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Greco-Turkish music & dance

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  Quote konstantinius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Greco-Turkish music & dance
    Posted: 02-Jan-2007 at 19:06
Originally posted by Patrinos

Karagun...thats how Ottomans called the inhabitants of Thessaly...
And as "karaka蓷n" a Greek nomad group.I've read that karaka蓷n means 'those who flee to uncultivated lands',correct?
    


Is that what karagounides means? The inhabitants of Thessaly?
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  Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jan-2007 at 13:42

Karaka蓷n have a few meanings: "Those who flee to snow" is one meaning. Another meaning may be"the black runner". However it's mostly used as a common name given to donkey in TurkeyTongue.

[IMG]http://www.maksimum.com/yemeicme/images/haber/raki.jpg">
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jan-2007 at 18:38
Originally posted by kotumeyil

Karaka蓷n have a few meanings: "Those who flee to snow" is one meaning. Another meaning may be"the black runner". However it's mostly used as a common name given to donkey in TurkeyTongue.

you try to explain with using modern Turkish, kara does means also "land", just check other places called with kara in it like "qaraqumlum" desert in somewhere china.
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  Quote Patrinos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jan-2007 at 19:48
Originally posted by konstantinius

Is that what karagounides means? The inhabitants of Thessaly?

Yes,thats how they are called.Read more here


Originally posted by kotumeyil

Karaka蓷n have a few meanings: "Those who flee to snow" is one meaning. Another meaning may be"the black runner".However it'smostly used as a commonname given todonkey in Turkey



The "black-kara" its seems to exist since they wore black fustanellas and the tradition says that they started to wear black after the fall of Polis when they started to flee to Agrafa mountains to escape from the slavery.
So the Ottomans called them(and one of my ancestors) so and thats how they are known when they spread to all over Balkans.

Thanks kotumeyil



      
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 09:31
Originally posted by Patrinos

Look what I've found,a band of three Greeks and a Turk:
Kazantzidis' songs

And look him playing turkish music/Fidayda
Very nice music!!!!

The band's name is Ithikon Akmaiotaton.


Nice links thanks.

I whasnt aware that this guy (ismail YK) could play baglama so very well, also i learned he could play baglama on his 4th Shocked

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s37ct0pXLbQ

more likely he sings songs like this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8K3n6wMs8k

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  Quote Patrinos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 11:50
Very nice DayI!!
Baglama has a very Turkish sound for my ears,and I like it a lot.

Is he famous in Turkey?Orhan Osman.
He plays rebetika here in the City.
opa

Sagapo by Orhan

A very good solo

Thats sound very Greek to me

I see a lot of people in the magazi( ) where he sings,I know that many Greek who visit Turkey go there.

And a difficult question for you: Who is better buzukcis? Orhan(see solo link ^) or Nikolopoulos... difficult ehh??
    
    
     

Edited by Patrinos - 04-Jan-2007 at 12:00
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 13:50
Originally posted by Patrinos

Very nice DayI!!
Baglama has a very Turkish sound for my ears,and I like it a lot.

Is he famous in Turkey?Orhan Osman.
He plays rebetika here in the City.
opa

Sagapo by Orhan

A very good solo

Thats sound very Greek to me

I see a lot of people in the magazi( ) where he sings,I know that many Greek who visit Turkey go there.

And a difficult question for you: Who is better buzukcis? Orhan(see solo link ^) or Nikolopoulos... difficult ehh??
    
    
     


Yes its difficult to choose one Smile

But have a look at him too, for me he's the master of baglama http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfJ_rHp8Uas
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  Quote Patrinos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 14:31
Originally posted by DayI

But have a look at him too, for me he's the master of baglama http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfJ_rHp8Uas

    
Extremely good DayI!!
I've seen on TV a Turkish who played excelent tubeleki,but I don't remember his name,I've heard that he is considered one of the best.Do you have in mind to who I'm refering?
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 15:18
Bah, I deleted older post mistakely.
 
not mentioning blacksea music and dance is big crime!Angry  Of course, blacksea means kemence and horon.
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 16:42
Originally posted by Mortaza

Bah, I deleted older post mistakely.
 
not mentioning blacksea music and dance is big crime!Angry  Of course, blacksea means kemence and horon.
kusura bakma usha'um, saw the post of patrinos and replyed to him with a link. Mortaza can you "horon tepme"?
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  Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 17:45
Look, what I have found. A Turkish horon from 1978 and a Greek horon from 1980s. See the resemblance:
 
Turkish horon:
 
 
Greek horon:
 
[IMG]http://www.maksimum.com/yemeicme/images/haber/raki.jpg">
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  Quote Hellios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 18:59
Thanks kotumeyil - very interesting stuff.
 
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  Quote Neoptolemos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jan-2007 at 19:05
There are some great videos that you posted guys Thumbs Up

Originally posted by Mortaza

not mentioning blacksea music and dance is big crime!Angry
You are right. Here are some more videos of pontian dances:
Sera horos, 1979 clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj6eW5-GZ2I
Kotsari horos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDZOr1L9aU4
@ Panagia Sumela, 1980 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoQzkwzUk6w
Knife dance http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMgxUT1GX5I
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jan-2007 at 14:14
kusura bakma usha'um,
 
Not your guilt, temellik yaptum sadece.LOL
 
Mortaza can you "horon tepme"?

not much.Living at istanbul did not help much.Cry

Look, what I have found. A Turkish horon from 1978 and a Greek horon from 1980s. See the resemblance:
 
Infact I dont see resemblance.  this is most weird horon, I ever saw. I am sure greeks have other type of horons too. Infact difference is too normal, horon changes even from one village to another one. I am curious about root of this dance.
 
Neoptolemos,
 
Do you have new pontus greek singers? I mean these are old. did pontus greeks asimilated by greece greeks?
 
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jan-2007 at 14:27
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  Quote Neoptolemos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2007 at 02:06
Originally posted by Mortaza

Neoptolemos,
 
Do you have new pontus greek singers? I mean these are old. did pontus greeks asimilated by greece greeks?

Assimilated? Hmm, all Greeks (i.e. Epirotans, Macedonians, Cretans, Peloponneseans etc) have been/are being "assimilated" to an extend to the mainstream Greek culture. For example we all listen to 'laika' and western-style pop songs,  we all speak the same language (or rather dialect) more or less, which means that local dialects and accents are gradually fading away, we dress the same way and so on. At the same time, however, we keep (and will continue keeping) some of our region-specific cultural elements alive. For example there are some customs that you only find them in some parts of Greece.
Going now to music, all regions of Greece have their traditional music, folk dances, different prime instruments etc. Those are kept alive. The same is happening with the Pontians. They keep their music and dances and they don't forget their roots. So there are new greek-pontian singers. Of course if you ask me to name them I can't, just like most of Greeks here won't know singers who sing Epirotika (traditional songs from Epirus). I know though people with pontian roots who are in the mainstream music industry.

Per tradition some links:)
Dancing pontians in Athens  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPhthRTHcFw
Dancing group in Katerini, Macedonia http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPE0htkKTJg
Celebration in Nea Makri, Athens http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lkRaeLzaws

And to more from weddings:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u27kh-JzIW0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CA5JdINri0

One of my cousins got married to a woman with pontian roots. At the wedding party (in Athens) they had music (live of course:) from both Epirus and Pontos. I'm telling you, when pontians start dancing they don't stop... they humiliated us! We had an excuse though; they were many more LOL

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  Quote Neoptolemos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2007 at 02:16
Originally posted by Mortaza

Trabzon kolbastısı, I am curious If greeks have this type of dance.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aes-96MTUaQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfKu49mbaqE&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaUqiFlyxw8
To my knowledge no. BUT if we drink a bit and hear this music playing, given our improvisation abilities, we may start dancing like this LOL
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2007 at 08:01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lkRaeLzaws
 
This is absolutely same with turkish horon.It is much better than that antic horons. they dance emorfa.
 
To my knowledge no. BUT if we drink a bit and hear this music playing, given our improvisation abilities, we may start dancing like this LOL
 
Hmm, interesting. This dance is mainly a trabzon dance.
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  Quote Patrinos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2007 at 10:18
Originally posted by Mortaza

they dance emorfa.



Do you speak any rumce?
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2007 at 11:22
nope, I know this word just for beatiful girls. bola emorfa girl.LOL
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