" discovered about the world? All the modern technology that they take for granted would be taken away.


Edited by elenos - 15-Jul-2007 at 06:47
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Aster Thrax Eupator View Drop Down
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Posts: 1929 		  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 05:51
It's always been my conviction that - An intellectual's bookshelf should cancel itself out- in other words, constatly Machine-Gun your own beliefs and experiment with others. Read Nietze or Betrand Russel one minute, and the bible and the koran the next! It's the only way forward, experimentation!
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elenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 1457 		  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 06:47
Believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see!
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Aster Thrax Eupator View Drop Down
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Posts: 1929 		  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 18:53
Wise words, elenos, wise words... within moderation!
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Paul View Drop Down
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Posts: 952 		  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jul-2007 at 19:05
These fundermentalist moderationists...
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gcle2003 View Drop Down
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Posts: 7035 		  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jul-2007 at 08:34

Yes. I'm trying to decide whether they are preferable to moderate fundamentalists, but my head is spinning.
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elenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 1457 		  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jul-2007 at 09:14
Now I understand Paul's joke, good one mate!
elenos
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