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A Linga from Afghanistan
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: A Linga from Afghanistan
    Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 06:31
It is interesting to note that a Linga found in Afghanistan is depicted below:
 
Linga with one face (Ekamukhalinga), Shahi period, 9th century
Afghanistan
Marble; H. 22 7/16 in. (56.8 cm)
Rogers Fund, 1980 (1980.415)

The Linga symbolizes the great generative force of the universe. It is usually the most sacred object in a temple dedicated to Shiva and is housed in the main sanctum. When plain (simply phallic), the linga represents Shiva in his most abstract form. In this example, Shiva's face has emerged from the central shaft. He is adorned with earrings and a necklace and his hair is worn in a double bun with a crescent moon on one of the buns.

 
This sculpture was made during the short-lived Shahi kingdom (seventhninth century) of eastern Afghanistan, which produced a small number of extraordinary sculptures. They were carved in a distinctive white marble and their style derived from sculptural traditions of northern India and Kashmir.
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Posts: 131 		  Quote chimera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Feb-2007 at 06:40
This linga is more in plain style:
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Posts: 315 		  Quote M. Nachiappan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Feb-2007 at 03:06

Yes, they are interesting, but, how they can be correlated with Linga of Hindu religion?

The%20Turoe%20Stone
The carving details differ much. Do the Irish have any textual support for such carving of idol? Here, Hindus have Silpasastra texts and that is why the Lingas found in India or elsewhere found have such prescribed features. Anyway, your details are informative.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Feb-2007 at 05:10
This is the Lingam found in Nepal:
 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Detail of Ekamukha Siva-linga, see N24213 (colour image)
From Mrigasthali, Nepal
Stone
5th century C.E.
There have been several attempts to steal this image in the past ten years.
Huntington Archive Image Scan #: N24214

Can we compare this with others?


Edited by T.SELVAM - 12-Feb-2007 at 05:58
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Feb-2007 at 06:25
Can anybody help in getting the following article or the picture?
 
The Ekamukhalinga from Wanda Shahabkhel Northwest Frontier, Pakistan

Author (S)/Author (S)

FARID KHAN;

Summary/Abstract

Study of Ekamukhalinga. This sculpture was found in 1988 with the sculpture of Varaha with Thalasadurwal at the North-western border of the province of Pakistan. They are currently preserved at the National Museum of Karachi. It is about a phallus reproducing Shiva. Although one knows other Ekamukhalinga for the periods Gupta and Shahi, this one shows several particular characteristics which make think of an older dating: 2 [E] - 3 [E] centuries apr. J. - C.; Identification of the stone used

Review/Newspaper

South Asian studies (South Asian stud.) ISSN 0266-6030 

Source/Source

1993, vol. 9, pp. 87-91 (13 ref.)

Language/Language

English

Editor/Publisher

British Academy, London, the UNITED KINGDOM (1985) (Re-examined)
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Posts: 131 		  Quote chimera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Feb-2007 at 20:12
"Yes, they are interesting, but, how they can be correlated with Linga of Hindu religion?"
Hurrians had Vedic gods in north Mesopotamia from 1400 BCE.
Scythians moved west to "Hungary" from 450BCE, and Celts were also there on the DANUbe river< Danu river-goddess of Brahmins. Celtic Ireland had Danaan gods, linked to Danu._J Koch. Advanced Wesh Studies, Wales. As Scythians and Kambojas were "degraded kshatriyas" who did not honour Brahmins such as Vritra snake, they probably changed the normal Hindu linga.  Persian/Sanskrit "braman(i)ya" means "religiously", and is seen in Old Swedish "bram" as "state.pomp"> Old English "breme" meaning "high.famous.noble"<IE brih "Brahma".
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Feb-2007 at 06:02
I accept your interpretation, as it is similar to ceratain scholars do.
 
However, the crucial question is why the people-groups should be identified within the "varna", as in modern context, that would lead to different connotation and interpretation.
 
Even IVC has links with Sumerian and other middle-eastern civilizations and many of their sculptures ans stories resemble Indian.
 
Here, in the context of the Lingam-like figures depicted are actually equated with Lingam?
 
That is why perhaps, Mr. Nachiappan has drawn your attention to, "The carving details differ much. Do the Irish have any textual support for such carving of idol? Here, Hindus have Silpasastra texts and that is why the Lingas found in India or elsewhere found have such prescribed features".
 
Do the other groups mentioned by you had such "Sculptor Manual" like Hindus, who still have such books and go on producing such sculptures. In other words, in India, the same old-tradition is followed even after 5000 years or more, because of its heritage and continued culture with civiization. Whereas, the ones mentioned by you disappeared leaving their tracers.
 
So the existing groups follow such traditions respecting their heritage?
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Posts: 131 		  Quote chimera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Feb-2007 at 11:54
In not honouring Brahmins, the Euro tribes who connected with Scythians also changed other Vedic traditions. It seems that to protect the privileged priests, they used memory instead of writings, so that no others could gain the power of knowledge. So northern Europe struggles to find info. about its past - there are only carved stones and other archaeology. Some legends /history were recorded from about 1000 years ago and people grasp these few details to try to build a picture.
chimera
Hinduism Today | Feb 2000
Our Druid Cousins. Meet the brahmins of ancient Europe, the high caste of Celtic society. By Peter Berresford Ellis. The Celtic people spread from their ...
www.hinduismtoday.com/archives/2000/2/2000-2-16.shtml - 20k - Cached - Similar pages
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 01:54

In "Buddhism in Pre-Christian Britain and Ireland", col. Donald Mackanzie has recorded many evidences to prove that the places mentioned were "Vedic" and so also, Edward Pococke, in his "India in Greece" shows how the Greeks in all aspects were totally influenced by Indians.

But, whether such material evidences pointed out are still available or destroyed like Bamiyan Buddha?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 02:01

Returning to the topic, I post another picture available in Gudimallam, AP, India:

It has been dated to c.100 BCE.
 
 
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Posts: 131 		  Quote chimera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 16:05
One connection with Europe is the IE word wat meaning "to inspire", as in Skt. vataka as "hermitage of sage. botanic garden with walls and pavilion", vat/wat  as in Angkor Wat. In Italy, Etruscan vatieke means "dedicated idols" and Latin "vates" means "prophesise" and hill of prophecy, Vatican of Catholic Church. Celtic ovate means "prophet" and they were religious men with Druids/ "brahmins". Some monarchs, prime ministers and church arch-bishops in UK have been inducted into Druid rituals, and the ritual in St. George's chapel at Windsor castle is druid-brahmin. The monarch climbs the steps for the snake-dragon ceremony, like the Naga king at Brahmins'  Angkor Wat who climbed the tower to meet the snake ancestor. Thailand's Brahmin king has chamara "royal tassel", and UK kings and bishops at Windsor wear chamarre/ chimere robes and also tassels - French tasseau means "tassel clasp for robe". The Hindi yali "mythic goat-lion" is the UK yale goat-lion , sculpted above Windsor and also is in the UK Coat-of-Arms.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Feb-2007 at 00:46
there were some hindus in afghanistan so whats the big deal?
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aararararar
You think "big deal" here?
 
Kindly explain.
 
chimera
You appear to be depending much upon the philological nuances. Would it work everywhere or for everything?
History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Aug-2007 at 12:52
Bible Old Testament has Frist Five Books called Torah means Law.

These are written around 400-250 BCE, but named under Moses who could have lived in 1200bce.
These are called Pntauteuch, means first five books.

These books are called Tawrath in Quran.

In TORAH- The Creator God is calle El-Shaddai- this name is used around 40 Times in Old Testament.

The other name for God is Ellohim, used more than 1000 times.

The very name repeated is Yhwh-(Just four letters; but Yehovah are later corruptions) called Tetragramation means Four Lettered, this comes morethan 8200 times in Old Testament.

As per All major Bible Lexicons- the very word "EL" is refering to God in all major Semitic Languages; but its Origin or root or meaning is not known. They assume a meaning "Power" or Sakthi.
This EL- expands to ELLO'H"IM-the "H" is a Femnine and Im makes it Plural as per Sanskrit or Hindi.

The word "El" is a Pure Tamil Word- which is very much in use as "Ellamman" or "Ellappan" temples and wrongly written as Elllaiamman OR Ellaiappan.
Tamil word "El" is used in Sangam to refer Suriyan/God.
El- means Elumputhal Illathavan and Ellai Illathavan. No Raising or No Boundaries which ideally suit Suryan or God.
Again "Saddai" As per All major Bible Lexicons- the very word "Saddai" its Origin or root or meaning is not known.Its Translates as God Almighty and God connected with Mountains.

Hebrew Bible Superstitions and 10 Commandments restrict usage of God' name then came Yhwh- BUT whenever this name Occur in Old Testament a Hebrew would read it as "Adonai" means Ejaman or Lord.

Bible Translaters Purposely Translate-the nouns ElShaddai as God Almighty in English and Sarva Valamai Thevan in Tamil; Ellohim as God or Thevan. Yhwh as Lord or Karthar.

The Word Ellohim with Plural and Femnine Consonant means but Ammaiappan, which means God is full Male and Female

The Hebrew word Ellohim turns as All-ahu-thum and shortened to Allah in Arabic =referring God Shiva.

This ElShaddai/Ellohim is worshipped in Lingam Form in Bible perforning Abishekams.

The Kaba in Mecca is a Black Lingam and Haj is coming Around this Lingam(Pradakshanam) and All Haj Goers have to Kiss this Black Lingam and due to rush Flying Kiss is the Practice.
 
 
The word used more than 8,500 times Lord inEnglish and Karthar in Tamil and its translation Deceptions, as follows:
" The Great Majority of readers take for Granted that Some Word Equivalent to "LORD" is in the Hebrew Text, but it is not. The Word-"Lod" is a title, not name;and not Name; and Putting it in Capital Letters does nothing to change this fact. But where the Bible Specifically has the personal name, translators should not take it upon themselves to make a substitution. The use of "Lord" instead of "Yahweh" effectively Depersonalises the Deity, turns Him into a kind of Vaugue abstaraction and rejects the repeated Emphasis in the Bible on his Unique personal relationship with Israel. It also disguises the fact tat YAHWEH is a Character in the Biblical Drama, with entrances and exis and a role to play, all
assigned by the Writers."
-Page 313 -Bible As Literature, Oxford University Press,
written by 3 Professors John.A.Gabel, Charles B.Wheelr and Antony.D.York.
 
Lingam Worship has gone from Vedic Indians and Tamils to Arab


Edited by devapriya - 18-Aug-2007 at 22:31
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That theory is nonsense^
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Aug-2007 at 07:10
Originally posted by devapriya

Bible Old Testament has Frist Five Books called Torah means Law.

These are written around 400-250 BCE, but named under Moses who could have lived in 1200bce.
These are called Pntauteuch, means first five books.

These books are called Tawrath in Quran.

In TORAH- The Creator God is calle El-Shaddai- this name is used around 40 Times in Old Testament.

The other name for God is Ellohim, used more than 1000 times.

The very name repeated is Yhwh-(Just four letters; but Yehovah are later corruptions) called Tetragramation means Four Lettered, this comes morethan 8200 times in Old Testament.

As per All major Bible Lexicons- the very word "EL" is refering to God in all major Semitic Languages; but its Origin or root or meaning is not known. They assume a meaning "Power" or Sakthi.
This EL- expands to ELLO'H"IM-the "H" is a Femnine and Im makes it Plural as per Sanskrit or Hindi.

The word "El" is a Pure Tamil Word- which is very much in use as "Ellamman" or "Ellappan" temples and wrongly written as Elllaiamman OR Ellaiappan.
Tamil word "El" is used in Sangam to refer Suriyan/God.
El- means Elumputhal Illathavan and Ellai Illathavan. No Raising or No Boundaries which ideally suit Suryan or God.
Again "Saddai" As per All major Bible Lexicons- the very word "Saddai" its Origin or root or meaning is not known.Its Translates as God Almighty and God connected with Mountains.

Hebrew Bible Superstitions and 10 Commandments restrict usage of God' name then came Yhwh- BUT whenever this name Occur in Old Testament a Hebrew would read it as "Adonai" means Ejaman or Lord.

Bible Translaters Purposely Translate-the nouns ElShaddai as God Almighty in English and Sarva Valamai Thevan in Tamil; Ellohim as God or Thevan. Yhwh as Lord or Karthar.

The Word Ellohim with Plural and Femnine Consonant means but Ammaiappan, which means God is full Male and Female

The Hebrew word Ellohim turns as All-ahu-thum and shortened to Allah in Arabic =referring God Shiva.

This ElShaddai/Ellohim is worshipped in Lingam Form in Bible perforning Abishekams.

The Kaba in Mecca is a Black Lingam and Haj is coming Around this Lingam(Pradakshanam) and All Haj Goers have to Kiss this Black Lingam and due to rush Flying Kiss is the Practice.
 
 
The word used more than 8,500 times Lord inEnglish and Karthar in Tamil and its translation Deceptions, as follows:
" The Great Majority of readers take for Granted that Some Word Equivalent to "LORD" is in the Hebrew Text, but it is not. The Word-"Lod" is a title, not name;and not Name; and Putting it in Capital Letters does nothing to change this fact. But where the Bible Specifically has the personal name, translators should not take it upon themselves to make a substitution. The use of "Lord" instead of "Yahweh" effectively Depersonalises the Deity, turns Him into a kind of Vaugue abstaraction and rejects the repeated Emphasis in the Bible on his Unique personal relationship with Israel. It also disguises the fact tat YAHWEH is a Character in the Biblical Drama, with entrances and exis and a role to play, all
assigned by the Writers."
-Page 313 -Bible As Literature, Oxford University Press,
written by 3 Professors John.A.Gabel, Charles B.Wheelr and Antony.D.York.
 
Lingam Worship has gone from Vedic Indians and Tamils to Arab
Please give proper sources, and place the at the top of the post which I am doing, since this is a controversial topic and likely to cause heated discussion. Under the Coc you have certain Guidelines when posting.
 
For the assertions that you make, well please back the up with references. Otherwise considering the history of this forum, it will be considered flame bait.
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Posts: 315 		  Quote M. Nachiappan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Aug-2007 at 07:21
I think that the topic has been started in historical perspective.
 
But, it is turning into religious, with controversial interpretation etc.
 
T. selvam originally pointed out that the oldest Lingam was found at Andhrapradesh. Then the other Lingams. So the interpretationn should be directed on that point.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2007 at 12:33
After a long time, I could see my posting!
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