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vulkan02
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Topic: Billions and billions just disappear in Iraq. Posted: 08-Feb-2007 at 23:56 |
Damn how much money we have to spend and then lose in a lost war? Billions and billions of dollars just disappear in Iraq
By JOSEPH L. GALLOWAY
McClatchy Newspapers
Show me the money, or at least some receipts scribbled on the backs of old envelopes and grocery bags.
This week, we were treated to the spectacle of the former U.S.
civilian overlord of Iraq, Ambassador L. Paul Bremer, squirming in the
hot seat as he attempted with little success to explain what he did
with 363 TONS of newly printed, shrink-wrapped $100 bills he had flown
to Baghdad.
That's $12 billion in cold, hard American cash, and no one, especially Bremer, seems to know where it went.
It may be an urban legend, but the late Sen. Everett Dirksen,
the Illinois Republican, is widely quoted as saying: "A billion here, a
billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real money." If he didn't
say it, he should have.
Bremer, who was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom for
his role in totally screwing up the first two years of the Iraq
Occupation, said that a lot of the cash was delivered to ministries of
the Iraqi government to meet payrolls that were patently fraudulent.
The Department of Defense's special inspector general for Iraq,
Stuart Bowen, said that a 2005 audit he conducted found that in some
ministries the payroll was padded with up to 90 percent "ghost
employees" - people who didn't really work there or perhaps didn't
really exist.
Bremer said that he decided to provide the money to meet those
payrolls, even though he knew they were bogus, for fear of starting
riots and demonstrations among the Iraqis, real and imagined.
After all, the former czar told the representatives, it wasn't
really our money anyway. It was Iraqi money - oil earnings and bank
accounts seized from Saddam Hussein's government - that we were holding
in trust.
I can think of no period in American history when we sat idly
by while $12 billion just disappeared, poof, without a paper trail;
without heads rolling; without someone going to prison.
And all this was happening at a time in the war when American
soldiers and Marines were going without properly armored vehicles,
without lifesaving body armor and even without some of the weapons they
needed.
What does it take for the American people's gag reflex to kick
in? When do we begin to realize that this is only the tip of an iceberg
of fraud, waste, abuse and corruption perpetrated on a monumental scale
by the Bush administration, its buddies among the military contractors
and their handmaidens on Capitol Hill?
The cost of this war is swiftly building toward a trillion
dollars. How much of that was siphoned off by crooked and incompetent
contractors, greedy defense corporations and Iraqi crooks in a
government that we created and installed?
No one in the congressional hearing has yet asked Bremer or the
inspector general how much of that $12 billion in cash was handed out
to American contractors in Baghdad, although that question begs to be
asked and answered.
During the dark days of World War II, Congress established a
Committee on War Profiteering and put a little-known senator from
Missouri, Harry S. Truman, in charge. Truman, a veteran of combat
service in World War I, was a bulldog.
His committee went after not only those who stole money but
also those who provided shoddy or worthless equipment and supplies for
our troops. He had the power to shut down an offending company or
contractor, and he used it.
Where's our Truman Committee today? Where are the righteous
representatives of the people charged with standing guard over our
troops and our money?
We've wasted $600 billion on a war that we're losing, day by
bloody day, at a time when our president presents a federal budget that
cuts Medicare to find billions for more that war. The Decider boasts
that if we do things his way, America's wealthiest individuals won't
have to pay even one dollar more in taxes.
Meanwhile, the people's representatives, on both sides of the
aisle, round up the contributions they need for re-election by putting
themselves in the pockets of the very robber barons they're supposed to
be investigating, interrogating and policing.
Perhaps we should let a no-bid cost-plus contract to
Halliburton to construct large additions to the country club federal
prisons to accommodate a population explosion in the years ahead. Or,
for convenience sake, maybe we could just add a prison wing to the $500
million George W. Bush Presidential Library at Southern Methodist
University in Dallas.
Edited by vulkan02 - 08-Feb-2007 at 23:59
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Timotheus
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 00:23 |
We've wasted $600 billion on a war that we're losing, day by
bloody day, at a time when our president presents a federal budget that
cuts Medicare to find billions for more that war. The Decider boasts
that if we do things his way, America's wealthiest individuals won't
have to pay even one dollar more in taxes. |
600 billion is a drop in the bucket compared to the trillions we're going to lose over the idiotic program called Medicare.
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From each according to his need, to each according to his ability.
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Leonidas
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 05:00 |
Originally posted by Timotheus
We've wasted $600 billion on a war that we're losing, day by
bloody day, at a time when our president presents a federal budget that
cuts Medicare to find billions for more that war. The Decider boasts
that if we do things his way, America's wealthiest individuals won't
have to pay even one dollar more in taxes. |
600 billion is a drop in the bucket compared to the trillions we're going to lose over the idiotic program called Medicare.
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we have a Medicare not sure its the same thing (a safety net of medical treatments that are either free or subsidized by the fed government), we are not doing so bad, most Aussies are proud of it.
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Omar al Hashim
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 05:20 |
The difference being, Medicare saves people's lives, while the war kills people. If your going to spend 600 billion on killing people, you'd better be prepared to spend alot more on saving others
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Constantine XI
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 05:42 |
Well after having done a major in HR, I want to comment in the usage of
resources. I'm not sure how it works in America, but in Australia
medicare is a system which actually profits the country. You see,
creating a human being takes an awfully huge investment of resources.
Think about it for a moment.
First you have a woman who is partially or fully prevented from work
for a period of at least a few months. Following this, there is the
cost in giving birth which normally includes professional medical
practicioners being employed. After this comes thousands of dollars in
food, clothes, healthcare (one would hope), dental care, transport and
education (typically government funded). And these are among many other
things.
At the end of these 18 years and 9 months, or perhaps sooner if the
child drops out of school at a younger age, you now have a fully
fledged human resource of varying degrees of work ethic, reliability,
intelligence and skill. At the bare minimum you will have an unreliable
ditch digger, at best a top notch scholar needing only a scholarship to
cure cancer or AIDS. In my experience, 95% of these human resources at
minimum do have the combination of attributes required to make them
productive members of society. This can be increased depending on what
education, welfare, workplace and legal statutes and laws which the
state decides to implement.
Suffice to say, the vast majority of these human resources are very
much capable of being members of society who pay tax, generally obey
the law to an acceptable standard, fill a niche role in the job market
and play their part in producing future human resources (bringing up
kids). How well they do this once again depends on what social,
welfare, legal and education policies the society puts in place. These
policies either enhance or lower the capacity of these human resources
(citizens) to exist as positive contributors.
The first point I will make about medicare is that it encourages a
responsible and supportive society. I, like most citizens, am a
taxpayer. When I sit down over my receipts, pay slips and transaction
records at the beginning of the financial year; I am tantalised by the
prospect of being untruthful about how much tax I should pay. With my
dual citizenship and financial training, I could very easily engineer
to have my assets banked offshore and then cheat my government out of
considerable funds which they are entitiled to. OR I could simply fudge
the parts of my tax return the government won't be able to audit with
any certainty. And why wouldn't I? I make a profit, so it makes sense
that I should. Strangely enough, I don't. Because I know that when I
pay my taxes, those funds actually go into projects which enhance the
wellbeing of the nation I live in and the lives of my fellow citizens.
So I end up paying a few more cents in the dollar that I earn, in
return this translates into my fellow citizens being freed from pain,
suffering and preventable fatality. I lose some cash, but in return I
feel I am giving back something positive to a country which ensures my
security, prosperity and safety. Who knows, one day in 40 years time I
may have grandchildren who fall on hard times and need a bit of help to
get them back on their feet. If I am dead, I want piece of mind knowing
that the community to which I have contributed, will take care of my
loved ones if I am unable to. For that reason, I pay my taxes in full,
because I believe they take care of what matters. In a society where
tax money does not go towards protecting and bettering the lives of its
people, why on earth wouldn't you open that offshore account and just
cheat the system?
Back to my original train of thought, as I pointed out the creation of
a human resource is a time, money and effort intensive process. And
this investment usually churns out a human resource who contributes in
a number of ways to a successfully functioning society. To not provide
a person with medical care, you can be depriving them of thousands of
hours of labour every year, which results in lost revenue for the tax
system and a less efficient labour market. Furthermore, if the ailment
is serious enough and you do not assist that human resource with
medical treatment, that human resource could die. This means thousands
more lost labour hours, all after such a massive investment in creating
the human resource in the first place. By allocating a relatively small
amount of money to public health, on the other hand, the investment
should typically yield a much more abundant supply of labour, and more
productive and motivated labour at that. At the end of the day, the
investment results in a result which ethically and financially more
than pays for itself. By looking at medicare simply as a cost, without
examining how the policy results in a positive return on investment,
you are economically shooting yourself in the foot by wishing to
destroy this form of social welfare.
Speaking of returns on investment, let''s look at the war in Iraq. How
much profit has actually been made there? Seriously, how much? I will
bet you the amount is MUCH lower than the cost of financing the war.
They have not dug out even 500 billion in oil, I doubt they have even
got 150 billion worth of oil out of there. Now let's look at the cost
of the war, $600 billion is the current cost of the war itself, and
this is climbing. Then there is the plummeting American prestige
worldwide, which I assure you does translate negatively for American
businesses operating internationally. Then there is the cost of war
pensions, taking care of wounded soldiers, the social cost of
traumatised servicemen. Add to this the intangible but still urgently
important cost of America not being able to deploy itself as
effectively in other theatres because so much of its military resources
are tied up in the losing war in Iraq. As you can plainly see, the Iraq
war is one of the most catastrophicly damaging returns on investment we
are ever likely to see in our lifetime.
Comparing the costs and benefits of Medicare to Iraq, I know which investment I would rather put my money in.
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vulkan02
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 12:43 |
Great post there Constantine but I would like to add that we should never see war or people as simply investments even though Bush and Co. do and to my great pleasure it has backfired on them but then again its us middle class citizens here who really get hurt here. Bush and Co, including the super rich, whom he continually cuts taxes to and increases ours, I doubt feel its economical effects at all.
Timotheus, I would reverse what you just said about the "idiotic Medicare" costing trillions the other way around. In the new budget proposal submitted not too long ago Bush asked congress(again!) to increase military budged by bleeding the other departments such as the department of Health. Pretty soon in the future it seems the Dept. of defense will surpass it in spending if the paranoid neo-con agenda continues to be upholded. Once again you have proven that you have nothing of value to offer to this forum. Please do some research before you post such twisted comments and while you are at that try to also be a little more sympathetic to those who can't afford health care. The way life is it may as well be you one day who will require this service.
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The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Zagros
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 14:02 |
It really is criminal... And what was Clinton almost impeached for? Lying about an embarrassing private sexual affair? Bush takes the whole nation to WAR, which has taken HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of lives and ruined MILLIONS more and hardly a word is spoken against him, officially. What a bloody scandal.
Sex = bad
Killing people for profit = OK
Edited by Zagros - 09-Feb-2007 at 14:04
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vulkan02
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 16:14 |
What is really inconceivable about this case is the huge amount of money 365 TONS of $100 bills simply gone just like that!? Where could all this money possibly go? Inside the pockets of Bremer and Iraqi officials maybe??
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The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Zagros
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 16:24 |
Or GIs? I am sure it can go pretty quickly and stealthily in all directions considering the current Iraqi political, social and economic climate.
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Constantine XI
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 16:50 |
Originally posted by vulkan02
Great post there Constantine but I would like to add that we should
never see war or people as simply investments even though Bush and Co.
do and to my great pleasure it has backfired on them but then again its
us middle class citizens here who really get hurt here. Bush and Co,
including the super rich, whom he continually cuts taxes to and
increases ours, I doubt feel its economical effects at all. |
Thanks, vulkan02. I do realise that we have to be ethical when
considering how we treat our citizens. I just wanted to show that even
from a perspective of complete economic rationalism, the neo
conservative policy of more war and less welfare in this instance was
both fiscally and socially flawed.
I think Bush and co. don't see war or people as investments at all, if
they did they wouldn't be using them this way. Instead, they see them
as expendable resources which can be commandeered for their own self
centred and short sighted ideological aims.
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pikeshot1600
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 17:02 |
Originally posted by Zagros
Or GIs? I am sure it can go pretty quickly and stealthily in all directions considering the current Iraqi political, social and economic climate. |
Half of it is probably funding the insurgency. That'd be cool. The insurgency financed by our tax dollars. I would not bet against it though.
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Zagros
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 17:09 |
Possible, sickeningly enough, for the American tax payer.
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vulkan02
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Posted: 09-Feb-2007 at 18:11 |
With even half that money, the insurgency there could make Hezbollah look like a bunch of school kids with slingshots.
Edited by vulkan02 - 09-Feb-2007 at 20:01
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The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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gcle2003
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Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 05:59 |
We know how the cash got there. What intrigues me is how it gets or got out again, which it must do if the people who ended up with it are to profit by it.
Electronically or via private banking systems you can move money around easily enough. But here you have 363 tons of paper. Suppose you steal a couple of tons: what are you going to do with it?
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Zagros
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Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 07:49 |
If the thieves were high ranking enough, smuggle it through Kuwait, Iran, Jordan, Turkey, Syria or through the UN or store it or all. A lot of it will also be distributed by now, used for winning favours.
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pikeshot1600
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Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 08:50 |
Zagros's post is interesting. American security for, and regulation of, financial transfers is overloaded with technological and electronic aspects to the detriment of attention to low-tech theft and smuggling.
Once someone gets his hands on cash, there are a thousand ways to remove it from a location and to launder it so it might never be traced. There are localities and economies that thrive on money laundering as a source of income and wealth. No surprise really.
It is also interesting that the UN is mentioned as a possible (probable?) channel for illicit funds transfer. Hey, our tax dollars go to that also!
Edited by pikeshot1600 - 10-Feb-2007 at 08:53
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gcle2003
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Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 15:51 |
Originally posted by pikeshot1600
Zagros's post is interesting. American security for, and regulation of, financial transfers is overloaded with technological and electronic aspects to the detriment of attention to low-tech theft and smuggling.
Once someone gets his hands on cash, there are a thousand ways to remove it from a location and to launder it so it might never be traced.
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In general, yes. But 365 tonnes? It took several C130s to fly the money in. You're not going to get it out in the back of a truck.
There are localities and economies that thrive on money laundering as a source of income and wealth. No surprise really.
It is also interesting that the UN is mentioned as a possible (probable?) channel for illicit funds transfer. Hey, our tax dollars go to that also!
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Eventually. When you pay up.
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Zagros
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Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 16:09 |
Where there are crooks, there are always ways. They could even have exchanged the money for bonds in Jordan, Kuwait etc.
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pekau
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Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 02:42 |
How Much Is A Billion?
The next time you hear a politician use the word "billion" casually think about whether you do, or don't, want that politician spending your tax money!!
A billion is a difficult number to comprehend, but an advertising agency did a good job of putting that figure in perspective in one of its releases:
A billion seconds ago, it was 1959.
A billion minutes ago, Jesus was alive.
A billion hours ago, our ancestors were living in the Stone Age.
And....
A billion dollars ago, was only 8 hours and 20 minutes at the rate Washington spends
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