Which is the most powerful European power

If your asking my perspective, not sure, Ihsan sent me a good link once on the Turkish air force. They seem formiddable but outdated by European standards.Dont have the numbers on the industrial capabilities and economy in front of me to balance it all. Certainly behind the major powers, where would you place Turkiye?

Just a curious, how is European NATO's powers compared to the USA militarily? Are they very behind or just a little? I'm talking about from equippment to training and morale. There are articles that claim USA spent so much on military that the NaTOs find did hard to keep up anymore. Lets say how much Nato troops would be equivalent of 10,000 American troops.

Originally posted by TheDiplomat In Nato we are second behind the USA in terms of convetional forces,pal. in Europe(interms of whole military terms),we would be behind France,England,Russia and Germany  i guess.we must be more stronger than spain and italy.

You're kidding right? Turkey is partially impressive with her F16s, and her large army, but she in no way can compete with the likes of Italy and Spain. Both of them have larger economies, which means they can outlast Turkey in any war. Italy and Spain's fleets are world class, and will make mince-meat out of the Turkish fleet (and I'm not talking about Italy and Spain combined, I mean individually). Also, Italy, if there will ever be war between itself and Turkey (heaven forbid), it can comfortably sit down and prepare itself, without fearing any Turkish aerial attack.

That's because Turkey's air force would have to plow through Greece and violate other nations' airspace to actually launch any kinds of attacks on either Italian islands or the mainland. I can't see that happening. Spain is the same way. Spain is way too far for Turkey to reach. And invasion? Impossible, so there is no fear of an attacking Turkish army (just like Turkey would need not fear a military invasion of herself). But the Turkish government needs to realize that it has an enemy in its own backyard - the Kurds. We all know the Kurds would revolt if it went to war against any opponent. I would place Turkey around 7th, after Russia, France, England, Germany, Italy, and Spain (in Europe). Turkey is ahead of Greece, because although Greece has more advanced technology (or so said), Turkey's is only slightly less effective, and it has much more weapons to play with.

Let's repeat that officially "The Turkish army is the second most powerful in NATO after the American army" and remember at the same time that NATO includes all major European countries. Add to this fact that Turks have been known to be the best warriors through out the history, that's why the word "Turk" got it's dictionary meaning. So, whenever you talk about a war, you will be talking about "Turks" who will get back to their nature to save their land and maybe gain some more fighting with a "sissy nationality" that consists of individuals who want to live their individual life. And you need to read some history before talking about outlasting or mince-meating the Turks, you would be surprised, some recent history will show you how. Every nation has an enemy in it's own backyard when it becomes weak or gets involved in a war, don't even get in there, that's how World Wars start. Although your list sounds nice, I know you want to be proud, but I would definitely kick almost all of those countries -including Italy- behind Turkey. You are wrong about Greece as well. ---"Turks are one of the rare nations which has never been ruled by any other nation than itself that ruled many."

Both of them have larger economies

can be.

In a war,being quick,strenth and number of forces are more important.

Turkey has the seventh most powerful army in the world.In front of Turkey there are USA,China,North Korea,Russia.The other two are not Europeans.

Ukraine and Germany both have more tanks and France, Germany and UK have more aircraft, and then there is the navy.
Manpower alone isn't everything, the US has a smaller army in manpower terms than some other countries, should we thus rank them 4th or 5th?

Its in both actualy

You good European you 

You can talk to me about how fierce the Turks are as warriors, but you forget one thing.  This isn't the middle ages.

Today what matters most is what kind of equipment an army has, how trained the troops, are, and how long a country can keep the supply lines running.  Not how fierce the warrior is.

are you joking?

N.O.I.A.M.N.O.T

Today what matters most is what kind of equipment an army has, how trained the troops, are, and how long a country can keep the supply lines running.  Not how fierce the warrior is

It is Turkey!

Supply lines?Turkey has a regular war-mobilization system.It works good although we have less money.

And if you follow up Nato's manouevres Turkish soldiers and commandos always have medals or awards.They do the best.

Edited by Jagatai Khan