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Pontian Greek Dialect

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Digenis View Drop Down
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  Quote Digenis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Pontian Greek Dialect
    Posted: 07-Jun-2006 at 14:53
Originally posted by Mortaza

My  mother said me, she firstly spoken a  langauge we named Rumca(half turkish- half greek),  she can understand some words of greek langauge.(very very  limited)



Brother Mortaza! Big smile Greek blood flows in your veins !TongueBig smile
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jun-2006 at 15:42
Originally posted by Digenis

Originally posted by Mortaza

My  mother said me, she firstly spoken a  langauge we named Rumca(half turkish- half greek),  she can understand some words of greek langauge.(very very  limited)



Brother Mortaza! Big smile Greek blood flows in your veins !TongueBig smile
and Ottoman in yours...
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  Quote Digenis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2006 at 04:21
Originally posted by DayI

Originally posted by Digenis

Originally posted by Mortaza

My  mother said me, she firstly spoken a  langauge we named Rumca(half turkish- half greek),  she can understand some words of greek langauge.(very very  limited)



Brother Mortaza! Big smile Greek blood flows in your veins !TongueBig smile
and Ottoman in yours...


I dont think so.
After all if some grandfather of mine was Ottoman,why would he turn to christian?He had nothing to benefit by that.
But even if it was so,i wouldnt feel bad at all about it Smile

Back to the Pontians.

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  Quote dorian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2006 at 08:22

Greek blood in your veins...

Ottoman blood in your veins...
 
Congrats! You are so mature!! Clap
"We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians.That's who we are!We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his MacedoniaOur ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century" Kiro Gligorov FYROM
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  Quote akritas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2006 at 09:36

A intresting quote from an article with main title

The Pontic Dialect: A Corrupt Version of Ancient Greek? by PETER MACKRIDGE
 
The majority of ethnic Greeks who are leaving the Soviet Union in order to settle in Greece are Pontians. These people originate from the eastern half of the southern shores of the Black Sea. This article attempts to deal briefly (a) with the relationship of their dialect with other varieties of Greek and (b) with the question whether Pontic is a dialect of Greek or a separate language. The conclusion drawn is that Pontic is a modern Greek dialect, albeit far removed from today's standard language, and that those who are involved in teaching standard Greek to Soviet Pontian immigrants in Greece would be assisted in their task if they bore in mind the similarities and differences between these two versions of Greek rather than teaching the standard language as if it were a totally foreign language.
 
 

Please e-mail the all article  if anyone has full access .

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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2006 at 11:30
Ντέ φτάς De ftas - How are you
 
This is same,  my mother also use,  de foes.(how are  you)
 
Ντο ίνετε Do ginete - What's happening
 
It should  be do ginese..(what are you doing?)
 
 
Πίος είσαι Pios eisai - Who are you

same.
 
Άτο τεμόν εν Ato temon en- This is mine
Άτο τεσόν εν Ato teson en - This is yours
 
she use aso, not ato.
 
έσιρα το άφκα esira to afka - i dropped it on the ground
 
I remember esira, It means there, no idea about afka.
 
Πίσον τι δουλίας Peson ti doulias- Do your work

I remember doulias.
 
ουλ ενέσπαλα Oul enespala - I forgot everything
 
Do  enaspago means to remember? ego enaspago means I remember.
 
 
Brother Mortaza! Big smile Greek blood flows in your veins !TongueBig smile
Maybe, but dont take it much serious, because I dont.
 
 


Edited by Mortaza - 08-Jun-2006 at 11:35
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  Quote dorian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2006 at 17:05
Originally posted by Mortaza

 
έσιρα το άφκα esira to afka - i dropped it on the ground
 
I remember esira, It means there, no idea about afka.
  
 
άφκα in modern greek is άφησα of the verb αφήνω which means leave
"We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians.That's who we are!We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his MacedoniaOur ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century" Kiro Gligorov FYROM
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  Quote akritas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2006 at 17:44
......as also and  in Greek slang some times we say afika. Usually this word  mentioned from the Ionian and Pontian Greeks
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  Quote dorian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2006 at 15:47
Yeah, that's true! In all the dialects and regions of Greece it is used mostly by the elder people.
"We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians.That's who we are!We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his MacedoniaOur ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century" Kiro Gligorov FYROM
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  Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2006 at 19:18
To make it easier for some non-greek spoken members, I will also translate in ancient greek, or medieval colloqueal greek:

Some Pontian phrases
 
Ντέ φτάς - Ήντα εν που φτιάχνεις - Τι κάνεις - How are you
Ντο ίνετε - Ήντα εν το που γίνεται - Τι γίνετε -
What's happening
Καλατσέβω Ποντιακά - Μιλάω Ποντιακά -
I speak Pontian
(Καλατσέβω is not a greek word - just greek ending)
Ποίος είσαι - Ποίος είσαι - Who are you
Λελέβω σε - Λατρεύω σε - Σε λατρεύω -
I adore you (ευ is pronounced εβ)
Κόρτσοπον τίνος εισαι - κοριτσόπουλον τινός είσαι - κορίτσι τίνος είσαι -
Whose girl are you
φίγον απ' ατουκά - φύγον απ' αυτού κάτω - φύγε από εκεί  -
Get away from down there
τιδέν κι γρικό -
τι δεν και γροικώ - τίποτα δεν καταλαβαίνω -
I do not understand anything
χάσον ατα ντο ξέρτς - χάσον αυτά ήντα ξέρεις - Ξέχασε αυτά που ξέρεις -
Forget what you know
Τ' όνομαμ εν ... - Τ' όνομά μου είν - Το όνομα μου είναι ... -
my name is ...
Άτο τεμόν εν - Αυτό εμόν είν - Αυτό δικό μου είναι -
This is mine
Άτο τεσόν εν - Αυτό εσόν είν - Αυτό δικό σου είναι -
This is yours
Πίσον τι δουλίας - Πίσω στη δουλειά σου Back to your work

ουλ ενέσπαλα -
ούλα είν που έσφαλα - όλα τα ξέχασα -
I forgot everything
δέβα απές - διάβα από έσω - πήγαινε μέσα -
go inside
έσιρα το άφκα - έσυρα το άφηκα - το έριξα κάτω -
i dropped it on the ground (I dragged it and let it drop to the floor)
τα μαλίαμ έσπριναν - τα μαλλιά μου άσπριναν - άσπρισαν τα μαλλιά μου -
my hair has turned white
Ατόρα ντό α φτάμε - Τώρα ήντα είν το που φτιάχνουμε - Τώρα τι θα κάνουμε -
What do we do now
κλόσκουμε σο σπίτ - κλώθωμαι εις το σπίτι - γυρνάω στο σπίτι -
I'm going home

I hope I've helped a little...
CARRY NOTHING
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  Quote bg_turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2006 at 15:34
I came accros this video

http://www.ocena.info/videodes/albums/videodes/kanald.wmv

It is about Iskenderli where Pontian is spoken ... and some of the people are hesitant to speak in their language because they fear they might be fined or persecuted.  I strongly condemn any restrictions on their native language.

Can Dundars disgusting provocations that these people are trying to achieve a "Pontian Dreams" are sickening ... what a cheap and populist journalist he is.
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  Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2006 at 18:54
You understood wrong. On the contrary, Can Dundar criticizes that nationalist paranoia.
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  Quote bg_turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 07:21
Originally posted by kotumeyil

You understood wrong. On the contrary, Can Dundar criticizes that nationalist paranoia.

sorry Embarrassed
Who wrote the nationalist propaganda?


edit: as I understand now it was TRT which started the allgeations, and Can Dundar was the one who condemned them. I am sorry for the misinformation. My respects to Mr. Dundar.


Edited by bg_turk - 12-Jun-2006 at 07:26
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 08:03
It is about Iskenderli where Pontian is spoken ... and some of the people are hesitant to speak in their language because they fear they might be fined or persecuted.  I strongly condemn any restrictions on their native language.
 
Well,  my village(still) speak  pontian without no restriction, there were even some pontian songs. But they dont accept themself as pontian, but turk.
 
 
I remember  a village who speak greek langauge, some greeks visited them, and called them as greek. Just guess what  happened? They  stoped to  talk pontian. (my village dont call themself as pontian, but turk.(and they are nationalist)
 
I think, muslim greek and muslim armenian asimilation happened not  with force.
 
After all, when my grandmother said we killed them, She  meant turks killed greeks, and when she said they killed us, she means greeks killed  turks.
 
 
 
 
 
 
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  Quote Digenis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 08:31
Well,Mortaza, i dont think that somebody should call "Greek" these people.
They are turkish citizens,with pontian greek ancestry and nothing more.

On the other hand assimilation was not always peacful,but violence and threats were used too..
Of course when an assimilation progress ends,its reasonable that the people assimilated feel foreign (or even hostile ,when used by governments) towards their ex-ancestors.

The point is that these people shouldnt be forced t oloose their unique cultural identity,beyond "nationalities" or territorial claims.

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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 08:56
digenis mostly people who speak the old pontian dialect are muslim-greeks, christian pontians or many of them did left Turkey by population exchange between Turkey and Greece.

I gave a while ago an example of an Greek orthodox priest who came to Turkey (trabzon) and found an old pontian village. He did go there and tell'd them they where Greeks and should be orthodox christian instead of muslim, few hours later he whas shotten down by one of the villagers self.

So If you say  to them "you are a Turk, you should be a Greek" or if you tell them "you are a muslim, you should be an orthodox christian as your ancestors" they got offended. If you somewhat know how these (pontic) people are then you understand what im speaking of, we Turks know them as very hard people to joke about, they can joke but if you go too personal...Ouch LOL
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 09:55
Well,Mortaza, i dont think that somebody should call "Greek" these people.
They are turkish citizens,with pontian greek ancestry and nothing more.
We  are talking a times that  turks and greeks were killing each other. at that  times  noone  cared about   citizenship.
Of course when an assimilation progress ends,its reasonable that the people assimilated feel foreign (or even hostile ,when used by governments) towards their ex-ancestors.
 
My friend it is christian greeks who created hatred, not turk  one.
 
The point is that these people shouldnt be forced t oloose their unique cultural identity,beyond "nationalities" or territorial claims.
 
True
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  Quote bg_turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 11:51
Originally posted by Digenis


The point is that these people shouldnt be forced t oloose their unique cultural identity,beyond "nationalities" or territorial claims.


For once we agree...
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  Quote bg_turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 11:54
Originally posted by Mortaza

Well,  my village(still) speak  pontian without no restriction, there were even some pontian songs.


Mortaza, some time ago you mentioned that the name of your village has been changed from its original to a "more Turkish" one. Could you please elaborate on this?


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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 14:51
well, older name was macdenos, new one is ormancık.
 
But this is not only happened to my village, but a lot of other villages too. Even some cities. Like Dersim(most probably kurdish or armenian) to Tunceli.
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