The Medieval Ostsiedlung Myth

Regarding Kashubs and Slovincians and which of these names is older:

They were called Slovincians for the first time by Karl Gottlob von Anton already in 1783 - he wrote:

"So nennen sich die so genannten Kassuben in Pommern Słowienci."

On the other hand, the first reference to Kashubs (regarding the duke of Kashubs) is much older - from 1238:

"Duce Cassubie" was mentioned by the Pope on 12.03.1238 regarding the Duke of Szczecin - Bogislaw II - who died in 1220.

Domen, the Nazi accusations do not belong here.

But Beorna's Communist accusations do ??? His nasty accusations started many posts before my ones.

Regarding Bamberg - it seems that it was in the Catholic part of Germany, or at least many people from that region were Catholic.

People from that area, also participated in the overall trend of German eastward migrations:

Groups of people known as Bambrzy came during the 1700s (which doesn't mean that there were no immigrants from that region before):

Bambrzy - since almost 300 years in Poznań Just like every year in the beginning of August in Poznań a holiday commemorating the coming of settlers from German Bamberg will be celebrated. The first group of settlers came to the capital city of Wielkopolska (Greater Poland) in 1719. For hundreds of years villages belonging to the city of Poznań were one of sources of income for the city. At the beginning of the 18th century because of the wars and the plague the Polish villages around Poznań were almost completely depopulated. That is why the authorities of Poznań decided to settle there people from German Bamberg, a region in Upper Franconia. The first agreement with the settlers from Bamberg was signed on 1 August 1719. Within the next several dozen years a considerable group of farmers from Bamberg came to Poznań as a result of the agreement. The only condition new settlers had to meet was to possess a certificate confirming that the holder practices Catholic faith. In return the authorities of the City gave them timber so that they could rebuild their farms. And although the settlers spoke German, not Polish, their assimilation happened very quickly. In the 19th century all farmers from the vicinity of Poznań were called Bambrzy. And, what’s interesting, in the 19th century, when Poznań was a part of Prussia, the descendants of Bamberg settlers considered themselves Polish, not German. Bambrzy and their descendants contributed to the culture of near-Poznań villages. They brought with them their own traditions concerning farming, food, construction, but these traditions were not that completely new, because Polish people had been in touch with their western neighbours for many years. What was the most characteristic feature of Bambrzy was the way they used to dress. Their costumes had formed throughout the ages under Polish and German influences. Women wearing characteristic crowns made of flowers were called in Poznań “bamberka”. After almost 300 years Bambrzy have blended in the Poznań cultural landscape. During the years of the Communist government they even tried to hide their roots, because they were afraid of accusations of cooperation with then hostile Germany. The situation changed in the 1990s. The Society of Poznań Bambrzy was founded, embracing people who know that they have descendants among the settlers from Bamberg. Every year the Society organizes, on the first Saturday after the 1 August, the Bamber Holiday. It always takes place on the Old Market Square by the fountain of Bamberka at the rear of the Town Hall. After the welcoming ceremony and speeches a fragment of the first agreement made between the City and Bamber settlers from Luboń village is read out. There many other attractions like fruit and vegetable fair, one can also buy farmhouse bread, traditional teacake covered with sugar icing, potatoes with cottage cheese, thick vegetable soup and slices of bread with lard. Mementos left by Bamber settlers are in the Bamber Museum opened a couple of years ago. The Museum has its seat in Mostowa Street, a couple of hundred metres away from the Old Market Square, in the vicinity of the Ethnographic Museum. A typical Bamber house was reconstructed there. On the ground floor we can see a Bamber house with a garden and a fence. All the rooms are equipped with furniture, domestic appliances and pictures that were in the typical 19th century house of a wealthy Bamber farmer. On the first floor there are display cabinets with valuable historic objects like a christening cap from the turn of the 17th and 18th centuries.

Among other similar, nowadays Polonized groups were for example Hanobrzy (Hanoberzy) - who came from the area of Hannover. But these ones from Hannover were not invited - they were settled here during the Prussian government-sponsored "Germanization" in the 1800s.

Of course I am talking now about the region of Wielkopolska (Greater Poland).

Another of such "named groups" who settled in this region (and not only this) were Olędrzy (Hollanders).

In period 1527 - 1864 as many as 1700 settlements of Olędrzy were established in Poland. Not all of them in Greater Poland, but a large part (others in other regions of Poland). In at least 300 out of those 1700 settlements inhabitants were ethnic Hollanders (Dutch people or Flemings). In other cases those were many nationalities: Germans, Scots, Poles, Frisians, Czechs, Hungarians, etc. Most of them were Polonized throughout history.

Among my maternal grandfather's ancestors were those Olędrzy (Hollanders) settlers.

Judging by the surname, in case of my ancestors those were either Dutch (including Flemish) or German people.

Beorna asked me where exactly they came from, but I don't know this yet.

I only know that the surname is of Flemish origin, but it can be found today in several states, including also Germany.


Edited by Domen - 23-Feb-2014 at 06:21

Originally posted by red clay Bamberg is my most favorite city of anywhere.  Over the years I've spent a lot of time there.

Moreless half of the people in my city - Poznan - got roots in Bamberg. They all were polonised and during second WW many of them were murdered by Germans. Many of my friends are so called "Bambers" as we say in Poznan. Everything what Domen did write is truth.
In the center of my city is the statue of "Bamberg girl".

The immigrants from Bamberg came to my city in the half of XVIII century after the plague. The authorities of my city who invited them had only one condition - that immigrants must be catholic. Bamberg was a city in Germany where most of the poeple were catholics and easilly fulfilled this requirement. Within one generation all the immigrants from Bamberg polonised themselves.

Edited by Mosquito - 23-Feb-2014 at 18:58

How interesting. You haven't been here in over a year.  Your post adds credence to the reasons why beorna left Historum. 

Thread closed