Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Topic ClosedTurkic etymology

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 9>
Author
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Topic: Turkic etymology
    Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 01:54

A comparative Altaic linguistics.



Edited by gok_toruk - 12-Nov-2006 at 12:36
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 01:58
Proto - Altaic: epo
 
Meaning: to kill, kill
 
Old Turkic: ab (hunt, chase)
 
Modern Turkic: aw

Mongolian: aba

Tungus-Manchu: wa (=eba)

Japanese: op

Comments: Manchu 'ebte ǵaxun' ('hunting bird'; perhaps preserving the original shape of the root *eb(a)-, that has elsewhere been irregularly reduced to *ewā- > *wā-).


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 05:52
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:01
Proto - Altaic: eba
 
Meaning: to join, meet

Turkic: ab (to crowd, to come together)

Mongolian: aula

Tungus-Manchu: ebure

Korean: abor

Japanese: ap

Comments: An attempt of Doerfer to disprove Ramstedt's etymology (by supposing *h- in Mong.) is unsuccessful. Korean has a low tone, typical for the verbal subsystem.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 02:05
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:04
Proto - Altaic: ap
 
Meaning: to take
 
Old Turkic: abuch (handful) 
 
Modern Turkic: owuch; uwus

Mongolian: abi

Tungus-Manchu: abqu

Comments: *abuč (*abut) cannot be regarded as a variant of *adu[ĺ] (on which see under alda - although the two roots could have influenced each other. The closed vowel in PT is not quite clear (under the influence of the two following labial phonemes?).


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 05:56
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:07
Proto - Altaic: apuchi
 
Meaning: elder in-law

Old Turkic: abuch-qa (1 husband, old man 2 foster-mother 3 elder sister
4 uncle)
 
Modern Turkic: awuchqa (word may be derived from *aba 'elder in the mother's line' + -č.

Mongolian: (h)abisu-n 

Tungus-Manchu: abusi

Comments: Mong. has -s- (instead of the expected *-č-) probably because of a fusion with the productive suffix -su(n).


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 05:57
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:11
Proto - Altaic: abu
 
Meaning: interior of the mouth

Old Turkic: aburt (1 cheek-pouch, inside of the mouth 2 gum 3 mouthful, gulp 4 cheek 5 molar 6 to take a mouthful, swallow)
 
Modern Turkic: owrut; urt(a) (The Old Uyghur form, in inscriptions, is poorly readable, so -đ- (odurt) is dubious. Yakut -m- (omurt) is irregular: could it be a trace of Proto - Altaic *um 'drink', otherwise lost in Turkic?

Mongolian: owchi

Tungus-Manchu: (x)abu-wan

Comments: ---------------------


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:00
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:13
Proto - Altaic: ach
 
Meaning: to open, split up

Turkic: ach

Mongolian: (h)acha

Tungus-Manchu: pach

Comments: -------------
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:17
Proto - Altaic: achaj / echej
 
Meaning: elder relative, ancestor

Old Turkic: echi, (Orkh.), ech (Orkhon, Old Uyghur.)
 
Modern Turkic: eche; acha

Tungus-Manchu: asi

Korean: acha

Comments: An expressive kinship "nursery" word with the typical structure *VCV; the root must have denoted some elder relative, both male and female. Deriving *asī from a Chinese or Sino-Korean source is quite impossible. The Mongolian reflexes are problematic: Mong. echei 'mother, elder sister' is probably < Turkic.; Mong. echige 'father' reflects rather Proto-Altaic  ete  . One should, however, note an isolated Dagur form achā 'father' whence certainly Solon ača id. and possibly Evenk ači 'ancestor' .


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:04
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:19
Proto - Altaic: ach
 
Meaning: blessing, favour

Turkic: achu (1 precious gift; wellbeing 2 to tend, make comfortable, be favourable 3 to pity, have compassion)
 
Mongolian: hachi

Comments: In modern Altaic languages, the root tends to be confused with *iachu- 'bitter, bitterness' , thus the Oghuz voicing may be a result of secondary contamination and not due to original vowel length; but the two roots are rather well distinguished in Old Turkic.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:05
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:24
Proto - Altaic: eda
 
Meaning: silly, evil

Turkic: ada (1 danger 2 to endanger)

Mongolian: ada

Tungus-Manchu: ede

Japanese: anta

Comments: The Japanese high tone seems to contradict the Manchu - Tungus length, but it may be secondary.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:06
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:27
Proto - Altaic: agdi
 
Meaning: foot, foot sole

Old Turkic: adaq
 
Modern Turkic: ayaq; ajaq, ataq, azaq

Mongolian: (h)adaq

Tungus-Manchu: pagdi(ki)

Japanese: pi(n)tumai

Comments: For the Korean parallel listed - patak 'bottom, foundation' - should be rather compared with Manchu - Tungus *pata .


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:08
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:29

Proto - Altaic: ad

Meaning: to fit, equal, similar

Turkic: adal (friend, companion)

Mongolian: adali

Tungus-Manchu: ada

Comments: Several similar roots: id  'to follow, lead'; iwude 'to imitate, simulate', with a natural tendency towards contamination.
 
A hypothesis about *adaĺ: (compound) at-daĺ with 'name' as the first component is impossible (in that case we would expect *ataĺ and 'namesake' as the earliest meaning). The form atta is attested since Modern Turkic: atta 'namesake' , ada 'namesake' , ata 'namesake' - and contaminates with *adaĺ. Modern languages for the most part reflect the compound, Tuva a'dashku-lar 'a father with his children' ("namesakes";  pharyngealization as a reflex of *-t-). A possible reflex of *adaĺ is Chuvash ural-a-- 'to agree about acquiring smth. collectively, together' and ural-a-n- 'to form a light circle (of astronomical bodies)': both are semantically quite far from ura-la-n- 'to recover'.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:11
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:31
Proto - Altaic: ada
 
Meaning: to separate, some, other

Turkic: adyr
 
Modern Turkic: ayir; azyr, ajyr

Tungus-Manchu: padi

Korean: pta-n

Japanese: pa(n)tu

Comments: Korean has a frequent vowel loss between two stops (which occurred before *-d- > -r- and thus explains medial -t-). Correspondences are regular except for the aberrant high tone in Jpn.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:11
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 02:32
Will get back later...
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 05:42
Proto - Altaic: aga(e-)
 
Meaning: mouth, to open mouth

Proto Turkic: agyr (1 mouth 2 lip, lips 3 mouth of a river, of a cleft)
 
Old Turkic: agyz
 
Modern Turkic: agyz; aqys, awus

Mongolian: aq

Korean: ha

Japanese: akup

Comments: (confused with *ák`a). Mong. agur 'steam, anger' hardly belongs here . The root should be distinguished from ak'a, although they tend to be confused: thus, Mong. *ag 'crack' could quite possibly reflect *ák`a.
 
Some phonetic comments: Korean has lost the first vowel in a long derivative (a rather frequent phenomenon).


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:13
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 05:49
Proto - Altaic: agu-la
 
Meaning: uninhabited place, wilderness

Turkic: aghlaq (1 lonely, uninhabited (place) 2 unemployed, out of work 3 field)
 
 
Modern Turkic: awlaq (Tends to contaminate with *āb-lag 'hunting lands')

Mongolian: aghula

Tungus-Manchu: aqulan 

Comments: May be derived from the root reflected in Manchu - Tungus as *agī- 'to walk without a road', 'wilderness' (borrowing from Mong. aghi 'wide' is highly dubious). Note that vowel length in Proto Turkic *aglak is unknown; if the original meaning of the root was 'to nomadize', one is tempted to compare also Proto Turkic *āgul 'settlement' (originally perhaps 'nomadic settlement'), whence probably Modern Mongolian ajil . ( > Evenk ail). Not borrowed from Turkic, but rather genuine may also be Mongolian ajimak 'a group of ajil's' (Mongolian > Khakas, Tuva ajmaq (See also Manchu ajman ).


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 05:51
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 06:16
Proto - Altaic: eqa
 
Meaning: to paw, hit with hooves

Turkic: aqsa

Mongolian: (h)aqsa

Tungus-Manchu: ekte

Japanese: ankak

Comments: Both Turkic and Mongolian languages have also a derivative meaning 'rampage, rage, raging': aqsun, aqsum, axsum, etc.; Khalkha agsam 'rampage'. Doerfer supposes a loanword in Turkic < Mong.; Shcherbak, vice versa; the final decision is still unclear.
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 06:19
Proto - Altaic: agur
 
Meaning: colostrum

Proto Turkic: aqur
 
Modern Turkic: aghuz; awuz

Mongolian: uquraq

Comments: ----

Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:20
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 06:21
Proto - Altaic: aya
 
Meaning: to go, walk

Proto Turkic: ay

Modern Turkic: ayla; aylan; ayda
 
Mongolian: aya

Tungus-Manchu: ay

Japanese: ayum 

Comments: -----
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
gok_toruk View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
9 Oghuz

Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2006 at 06:23
Proto - Altaic: eyu (-o)
 
Meaning: to speak, cry, sound

Turkic: ayit

Mongolian: ayi

Tungus-Manchu: eye

Korean: oio

Comments: Before the 11th c. it had only a causative meaning; the meaning 'say, tell' developed later.


Edited by gok_toruk - 04-Oct-2006 at 06:24
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 9>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.