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red clay
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Topic: Why do Civilizations rise and fall? Posted: 25-Aug-2011 at 08:36 |
We will try this again. There is no AE crisis team. This person has lost there mind, if they had one to start with.
This thread is closed. Both Shokdee and Iamshokdee are the same, both are suspended.
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"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
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shokdee
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Posted: 25-Aug-2011 at 08:13 |
We can confirm that the user account known as "shokdee" has been hijacked!
We are trying everything in our power to control the situation!
Our legal team have advised us that THERE IS NO VALID LEGAL THREAT from "shokdee"
AE Special Crisis Team Bulletin:AECST-001-001
Standby for more information. Out technical teams are working on a response and will report shortly.
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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Guests
Guest
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Posted: 25-Aug-2011 at 08:07 |
>>> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< >>>>> URGENT EVERYONE READ THIS PLEASE <<<<<< >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <<<<
There is some f**king weird shit happening on this forum!
I have been away for the last week on an archaeological dig at Kao Cave. When I returned to the All Empires Forum I found that someone has hacked my user account!
Some slimy bastard has been posting here under my name!
All that shit that was posted as shokdee is not me!
I am the real shokdee!
Please you have to believe me, I am the real shokdee.
I demand that the moderators kill the account of user shokdee immediately.
You will be held liable for legal damages if anything is posted under my name on this forum!
I hereby give you full legal authority to terminate the old account known as "shokdee" with immediate effect.
Everyone reading these words is my witness, so help me God.
Signed: Mr Paragon Shokdee
25 August 2011 Bangkok Thailand
From now on I'll post under the name of IamShokdee OK.
Remember IamShokdee is the real shokdee.
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shokdee
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Posted: 25-Aug-2011 at 02:11 |
Last week this thread had less then 9 views, now it's over 7,220. Can someone from technical support look into this error please? Maybe you should upgrade from the free version, I read it's full of bugs. Thanks - x - Moderator techno wrote: Thank you for spotting this technical error, we are also looking at it. We are trying not to let our astonishment cloud our judgment. We assure you that all our software was bought on credit. AE MODERATOR (loving support team) AE TECHNICAL SUPPORT: Our Customer Satisfaction Rating is currently at 12%. We can really do with your support. Vote with your mouse. If you can help: CLICK HERE- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - User shokdee wrote: Thank you for your quick response, but the figures are still
climbing. Are you certain your servers
are not infected with a virus?
- x -
Moderator heavyhanded wrote: You're embarrassing yourself with these childish attempts at humor. User Shokdee has now left the building <-- get the hint or else! The rest of you can claim a full refund* at the door. We sincerely apologize to our regular visitors. We're trying to block all the IP addresses of this slippery sonofabitchz. Your patience is required. AE MODERATOR (hardcore support team) * The usual terms and conditions apply. By "full refund" we do not necessarily imply a full refund. AE TECHNICAL SUPPORT: A total of 24 hours service. There is no question, we can't answer. Try it yourself. Ask now: CLICK HERE- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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********************************************************************
IMPORTANT SECURITY WARNING - ALL USERS PLEASE READ
*********************************************************************
We have successfully tracked down one IP address of user
shokdee.
It appears to be a malicious web-bot launched from North
Korea or Iran, or both.
For you own security we are recommending that anyone who has downloaded
any of its material should perform a through virus scan of their computer immediately.
If you were unlucky enough to read any of its posts and are feeling unwell consult your doctor as soon as possible.
We are setting up a special crisis center to provide additional help and
support.
If you think you have been infected or want more information CLICK
HERE
Folks, this is not a practical joke. The situation is mildly serious. Please stay tuned as we will be releasing another security alert when we get more information. We have experts in psychological, biological, chemical and nautical warfare on our hardcore support team who are assessing the situation every minute. Your welfare is our top concern. Whatever you do, don't panic.AE Special Crisis Team
Edited by shokdee - 25-Aug-2011 at 07:14
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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shokdee
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Posted: 24-Aug-2011 at 07:21 |
Originally posted by erkut
I think Ibn-Khaldun was the first one who searched ansver of this question. |
User FM-123 wrote: Abū Zayd ‘Abdu r-Raḥman bin Muḥammad bin Khaldūn Al-Hadrami aka Ibn-Khaldun. In Tunisia, I bought a large commemorative medal minted in his honour. User Bouncer wrote:
Do you know that his works were only discovered
in the 19th century but this knowledge spread backwards in time to influence 17th century
historians? User FM-123 wrote: As a matter of fact I did know that. User SpinelessLurker wrote: What's the question again? User E=MC2 wrote: Do asabiyyah cycles explain America's ongoing collapse?
User DJ Elastic wrote:
Yoyo yo, sisters and brothers, what's going down? Spastic is a god-given natural talent. Fully deserved to win the scratching championship last year. Peace and respect, DJ Elastic
User audiofile wrote:
Double up this DJ! Why is the Elastic Band silent? Were you overstretched?
User Bouncer wrote: Can we divorce Asabiyyah from Khaldun ?
User GaryK wrote: Good gambit comrade
User AlxJns wrote:
Dont trust google results
User CRUNCHTHYME wrote:
Hear me ROAR!!!!!!!!!! This is WAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hit the prancing fairies with HEAVY METAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MALTHOOZE YOU ROCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User blitzedinibiza wrote: @DJ Elastic - Spastic is a god-given natural talent.Respect. Love, DJ Spastic User DJ Fully wrote: @DJElastic - Fully deserved to win the scratching championship last year.you too elastic good governance dj fully
Edited by shokdee - 25-Aug-2011 at 01:47
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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erkut
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Posted: 24-Aug-2011 at 04:31 |
I think Ibn-Khaldun was the first one who searched ansver of this question. I advice you to check out his theory about "asabiya"...
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shokdee
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Posted: 23-Aug-2011 at 22:41 |
Originally posted by Karalem
There was a 19th century philosopher who by way of
studying history and its timeline came to the conclusion that cultures
come and go in a cyclic fashion. Sorry but his name
escapes me, starting with S. |
User FM-123 wrote:
Is it Socrates? He wrote a lot of history books. Maybe Siemans? Didn't he discover the washing cycle? Or was that Samsung?
User Bouncer wrote: Samsung discovered the spin cycle.
User audiofile wrote:
The new Paolo Sarpi CD is brilliant. His best work so far in
my opinion. ( 4 stars )
User blitzedinibiza wrote:
I saw him perform live at Cafe del Mar.
Beautiful beach, sun setting, happy people dancing.
Love, DJ Spastic
User AlxJns wrote:
Happy slaves lick stamps
User jjjollybone wrote:
What's wrong with licking stamps !?!
Tell me Einstein, how do you attach them to an envelope?
User audiofile wrote:
Oohppss sorry. I meant the new Parov Stelar CD is brilliant.
User blitzedinibiza wrote:
I saw him perform live at Cafe del Mar, too. Awesome.
Beautiful beach, sun setting, happy people dancing.
Love, DJ Spastic
User Bouncer wrote: Big Up DJ Spastic! The Man Is In De House! I saw you throwing a few epileptic fits at the Boom Boom Festival last year. Righteously memorable my brother.
User GaryK wrote: F6F5 WTF You're not Bobby Fischer!
User BobbyF wrote: Do you gonna play or moan like a whore?
User GaryK wrote: Comrade, with opening moves like that, how do you ever score?
User E=MC2 wrote: I use a damp sponge
Edited by shokdee - 25-Aug-2011 at 00:44
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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shokdee
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Posted: 22-Aug-2011 at 14:21 |
User DreadfullyGreat wrote: [QUOTE] bong [/QUOTE] Dude yo dsplay a vast ignorance evryone it callede a hubblybubbly how the maroon now? You! ha ha ha
User GaryK wrote: e2:e4
User FM-123 wrote: The correct term is in fact hooker.
User Bouncer wrote: Hookah you buffoon!
User FM-123 wrote: What's your problem? That is what I wrote. Can't you read?
User BobbyF wrote: F6-F5
User DreadfullyGreat wrote: FU2 dude
Edited by shokdee - 23-Aug-2011 at 23:24
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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shokdee
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Posted: 22-Aug-2011 at 12:23 |
Originally posted by shokdee
Does anyone play postal chess? |
User SpinelessLurker mumbled something. > You play chess Spineless?
bullshhzzz ssttmmppzzz hmm ggrrh
> What was that? You're dribbling. You like licking stamps?
User SpinelessLurker wrote: Thr is no collapze coz if ther was 1then I would kno n I don't kno so it can't be happening, ergo brutus sum, QED. Game over, I win. Put that in yor bloody bong and smoke it you maroon.
> Shokdee, any response?
Edited by shokdee - 23-Aug-2011 at 22:46
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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shokdee
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Posted: 22-Aug-2011 at 11:49 |
Does anyone play postal chess?
Anyone?
No?
How about ping-pong?
I will PONG outline my position, then you can PING offer a
counter view.
Here goes.
The topic Is
America collapsing?
---------------------------------------------
- - > Pong < - -
[Shokdee stands]
Yes, America is collapsing. The cause can be traced to the ruling
elite. I will argue that we are witnessing an event that has happened before:
an implosion of a countries' economy, a political and
economic takeover, manifested as wholesale looting and plunder.
This implosion is the result of acts of financial terrorism,
based on a shock doctrine, involving currency wars and economic hitmen. I will
trace it's philosophical-empirical roots back through Zero-growth, Malthus, to the
Venetian friar Paolo Sarpi.
I will explain that magic is used by the elite. They create
credit out of thin air and subject the populous to psychological manipulation - hyperwashing
- to entrance entire nations as "happy
slaves", trapped in a complex web of fantastic debt.
[Sits down]
< < ping > >
Edited by shokdee - 24-Aug-2011 at 13:21
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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shokdee
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 21:41 |
I'm still waiting for the graphics to load ! (I only get GPRS connection out here in the jungle). Done, that is a great idea for a creative writing exercise, painting a scenario.
You're suggesting it could be internal social unrest/revolution that will lead to America's collapse.
More likely, it is a symptom, not a cause.
Interesting because I can't think of any current theory for collapse that argues it could have been internal revolution. Has this been discussed as a mechanism or cause for the collapse of a civilization before?
In this thread I would like to deal with existing theories and models about collapse. What have the great thinkers put forward and does any of it seem to fit the facts. We can use America as a real-time model to TEST these theories and models.
Edited by shokdee - 22-Aug-2011 at 03:15
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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Nick1986
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 21:20 |
Shokdee, have a look at this topic for one theoretical scenario.
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Me Grimlock not nice Dino! Me bash brains!
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shokdee
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 21:04 |
We're skipping over the previous questions: 1) What is "America"? (an empire, a culture, a civilization, what?) 2) How did America arise, start, begin, get kick started? -----------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Nick1986
America's collapse won't happen for a long time. |
Deckchairs and the Titanick? 142,000,000 Google items about nothing? Crazy logic. Scan a dozen of the articles, they all talk about a collapse NOW UNDERWAY. If I close my eyes, I also see lovely pictures. > OK something is collapsing. I don't know what and I don't care. Back to GTA LA. There are dramatic shifts and HISTORIC CHANGES unfolding in front of your eyes, I suggest. If you want to wait til it's all over and then read the analysis in a book you pay 10 quid for, it's up to you. For me, this is what life is about - Responding to your environment, watching like a hawk, senses pricked, 6th, 7th and 8th senses locked and loaded, brain operating at top speed, always ready to catch the updraft, or swoop like a ... ah ..... Tomahawk.
Originally posted by Nick1986
Its fall will come from within |
Click back a page and read the post about Jared Diamond's views on Collapse. What do you mean " from within" - intestinal parasites? Internet downtime? earthquake?
Edited by shokdee - 21-Aug-2011 at 21:23
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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Nick1986
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 19:01 |
America's collapse won't happen for a long time. Its fall will come from within as any outside attack will surely lead to nuclear apocalypse
Edited by Nick1986 - 21-Aug-2011 at 19:02
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Me Grimlock not nice Dino! Me bash brains!
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Karalem
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 18:28 |
There was a 19th century philosopher who by way of studying history and its timeline came to the conclusion that cultures come and go in a cyclic fashion. Every culture has its beginning, bloom, and destruction. He made a long life struggle of it. Sorry but his name escapes me, starting with S.
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shokdee
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Posted: 21-Aug-2011 at 11:32 |
Hey! Yank Gringo GI Cowboy Paleface Mutherfluffer Citizen of the United States Compadre Homeboy Hey! Brothers and sisters
Look at your flag |* * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| | * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |* * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| | * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |* * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| | * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |* * * * * * * * * * OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO| |OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO|
Is America now collapsing?Google search: " war in Iraq" 26,800,000 results Google search: " collapse of America" 142,000,000 China 113,000,000 Japan 85,300,000 Germany 76,000,000 India 72,200,000 Thailand 18,400,000
Edited by shokdee - 25-Aug-2011 at 01:40
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shokdee
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Posted: 06-Aug-2011 at 05:47 |
Another look at environmental determinism.
Living in a tropical climate, where resource abundance is the
de facto condition, I noticed that a tropical civilization is qualitatively
different to a non-tropical civilization.
Necessity is the mother of invention is a
well-known truism. Since technology arises from needs (to extend the body if we follow
McLuhan) it follows that when needs are adequately fulfilled there is little
incentive to invent.
For example, in a tropical environment the body does not need
coverings for warmth, so humans go around naked or near naked, in contrast to a
cold climate which demands full body protection (from shoes to hats). Within
the equatorial band, there is no need for a solar calendar, a lunar calendar suffices.
Only outside of this band, where there are summers and winters, is there a need
to track solar changes.
If you continue along this line of thought - what tropical
people DO NOT NEED - you start to get a feel for the fundamental difference
that I am alluding to.
This does not mean that tropical societies have no needs and are
incapable of inventing. They are as inventive as any society in meeting their
needs. For instance, elaborate types of fish traps are required, so basketry is
highly developed. A technologically sophisticated culture can exist in a
tropical climate, but not really appear "on the radar" of a cold-climate
researcher, looking for something that's not there and missing the nuances of
what is there. A direct corollary relates to material culture. A tropical
civilization could have all it's needs met using only bio-degradable natural
resources - it would leave NO traces.
If there are little material remains to examine for evidence
of a past tropical civilization, we must identify it's remnants by other means;
linguistic, symbolic, cultural, and so on. If we extend my notion of a tropical
civilization to include it's aquatic component (sea shores and shallow seas, nearby
islands, large rivers, and so on) then it's traces emerge.
The word naga is the key to revealing this lost
tropico-aquatic civilization. Buckminster Fuller's comprehensive review of the
Earth's natural resources lead him to conclude that metallurgy must have
started in north eastern Thailand, and that this was the furthest reaches of the
original civilization, based in the western Pacific island complex (See, Critical
Path). Meanwhile, Thai Architect Sumet Jumsai had written a book about the
water symbolism underpinning Thai civilization. Together they produced a unique,
thought provoking book NAGA: Cultural origins in Siam and the West Pacific,
which explains their hypothesis about a prior aquatic civilization in greater
detail.
Based on these ideas I suggest some ways to distinguish
between a land/temperate and a water/tropical civilization:
LAND/TEMPERATE
vs WATER/TROPICAL
----------------------------------------------------
Land based symbolism and mythology ------- Water based
symbolism and mythology
Houses on land ------- Houses on stilts (if not on water)
Land-based towns --------
Canal-based water towns
Staple food is land grains ------- Staple food is aquatic
grain (rice) and aquatic resources
Uses compression in design -------- Uses tension in design
90 degrees / right angle geometry -------- Triangular geometry
2-way weaving only ------- 2 and 3-way weaving
Design for permanence -------- Materials are re-usable
Seasonal scarcity -------- Year round abundance
Closed concept of space -------- Open concept of space
Male orientated ------- Women play significant role
Domination and destruction ------- Integration and assimilation
Hierarchical, if not mono-theistic ------- All inclusive
animism
Can we locate this lost civilization in the now submerged
Sundra shelf? Another comprehensive book Eden in the East: The drowned
continent of southeast Asia by Stephen Oppenheimer develops the theory even
further, looking at geological, archaeological, genetic and linguistic evidence.
So the story could be as follows: A great tropical/aquatic
civilization (Atlantis) existed in what is now the Sundra shelf area. Environmental
changes drown the civilization, leading to mass migration: north along the coast
to China, west along the coast to India, east across the Pacific to south
America, and south through the Indonesian archipelago to Australia. The
survivors would go on to face their own challenges, kick-starting a second
phase of development, the one we are more familiar with. At this point it ties in with the ideas developed in Guns, germs and steel.
Edited by shokdee - 08-Aug-2011 at 00:53
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shokdee
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Posted: 05-Aug-2011 at 00:28 |
Bang on schedule, here's the Telegraph with, Barack Obama feasts while Rome burns. Do America’s ruling liberal elites think they are the new emperors? by Nile Gardiner, August 4th, 2011. Maybe he also read the Jared Diamond book? http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/nilegardiner/100099548/obama-feasts-while-rome-burns-do-america%E2%80%99s-ruling-liberal-elites-think-they-are-the-new-emperors/
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shokdee
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Posted: 04-Aug-2011 at 09:12 |
I recently skimmed through the subtly ominous Why the West rules .. for Now by Ian
Morris, one of those grandiose overviews. The
nearest thing to a unified field theory of history we are ever likely to get,
blabbers Niall Ferguson senselessly. The book is bellybutton fluff in my opinion, as meaningful as History of Santa's sleigh 1500 BC to 1500 AD and less exciting then Amanita is aviation fuel.
Diamond's environmental and geographic determinism sits comfortably with the
hip eco-crowd but I wonder if they've read his revisionist interpretation of
agriculture; The worst mistake in the history
of the human race, where he writes
"that the
adoption of agriculture ... was in many ways a catastrophe from which we have never
recovered." (Discover Magazine May 1987, pp. 64-66)
I'd pair the two classics, Guns,
germs, and steel and David Anthony's The horse, the wheel and language for a 3 + 3 symmetry (add Cathedral, forge, and waterwheel by the Gies brothers for 3 x 3). While
David is heavy and dry, Diamond is light and easy.
I'm surprised the more recent
Collapse: How societies choose to fail or
succeed by Jared Diamond was not referenced, as this is the more
pertinent book. This work is unique I think for going were no-one has dared go
before and recognizing the significant role of the whims of the power elite. Recall
the title, how societies choose to fail or succeed !
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ===== Just wanted to make sure you don't miss this ====
A point to consider: Is America a separate "civilization"?
If so, how did it "arise" and is it now "in decline",
"collapsing" or "falling"? <-------------------- 3 questions, not 1 ---
Is it "falling" due
to the usual factors (environmental degradation and resource depletion, wars and
invasion, famine and disease, technological inferiority, etc etc) <--- this?
or because of the whims of the elite, a controlled demolition, <--- or this? so to speak.
Something to think about....
.... And when you're finished thinking about it, PLEASE POST your thoughts here!
=======================================
Edited by shokdee - 21-Aug-2011 at 20:30
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Monkey see monkey do be doobie do
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ralfy
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Posted: 21-Jul-2011 at 05:50 |
Try books like Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs, and Steel.
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