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Q: After Alexander the Great (Hellenistic Kingdoms) |
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Sharrukin 
Chieftain 
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1314 |
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 Topic: Q: After Alexander the Great (Hellenistic Kingdoms)Posted: 26-May-2006 at 23:29 |
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Okay, I think what happened is that the Kaktos version is simply using a different volume scheme than the LCS. For instance:
Kaktos volume 14 equals Diodorus book 18 which equals LCS volume 9a
Kaktos volume 15 equals Diodorus book 19 which equals LCS volumes 9b and 10a
Kaktos volume 16 equals Diodorus book 20 which equals LCS volume 10b
Kaktos volume 17 equals Diodorus books 21-40 which equals LCS volumes 11 and 12.
The neat thing about the Kaktos version is at least it keeps a complete Diodorus book in one volume instead of splitting it apart as is done in the LCS version.
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akritas
Chieftain
Hegemom Joined: 17-Sep-2005 Location: Greek Macedonia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1460 |
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Posted: 25-May-2006 at 11:32 |
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Sharrukin you are right as about the numbers of the books. Yours numbers are the specific from the Diodoros work. I used the book numbers that given from the Kaktos publisher ,the biggest publisher in the Greece as about the ancient writers. |
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Sharrukin
Chieftain
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1314 |
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Posted: 25-May-2006 at 03:57 |
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Hmmm, according to the Loeb Classical Series, the chronology of the books goes like this:
LCS Diodorus Siculus, volume 9
Book 18 - 323 to 317 BC
Book 19a - 317 to 315 BC
LCS Diodorus Siculus, volume 10
Book 19b - 314 to 311 BC
Book 20 - 310 to 302 BC
LCS Diodorus Siculus, volume 11
fragments of Books 21 to 32 -
301 to 145 BC
LCS Diodorus Siculus, volume 12
fragments of Books 33 to 40 -
145 to 61 BC
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akritas
Chieftain
Hegemom Joined: 17-Sep-2005 Location: Greek Macedonia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1460 |
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Posted: 24-May-2006 at 09:46 |
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Agree Sharrukin as about Diodoros Siculus.In my opinion is the best ancient writer as about the chronicle of the events. The books that you said are the
Book 14.....323-318 B.C.
Book 15.....317-311 B.C.
Book 16.....310-302 B.C.
Book 17......quotes from events in 301-60 B.C.
For the Hellenistic period used as sourses writers such as Ieronimos and Douris the Samian.
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Sharrukin
Chieftain
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1314 |
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Posted: 23-May-2006 at 22:32 |
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A very good original source for the earlier history of the Diadochi is Diodorus Siculus, Books XVIII to XX, which gives a description of events found in no other sources for the period, 323 to 301 BC. The rest of the books of Diodorus Siculus are in fragments, but still give some good details for the period from 301 BC and onwards. One available source for the history of Diodorus Siculus is the Loeb Classical Library, which can be ordered online, depending on availability. My set of volumes for the period in question begin with Diodorus Siculus, volume IX of the series.
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YusakuJon3
Shogun 
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 223 |
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Posted: 21-May-2006 at 08:48 |
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Could you name one or two of those journals and where I'm likely to find them?
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"There you go again!"
-- President Ronald W. Reagan (directed towards reporters at a White House press conference, mid-1980s) |
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Imperator Invictus
Caliph 
Retired AE Administrator Joined: 07-Aug-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3151 |
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Posted: 16-May-2006 at 20:38 |
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http://www.seleukids.org/texts.html
...has sources on the Seleucids. If you're looking for recent fragmentary writing, your best bet is to look in research journals, but those are hard to find available to the public on the internet. |
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YusakuJon3
Shogun
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 223 |
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Posted: 14-May-2006 at 09:08 |
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I've decided to give this thread a bump since I didn't want to start a new thread on basically the same subject...
Upon refreshing my memory on the subject of Alexander's successors (the Diadochi) and their respective kingdoms after his death, I wanted to see if there was anything new developing in the field of study on this subject. There was recently a discovery of ancient manuscripts said to be of the period of the Kushan dynasty that succeeded the Graeco-Bactrians, but no translations have been made public. What we have so far are those fragmentary writings from the Roman archives, a few hints to Hellenic sources written during the Diadochi era and the bits gathered from the histories of India and Iran. My guess is that it's going to take a while for the newly discovered manuscripts to be translated and that it's not guaranteed to be a history of the region so much as a religious scripture (the Kushan dynasty was known for spreading Bhuddism beyond its Indian roots, after all). Could someone give me an outline of the following to guide me in finding further sources on the Diadochi kingdoms and their successors?
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"There you go again!"
-- President Ronald W. Reagan (directed towards reporters at a White House press conference, mid-1980s) |
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Guests
Guest 
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Posted: 30-Apr-2005 at 19:51 |
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I guess you mean Menandros who was at first, general of Demetrios, King of Bactria. Menandros established a strong state and succeed to continue the politics of Alexander more than anyone of his diadochi. He spread his power until Himaliyas and the basin of Ganges and later he invaded deeper, conguering the city of Pataliputra (Ancient Greeks called it Palibothra) today known as Patna. With this campaign Menandros got himself into Indian tradition. According to this tradition, Greek invaders left from the country when they started fighting eachother. Though there was an ancient inscription in front of a cave, out of the Indian city of Orissa, which was written in it, Greek kings left the place because of the forward march of the amry of a king called Kallinga. Menandros was introduced to buddhism, he enriched it with the ideology of Greek philosophy and he got a distinguished position in Indian tradition under the name of Milinda. He is worshipped even today in Tayland as a god. Many coins of King Menandros have been found in the area of Candahar and to northern areas. Its remarkable and a sample of the spreading of trade of Graeco-Indian state of Bactria that coins of Menandros have been found even in Wales! These coins have both Indian and Greek letters which underlines the respect Menandros showed to Indian civilization, religion and tradition in general. |
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Temujin
King 
Sirdar Bahadur Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: Eurasia Online Status: Offline Posts: 5221 |
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Posted: 23-Nov-2004 at 13:33 |
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for this question check out the most recent thread in the iranian subforum about the Saka tribes. and it's not really known for certain how some tribes are related, it's also quite dificult to keep track with the nomads as they moved around a lot and joined other tribal goups very often... |
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YusakuJon3
Shogun
Joined: 04-Aug-2004 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 223 |
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Posted: 23-Nov-2004 at 05:35 |
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For one, I'm curous about just how the various peoples of the Asian
steppe and Iranian plateau actually related to one another. Most
of my reading in history has been focused on the Greek and Roman
civilizations and how they influenced European culture, so their POV
hasn't exactly been as objective on this subject as modern culture has
been. More recent efforts in the field at this point are more or
less restricted because of ongoing conflicts in the region.
In the case of the Scythians, I reiterate the question as to whether or not they evolved into another nation or were absorbed by those with whom they had contact. A passage in Gibbon's book mentions the eastern Romans (of Byzantium) sending an expedition to 'Scythia' during the 4th Century AD, for instance. Perhaps there was still a recognizable Scythian culture at that point. |
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"There you go again!"
-- President Ronald W. Reagan (directed towards reporters at a White House press conference, mid-1980s) |
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Yiannis
Sultan 
Joined: 03-Aug-2004 Location: Neutral Zone Online Status: Offline Posts: 2329 |
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Posted: 23-Nov-2004 at 02:54 |
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And I suggest to both of you to smoke the peace-pipe and cut this line of confrontation. Preferably as of now! If anyone feels like continuing, he can do it via PM! I think that Temujin was a bit harsh on you but I also think that he was right to mention that Scythes were an Iranian tribe. |
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The basis of a democratic state is liberty. Aristotle, Politics
Those that can give up essential liberty to obtain a temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin |
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Romano Nero
Samurai 
Joined: 16-Nov-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 132 |
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Posted: 23-Nov-2004 at 01:53 |
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Are many people on this board excessively rude and arrogant as you? Or is it just that you are young and immature and that's the only way you know to express your opinion on something? Even if you are right on the topic (which I seriously doubt) your rudeness is not really appreciated. |
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Temujin
King
Sirdar Bahadur Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: Eurasia Online Status: Offline Posts: 5221 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 15:20 |
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OK. Sakas are Indo-Iranian nomads that include major tribes of which the westernmost (living in the Ukrainian Steppe) tribe is commonly called Scythians (divided itself into smaller tribal untis, like royal scythians etc). the parthians are another major Saka tribe divided into seven sub-tribes or clans, which are the Parni, Suren, Karen, Dahae, Sohae, Mihran, and the Aspahapet. so actually parthian and Parnii is NOT the same, and you didn't even knew that Scythians were Iranians, so i think that YOU are GREATLY off track... i recommend you to check out the iranian sub-forum of our site that will greatly enlight you i'm pretty sure of...
oh, and just to add, Persians and Medes are iranics as well, just like the Saka... Edited by Temujin |
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Romano Nero
Samurai
Joined: 16-Nov-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 132 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 15:12 |
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I do not think that you are up to mastering the fine art of sarcasm yet, my friend. You said that Parnii are Sacae-Skythic I said that Parnii are Iranian people, not Skythes You said that Sacae are Iranian and I replied that definitely the Skythes are not even close on having anything to do with Iranians. So, who doesn't know what he's talking about? |
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Temujin
King
Sirdar Bahadur Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: Eurasia Online Status: Offline Posts: 5221 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 15:05 |
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uhm sorry but do you actually know what you're talking about?
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Romano Nero
Samurai
Joined: 16-Nov-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 132 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 15:02 |
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I am not sure if the Sacae were Iranians, but if they were they didn't have anything to do with the Skythians - those were definitely not Iranians and we all know that well. The Iranians are not that wide group of people... except if you are looking for the term "Aryans", but then you'd have to include many, many others under that umbrella |
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Temujin
King
Sirdar Bahadur Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: Eurasia Online Status: Offline Posts: 5221 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 12:14 |
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the Saka were themselvs Iranians, the Iranians include a wide group of peoples.
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Romano Nero
Samurai
Joined: 16-Nov-2004 Online Status: Offline Posts: 132 |
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Posted: 22-Nov-2004 at 02:14 |
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None of my readings supports this view. The Parnii are considered of Iranian origin (or Iranic-like) in all sources I've got at my disposal. You got any source stating they were Sacae or Scythic? |
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Temujin
King
Sirdar Bahadur Joined: 02-Aug-2004 Location: Eurasia Online Status: Offline Posts: 5221 |
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Posted: 21-Nov-2004 at 13:12 |
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the house of Sassan was a Persian dynasty, while the Parthians were a Saka (Scythian) tribe.
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