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Sigmund Freud on sexual desire

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Kapikulu View Drop Down
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  Quote Kapikulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Sigmund Freud on sexual desire
    Posted: 06-Apr-2007 at 19:31

In the psychology classes I've taken before, we had a "Freudian" teacher...

From what I learned in those classes, Sigmund Freud had connected quite a lot of things to sexual desire...
 
For Freud, many things which we see unrelated with sexual desire in common sense, actually is related to the sexual desire people had towards the opposite gender.
 
I still find this "Freudian" style on sexual desire very weird and think it is somewhat too much "sexist"...
 
I, of course, is not a professional on the issue, but I would like to see it digged more so I can learn if it is really so, or if I am in kind of an illusion.. 
 
What is your opinion over this?


Edited by Kapikulu - 06-Apr-2007 at 19:32
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  Quote northpakistani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Apr-2007 at 23:52

There are many types of psychologists, with different perspectives. Today we look at things more from the cognitive  perspective, however a few decades ago, people were inclined to Freud's understanding: the psycho-analytical perspective. He believed that human behaviour (our actions) come from our basic instincts, the thoughts beneath our consciousness, which is our sub-conscious. He believed that dreams were symbolic of the soul's desire, our hidden passions and aggression are expressed through sexual energy.

Today, cognitive psychology disregards some of Freud's perspectives as exaggeratively sexual which do not incorporate external factors that may affect behaviour.
 
B.F. Skinner created a revolution in  Psychology after Freud, in which he theorised that behaviour can be conditioned and is solely a response to external factors. This contradicted Freud and so both perspectives are valid to a certain extent.
 
A man should look for what is, and not for what he thinks should be.

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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2007 at 01:29
Angry@#$%^
i just lost a good post! Ok quickly.

Forgive me  for being sketchy as i touched on this like 10 years ago at UNI.

I agree with the premise we are sexual-violent creatures and that (long ago) we are also smart enough to  make some conscious behavioral compromises for more security. What we deem as 'anti social' behavior is natural, yet we all (actually almost all) choose to not kill, rape, have big sex parties etc  for the safety of a cohesive society. All the rules in society are based on curbing our deeper atavistic sides through punishment. Yes this can effect our behavior but Freud was wrong in thinking this was the end and be all of our issues.

There is, as northpakistani mentions other explanations and  further advancements beyond freudian logic. With all, external -internal forces, to a degree valid.

the biggest criticism of Freud is that he was very sexist. IIRC He had female patients complaining about being sexually abused by their dads and he would say they had 'penis envy'!  So he was too extreme or narrow in his theories.



Edited by Leonidas - 07-Apr-2007 at 01:35
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  Quote northpakistani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2007 at 16:24

Yes, indeed, humans naturally repress their violent sexual aggression to conform with society's norms, yet this suppressed aggression can also be released through a process called :  sublimation.

 
For ei. An artist who paints nudes, actually sublimated his sexual obsession into work that is more acceptable in our society.
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  Quote northpakistani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Apr-2007 at 16:27

What do you guys think about Freud's 'Oedipus Complex' concept?

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  Quote TheDiplomat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2007 at 05:02
Originally posted by northpakistani

What do you guys think about Freud's 'Oedipus Complex' concept?

 
Good question. I think he was much more correct on this issue than correlating many things with sexual desire.
 
I have read many stories in which little girls have a crush on their fathers, and quarrel with their mothers as well as boys that always want to sleep in the middle of their parents, closer to their mothers..
 
Maybe we also had the same afflection when we were 4-5 years old.. But we repressed it and do not remember much about this period of our lfie.
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  Quote TheOrcRemix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2007 at 15:05
yes, repression is used as a defense for the ego. Part of the ego's job is to protect the conscious mind from the threatening thoughts burried in the unconscious (part of the id).
 
allthough Freud Thory is based a lot about sexual desire, maslow agrees with him to an extent.
 
He pointed out that not all needs are creted equal. He descreibed a hierachy of neeeds, that predicts which needs we will be motovated to satisfy first. He predicted that we will act to satisfy biological neds like: survival, sex, and safty, before love and self esteem.
 
Freudian theory also states about "penis evny" about women are envious of the male penis. Feminists like Nancy Chodorow stated that "..Becasue men had more benefits and enjoyment in socity.." which is obserd becasue this stage is around the oral stage, about 6 months to 3 years. Children have a clean slate, and have no information about modern socity.


Edited by TheOrcRemix - 09-Apr-2007 at 15:07
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  Quote Southerneighbr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2007 at 00:02
  Today we tend to view Freud's work mainly through the congitive ''point of view''....this tendency to view things inside the congitive perception and perspective has led us to widely discredit his theories on sexual behavior and desire.
 
We gradually came to the understanding that numerous factors can influence our sexual desire and behaviour  and that his theories do not adaquetely explain many issues in relation to our general sexual desire due to the fact that important factors  have been singled out.
 Mainstream Psychology today regards his psychosexual theories as widely exaggerated....and i must agree on that!
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  Quote Ulrich Wolff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Nov-2007 at 15:42

In the psychology classes I've taken before, we had a "Freudian" teacher...

From what I learned in those classes, Sigmund Freud had connected quite a lot of things to sexual desire...
 
For Freud, many things which we see unrelated with sexual desire in common sense, actually is related to the sexual desire people had towards the opposite gender.
 
I still find this "Freudian" style on sexual desire very weird and think it is somewhat too much "sexist"...
 
I, of course, is not a professional on the issue, but I would like to see it digged more so I can learn if it is really so, or if I am in kind of an illusion.. 
 
What is your opinion over this?

I find Dr. Freud's theories very accurate.  Most people reject his theories because it address issues that are not  politically correct and label it "sexist".  If Dr. Freud's work is viewed as a being from another species his theories make perfect and complete sense. He did all his work with the common detachment from emotion and science which is so needed for unbiased research such as his, and I believe you need to study his work with the same attitude.
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  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Nov-2007 at 17:37

In order to understand the accuracy of Freud's theories you would need to scrutinize it with a working model. First does it purport to measure what it hypothesized to measure? Second, are his theories viable methods in understanding psychological illness? Third, are his theories necessary and sufficient in treating mental illness? 

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  Quote raygun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Jan-2008 at 02:54
I say he's right correct to some extend, at least for me, hehehe, I would watch the news because of that hot newscaster, or buy a certain music album because of that hot singer (though the album sucks!), or go to a particular department at my workplace because of that hot chick at the table.... But of course not everything is sexually motivated, for example, I'm not replying to this thread 'cause you guys/gals are hot, but what do I know, I've never seen you guys/gals before, LOL.
 
On a serious note, have you guys make any subconsious decision (being subconsious so you may not notice) because utimiately, the result would bring a form of sexual gratification, not neccessarily in the form of physical sexual pleasure with a female, not being the top of pack in the male context? Like playing a FPS game & achieivng the best score - (top dog)alpha male complex, winning an argument or debate at work or play - look good in front of your female friends, or even dressing better than other guys in a public place - a phoenix among chickens to the women?
 
 


Edited by raygun - 29-Jan-2008 at 02:57
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Feb-2012 at 19:31
Freud saw only male sexuality as a valid phenomenon - women according to him were satisfying male desires in order to get shelter and food for it. Of course, he was thinking like that because he was a man of his time, and in the Victorian morality of his time "good women" were asexual - this to make male feel more secure, I suppose.

Otherwise, humans have 2 drving impulses according to Freud - Eros /sexual desire/ and Tanatos /impulse for destruction/; and spend their lives pulled from one to another, being both in the same time. Civilizes men learn how to suppress their sexual desires, and through the process of sublimation turn it into creativity - that's why women, according to Freud, cannot create - because they have nothing to sublimate.

Freud is a mixed bag, he wrote many things and one to get to understand what he means takes years of reading him. I used to be a lot in him,when I was doing my university education but, then I switched to Jung. Like every pioneer in his field not everything Freud came up with is supported now - I disagree with his:
 -  connecting people's characters to the type of sexual stage they  fixated in their lives /according to him, oral, anal, genital; the last one is latest and some individuals fixate on earlier one, and some so much reject the earlier ones that it affects their whole personality.
-  on the Oedupus Complex, that is not universal; and there is social explamantion why women like men like their fathers, and men - women who remind them of their mothers, not sexual one.
and some other things.

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  Quote Bobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2012 at 15:33
Originally posted by northpakistani

What do you guys think about Freud's 'Oedipus Complex' concept?

Freud, like many other thinkers who attempted to explain the working of the human mind, came to conclusions that reflect more on his anomolous desires than on how humanity thinks or behaves in general. Psychology scholars love him because he put the field on the map. Bottom line conclusion? Sex sells!
I am wiser than he in that I do not think I know that which I do not know. - Socrates
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  Quote unclefred Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2012 at 13:10
He certainly left us a grand heritage of Analysis, at the very least.
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2012 at 14:35
 
                                                From the Bible to the popular song,
There's one theme that we find right along.
Of all ideals they hail as good,
The most sublime is motherhood.

There was a man, oh, who it seems,
Once carried this ideal to extremes.
He loved his mother and she loved him,
And yet his story is rather grim.

There once lived a man named oedipus rex.
You may have heard about his odd complex.
His name appears in freud's index
'cause he loved his mother.

His rivals used to say quite a bit,
That as a monarch he was most unfit.
But still in all they had to admit
That he loved his mother.

Yes he loved his mother like no other.
His daughter was his sister and his son was his brother.
One thing on which you can depend is,
He sure knew who a boy's best friend is!

When he found what he had done,
He tore his eyes out one by one.
A tragic end to a loyal son
Who loved his mother.

So be sweet and kind to mother,
Now and then have a chat.
Buy her candy or some flowers or a brand new hat.
But maybe you had better let it go at that!

Or you may find yourself with a quite complex complex,
And you may end up like oedipus.
I'd rather marry a duck-billed platypus,
Than end up like old oedipus rex.
Tom Lehrer, CA 1963
 
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  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2012 at 15:11
A quirky bastard to be sure.
From cocaine usage; probably addiction to recover.....he once remarked..and I para that 'addictions to include to tobacco were substitutes for masturbation.'
 
Well..dunno about that.
 
 
But his influence goes without saying.... even if, I personally reject the vast majority of psycho-babble bullshit used by his children to make a living.
 
 
And he becomes one of the first modern examples of 'assisted suicide' and more importantly because them pesky women's liberals don't like him......he gets a Thumbs Up....
 
 
quirky...but I like him.
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2012 at 15:21
Well, having had to study the gent, I remember some doozys, One being if you stroked your beard or mustache, it was a substitute for a woman.  The other was a Trolley car as a "mother symbol".
 
Confused
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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 03:30
Yeah, as remarked on by CV - he thought up a lot of his wacky ideas under the influence of cocaine (just like Sherlock Holmes)..

As a psychiatrist - he avoided the psychotic/compulsory treatment/ seriously deranged patients as too
difficult, & devised his scheme of "Psychoanalysis" as a sinecure to
regularly milk long-term paying 'neurotic' suckers, ah - private patients - instead.. while in fact, giving as little practical advisory mental health input - as possible..

Most of his supposed insights have been debunked as the over-hyped
fantasies of a self-aggrandising charlatan with a Moses-complex..

Edited by J.A.W. - 16-Jun-2015 at 03:31
Be Modest In Thyself..
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  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 06:51
Sherlock's favorite drug was a hashish.And tabacco from Balkan,Macedonia.SmileWe calld them "black gold"coins still.
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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 17:42
Yeah, & those drugs were not criminally sanctioned back then either..
There was a Sherlock Holmes movie titled 'The Seven % Solution' which referred to the cocaine hit Holmes used, as a 'shot in the arm'..
Be Modest In Thyself..
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