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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Seljuk architecture:
    Posted: 02-Oct-2006 at 15:52
"Seljuk Baroque Portal"
 
The amazing journey of "Baroque architecture", from Seljuk Architecture passed to European in 16th century then later back to Ottoman architecture.
 
Here are a few examples
 
Sivas- Divrigi Hospital and Mosque complex, Unesco World Heritage Site
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Karatay-Medresse
 
 
 
Sivas-CifteMinare
 
 
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Oct-2006 at 17:52
 Twin-Madrassa-Sifaiye
 
First Mental Hospital in the world, one of the early and leading medical faculties, medical school and universies, also one of the first "state hospitals" free to the public.
 
 

 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
The Legend of Twin Madrasa follows; Gevher Nesibe Sultan fell in love with the chief of the cavalry saldiers of the palace.

       The brother of Gevher Nesibe; Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I who was Seljuk's mler at that time, objected to this marriage. He ordered Gevher's lover to join a battle where he died and became a martyr.

       Afterwards, feeling very sorry, Gevher Nesibe Sultan became sick and developed tuberculosis.       When Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I was informed of his sisters ilness, he visited her. He had apologized to her about the situation and requested that she makes her last wish. Than Gevher Nesibe Sultan teIls that "I am very ill. There is no way to recovere, none of the doctors can help me. FinaIly, i will pass away. i wish, you would use my property to build a hospital which is devoted to me! In this hospital, the sick people are to be treated with no charge, at the same time incurable ilness are being looked after. This hospital must be a foundation devoted to me."

       Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I felt very sorry about being the cause of his sister's ilness. He carried out her last wish and began to build this hospital in 1204. The building was fınished within two years and put in to service in 1206. Later, at the east of the hospital (Şifahane), the Medical Madrasa was build in between 1210 - 1214, by İzzeddin Keykavus; At Şifahiye, sick people who had been cured, were not supposed to payaccording to the testament of Gevher Nesibe Sultan an other brother of Gevher Nesibe Sultan.

 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
It was built by Seljukian Sultanate Giyaseddin Keyhusrev in accordance with Gevher Nesibes testament. It's hospital section was started its service in 1206.  At 1210-1219, medical madrasa section was added to the building complex by Izettin Keykavus. The building complex is situated at  Yenice Hacı İkiz District in Kayseri.
 

The most important feature of this complex was being the first mental hospital and medical education building in the world. It was the second hospital complex built during the Seljukian sovereign.

 
One of the significant parts of the building is its hospital sections portal. There were lots of Seljukian ornamentation and when looked carefully, you can see an illusion of a woman face in the muqarnas niche. This portal is one of the earliest built in the 13th century Anatolia, dominant motive was geometrical.
 

Gevher Nesibe Complex, at all, has a simple geometrical planning. Both hospital section and medical madrasa section have an open plan type courtyard with 4 iwans. In spite of the building complex has very rough picturesque as all Seljukian monumental buildings from outside without portals, some feminine tricks could have been seen over all its planning and construction.  It was built with a sense of feminizing of a Seljukian woman with her shy impression from outside and sensitive feelings inside.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
All photo's thanks to Burhanettin Akbaş, more photo's at this site.
 
 
 
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  Quote cushla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Oct-2006 at 05:04
were these designs used by the romans in baroque architecture in the 15 and 16th centuries
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Oct-2006 at 15:23
Cushla I think this style moved to Europe around the 15th-16th Century and was further developed there.
 
Alanya-Kizil Kule-Tersane-Fortress....
 
Located on the Mediterrannean coast of Turkey, Alanya was a key port, trading area and of strategic importance. The Kizil Kule is a great example of Millitary buildings of the era and is one of the best preserved. The tower is 30 m tall and protected the Arsenal and neigbouring Tersane-Shipyard, it was built in 1226.
 
 
Photo by Murat Tolga
 
 
Photo by RmzOzTurk
 
img177/6680/alanya11lb9.jpg < =text/>setImgWidth();  
 
img525/7994/01hakan01hpim0728ps2.jpg < =text/>setImgWidth();  
 
Photo by 01Hakan01
 
img424/9905/01hakan01hpim0741cm4.jpg < =text/>setImgWidth();  
 
Photo by 01Hakan01
 
Tersane-Shipyard
 
 
img105/189/alanya07rv0.jpg < =text/>setImgWidth();  
 
img505/3014/alanya19sy1.jpg < =text/>setImgWidth();  
 
 
Thanks to
 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 05-Oct-2006 at 15:25
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2006 at 13:21
Antalya- Yivli Minare Complex 13th Century
 
 
The minaret, known as Yivli after its semi-circular flanks, is the oldest structure of an informal religious complex located in the historic castle of Antalya that consists of a mosque, madrasa, Mevlevi lodge (mevlevihane) and two domed tombs. A marble inscription at the base of the minaret names Seljuk Sultan Ala al-Din Kay Qubadh I (1220-1237) as its builder.
 

The brick minaret is located to the east of the mosque, about four and a half meters away from its southeast corner. It was restored by the General Directorate of Museums (Mzeler Genel Mdrlg) in 1953 and stabilized further in 1973. It stands on a stone base that is six and a half meters tall and five and a half meters wide. The upper corners of the base are chamfered to meet an octagonal transition zone carved with a blind niche on each side. Little remains of the mosaic of turquoise and cobalt-blue tiles decorating the niches of this zone. The eight semi-circular flanks of the shaft begin above a narrow circular ring and taper slightly inward before terminating at a second circular band below the stone muqarnas consoles of the balcony. Blue glazed tiles woven into every other row of the brick shaft create an illusion of stripes traveling up the flanks. The minaret ends with a simple cylindrical turret above the balcony and is capped with a lead-covered conical cap. The simple stone balustrade of its balcony may be a later addition.

 
ERENGIN-PHOTO
 
 
 
 ALPUS=PHOTO
 MUJDAT-PHOTO
 
OKHAN-PHOTO
 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 11-Oct-2006 at 13:28
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  Quote ok ge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2006 at 13:58
beautiful photos bulldog. The Seljuk minaret you posted looks like a combination of Ummayid architecture (short thick minarets) and Ottoman minerates (tall thin minarets). I persume that I see Seljuk architecture as the parent of later Ottoman mosque architecture.

Edited by ok ge - 11-Oct-2006 at 14:02
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Oct-2006 at 14:05
Shukran akhiSmile
 
Yes it is interesting, infact if I remember correctly the Millitary Tower in Alanya which I posted before the last minaret was built with help of a famous Syrian Architect from either Halab or Damascus.
 
I think Seljuk architecture has been really overlooked in the past.
 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 11-Oct-2006 at 14:07
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  Quote arch.buff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Oct-2006 at 21:40
Seljuk architecture didnt start the Baroque movement of either architecture or art. The baroque style(which has many facest, architecture, art, music etc) was started in the very late 16th and very early 17th centuries. The movement was started in Italy by the Roman Catholic Church for what many would say an answer for the reformation. The Church needed something in this time to reassert its dominance and influence and the way they did this was they manifested this new and colorful style which for the Church as they saw it kinda legitimized why someone would want to stay Catholic. There are many other factors and reasons why the Baroque style emerged none of which was started by seljuk architecture, as far as I know. Its a well known idea thru architects that St. Peters in Rome is seen as the precurssor to Baroque. The Baroque style then spread through Europe and eventually to the Americas all via Italy.
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Oct-2006 at 10:28
The Baroque effect, using caligraphy and vegetal motives in this manner are first noted as being developed by the Seljuks.
 
This has been documented by an number of scholors
 
For example.
 
Hoag, J.D. (1987) 'Islamic architecture', Faber & Faber London
Professor Aslanapa, Turkish Art and Architecture    
 
 
It was adopted in Itally at a later date and then spread to Europe.


Edited by Bulldog - 14-Oct-2006 at 10:29
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Oct-2006 at 16:02
Seljouks build more in anatolia in 200 years then the Ottomans did in anatolia for 600 years, plus the Seljouki capital Konya whas wholly destroyed once by the mongols.


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  Quote arch.buff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Oct-2006 at 17:40
The styles seem similar but do you have any references that the seljuks influenced the Baroque movement in Italy. All sources I can find mostly contribute this influence from the Renaissance.
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Oct-2006 at 18:00
The sources on this matter are growing, unfortunately Seljuk architecture hasn't recieved wide-spread study and analysis like other types. Those who have researched and documented it have noted this feature of intrigue and called it the "Seljuk Baroque Portal". There was contact between Turkey and Itally at this time, during the crusades, the Venetian and genoise traders, plus Turkish workshops in comercial areas of Itally. The sources regarding what they have termed "Seljuk Baroque" mostly specialise in Islamic and Turkish architecture and havn't comented on how they feel it got to Itally in serious details. Hopefully it will be explored in detail soon because its very interesting how similar the two are.
 
It would make the story of "Baroque" architecture a really fascinating one even more than it already is. If it began with the Seljuks, later re-surfaced in Itally spread to Europe and then made a trip back to Anatolia. There are many, many examples of this style in Seljuk architecture, the Seljuks built so many buildings across Anatolia. CaravanSarays, Bridges, Hospitals, Mosques, Palaces, Civic buildings and so on, its really extensive.
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  Quote Kapikulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Oct-2006 at 19:51
The Seljuks had given a lot to Anatolia, and left dozens of architectural masterpieces, unlike the Ottomans who rather focused on several huge cities on the different regions of the wide empire
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  Quote Gun Powder Ma Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Oct-2006 at 21:53
Very nice pics, I was not aware that the Seljuks were so avid architecture fans, although I have been to Turkey two times.

Originally posted by Bulldog

There was contact between Turkey and Itally at this time, during the crusades, the Venetian and genoise traders, plus Turkish workshops in comercial areas of Itally.


The Seljuk dynasty ended in Asia Minor in 1307, but the Baroque art did not begin in Italy before 1600. What could explain a gap of almost 300 years?
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Oct-2006 at 12:46

I agree, Seljuk architecture was quite amazing, in a short time they had an architectural explosion and built so much.

The Seljuk state "officially" ended at your stated date, however, the Beylik states were basically Seljuks continued but with their own regional power. The Karamanid state was the most powerfull Beylik state after the Ottomans and lasted into the 15th century.
 
The Seljuk architectural style was used by all the Beyliks and went through a number of adaptations and changed eventually arriving at Ottoman Classical architecture.
 
Regarding the "Seljuk Baroque Portal" it carried on being made after the collapse of the Seljuks.
 
The only connection I can make regarding how (and if) Baroque style got to Itally is, Venetian-Genoise traders and trading posts, Turkish workshops in Venice, the Ottoman-Itallian contact in the Fatih Mehmed II period......
 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 19-Oct-2006 at 12:53
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  Quote Gun Powder Ma Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Oct-2006 at 15:41
The best explanation for the creation of Baroque is still endogenous. Baroque came into being as a reaction to the Reformation. The opulent style was meant to impress the believers, to bring them visually and emotionally nearer to the splendour of God. And the end of Baroque was just as endogenous when people like Voltaire criticised and ridiculed Baroque as a 'crutch' for believers. Therefore, I do not think that similarities between Baroque and this Seljuk gate are more than superficial.
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Oct-2006 at 16:34
The problem is Seljuk architecture has recieved hardly any serious attention (regarding studies, investigations etc) in comparison to other architecture styles of the Middle East/Europe.
 
The Baroque style designs that appear in Seljuk architecture are very interesting and similar to that of Itallian Baroque, it would be great if there was a proper study into the matter.
 
Often in architecture themes appear, dissapear, re-appear and so on, if there is a connection it would be interesting, if there wasn't it would great to find out more about the style.
 
There are many possibilities but unfortunately for now few answers.
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Oct-2006 at 19:04
Originally posted by Gun Powder Ma

Very nice pics, I was not aware that the Seljuks were so avid architecture fans, although I have been to Turkey two times.

because Seljuk architecture is mainly vieuwable in eastern and mid anatolian city's, Seljuk dynasty whas a real anatolian dynasty and actually build the foundations of the Ottoman dynasty.

I am a real fan of Seljouk architecture, because it has something more Turkic elements in it. All the entrance of buildings where made of big doors (qapu wich is still called so in central asia and in Turkey) wich had something todo with ancient shamanistic beliefs. Also the minaret style of the Seljouks is the most accepted style of minarets in hole the world, seljouks callled it "yivli minare".
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  Quote Kapikulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Oct-2006 at 20:50
Originally posted by Bulldog

 Twin-Madrassa-Sifaiye
 
First Mental Hospital in the world, one of the early and leading medical faculties, medical school and universies, also one of the first "state hospitals" free to the public.
 
 

 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
The Legend of Twin Madrasa follows; Gevher Nesibe Sultan fell in love with the chief of the cavalry saldiers of the palace.

       The brother of Gevher Nesibe; Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I who was Seljuk's mler at that time, objected to this marriage. He ordered Gevher's lover to join a battle where he died and became a martyr.

       Afterwards, feeling very sorry, Gevher Nesibe Sultan became sick and developed tuberculosis.       When Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I was informed of his sisters ilness, he visited her. He had apologized to her about the situation and requested that she makes her last wish. Than Gevher Nesibe Sultan teIls that "I am very ill. There is no way to recovere, none of the doctors can help me. FinaIly, i will pass away. i wish, you would use my property to build a hospital which is devoted to me! In this hospital, the sick people are to be treated with no charge, at the same time incurable ilness are being looked after. This hospital must be a foundation devoted to me."

       Gıyaseddin Keyhsrev I felt very sorry about being the cause of his sister's ilness. He carried out her last wish and began to build this hospital in 1204. The building was fınished within two years and put in to service in 1206. Later, at the east of the hospital (Şifahane), the Medical Madrasa was build in between 1210 - 1214, by İzzeddin Keykavus; At Şifahiye, sick people who had been cured, were not supposed to payaccording to the testament of Gevher Nesibe Sultan an other brother of Gevher Nesibe Sultan.

 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
It was built by Seljukian Sultanate Giyaseddin Keyhusrev in accordance with Gevher Nesibes testament. It's hospital section was started its service in 1206.  At 1210-1219, medical madrasa section was added to the building complex by Izettin Keykavus. The building complex is situated at  Yenice Hacı İkiz District in Kayseri.
 

The most important feature of this complex was being the first mental hospital and medical education building in the world. It was the second hospital complex built during the Seljukian sovereign.

 
One of the significant parts of the building is its hospital sections portal. There were lots of Seljukian ornamentation and when looked carefully, you can see an illusion of a woman face in the muqarnas niche. This portal is one of the earliest built in the 13th century Anatolia, dominant motive was geometrical.
 

Gevher Nesibe Complex, at all, has a simple geometrical planning. Both hospital section and medical madrasa section have an open plan type courtyard with 4 iwans. In spite of the building complex has very rough picturesque as all Seljukian monumental buildings from outside without portals, some feminine tricks could have been seen over all its planning and construction.  It was built with a sense of feminizing of a Seljukian woman with her shy impression from outside and sensitive feelings inside.

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
This is a Burhanettin Akbaş photograph
 
 
All photo's thanks to Burhanettin Akbaş, more photo's at this site.
 
 
 
 
Ah now Bulldog,you made me miss my hometown, Kayseri
We gave up your happiness
Your hope would be enough;
we couldn't find neither;
we made up sorrows for ourselves;
we couldn't be consoled;

A Strange Orhan Veli
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  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Oct-2006 at 17:47
Seljuk bridge examples
 
Malabadi Bridge
 
 
 
denizozhararkermit image
 
 
 
bakikarakoc image
 
 
The Kesikkpr Bridge
 
 

Eğrikpr in Sivas

 

Yildiz Bridge in Sivas

 
Tavsan bridge
 
Eseroglu image
 


Edited by Bulldog - 20-Oct-2006 at 17:52
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