QuoteReplyTopic: God can possess of any quality without being that Posted: 21-Nov-2010 at 21:49
God can possess of any quality without being that
quality
God is associated with the awareness and not
awareness
In the subject of
unimaginable God, the unimaginable God alone can be the authority.You cannot
say that the aspect of unimaginable is false since the unimaginable boundary of
the Universe is a practical example. The entertainment of God does not fix God
again as awareness. God can have any quality through His unimaginable capacity.
God knows everything and hence, through the quality of knowing, you cannot fix
God as awareness. God has the quality of the process of knowing through
His unimaginable capacity without being awareness. Similarly, God can
have the quality of entertainment without being any qualified and imaginable
item of the creation like awareness. We have no objection to attribute any
quality to God as long as you do not conclude God as the qualified imaginable
item. He can be the possessor of any quality without being the worldly possessor
of such quality, which is an imaginable item of the Creation. The unimaginable
nature of God is never damaged by your logic of imaginable items of the
Creation.
All the three spiritual preachers (Shankara, Ramanuja and
Madhva) said that God is awareness since He has the quality of knowing. This
only means that God is associated with the awareness as the medium or Upadhi
and does not mean that God is the imaginable awareness. Since God pervades the
entire medium and gets identified with it as the current is identified with the
wire, we can call God as the medium for all practical purposes. By this
point, we can call God as awareness and this is only an assumption but not
reality. This becomes necessary since the unimaginable God cannot be
indicated even by the highest faculty of intelligence and imagination. If this
point is stated, which is the absolute reality; there is a danger of mistaking
the unimaginable God as non-existent.
Hence, all the Preachers stopped with God mediated by
awareness and hence, treated God as awareness through assumption. However, the
quality of knowing is related to the medium (awareness) only. Then, you should
say that the quality of knowing is an associated characteristic of God only and
not the inherent characteristic. However, if the confusion is not cleared by
this explanation, it is always better to present the whole subject through a
simple concept, which is that God has the quality of knowing through His
unimaginable capacity of omnipotence. In this simple explanation, the quality
of knowing can become the inherent characteristic of God through His capacity
of unimaginable omnipotence and by this, the danger of mistaking God as
awareness is ruled out.
The Veda says “Asanneva
Sa bhavati…” etc. This hymn means “God exists while being the non-existent.
Realize that God is both the existent and non-existent items. Then you will
realize that God exists”. This hymn needs an elaborate analytical explanation.
You can bring another Vedic statement here (Tat
Srushtvaa…, Satcha Tyat Chaabhavat…). This means “God created the world and
entered into it. Then He became both existent and non-existent”. Bring the Gita
here (Manusheem Tanum...), which
means that God enters the human body.
The non-existent items (Asat) are energy, matter and
awareness, forms and feelings. Forms and feelings are non-existent with respect
to matter and awareness. Both matter and awareness are non-existent with
respect to energy. Energy is non-existent with respect to God. God is never
non-existent. He is always existent (Sat). When God enters in the energetic
form, the energetic form consists of form and energy and both these are
relatively true (Asat) items.
When God enters the human body, the body consists of matter,
energy, awareness, forms and feelings, which are also relatively true (Asat)
items only. You have to take that form as God as you take the live wire as
current. If you agree that the unimaginable God exists and enters imaginable
items, which are non-existent (since they are relatively true), now you can say
that God exists and is visible. Through the imaginable and relatively
non-existent items (like energetic form or human body) only you can experience
God.
The Veda says that God becomes both ‘Sat’ and ‘Tyat’. God
exists as God and also as non-God (body and soul). In human body, He entertains
Himself under the illusion of forms and feelings like an ordinary human being.
If necessary, He will rise to higher level and will realize that forms and
feelings are unreal. If still necessary, He will rise to still higher level,
will realize both matter and awareness as unreal, and will perform miracles.
Finally, He will rise to the highest level, where energy also becomes unreal
and in this state, He is creator, maintainer and destroyer of the world. In
this highest level only the Gita or the Bible or (divine knowledge) comes out.
your point, please??..for some, god doesn't exist...so, he does not....so when do we get to see the great one??when we die??...we become a 'spirit'????...too many ?????...you really don't 'feel' or see god, so there is nothing there, correct??
your point, please??..for some, god doesn't exist...so, he does not....so when do we get to see the great one??when we die??...we become a 'spirit'????...too many ?????...you really don't 'feel' or see god, so there is nothing there, correct??
The soul is imaginable item. It is a part of creation and creation is imaginable. The soul taken as basic inert energy can be seen by eyes with the help of powerful scientific instruments. The soul taken in the form of special work or transportation of information by special neuron cells can also be visualized. Thus, the soul taken in any form is visualized and hence, it cannot be the unimaginable God. The Veda (Drushyatetvagraya…) and the Gita (Pashyanti Jnanachakshushah…) clearly say that the soul can be visualized by Scholars or Scientists. God is beyond space and hence, can never be imagined even by intelligence (logic), which is highest faculty of Knowledge.
The human imagination can never go beyond space. Since God is the generator of space, God exists beyond space and can never be imagined. The miracles are the unimaginable incidents that indicate the unimaginable God. As long as an incident can be explained by scientific logic, nobody takes the name of God. The hot Sun light indicates the hot Sun. The cool moon light indicates the cool moon. Similarly, the unimaginable incident indicates the unimaginable God. The only available information about the nature of God is that God is unimaginable. Thus, when a person experiences the unimaginable miracle in the life, such experience can be treated as the experience of God. Unimaginable does not mean inexperienciable.
The faith in God becomes strongest and deepest after the experience of such unimaginable nature of God. Thick skinned people need intensive miracles. There are some people, who do not have skin at all and can never experience God like a stone. Such souls take the birth of inert objects and may serve the devotees for a possible change. A stone may serve a devotee standing on the wall of his house. Such service may bring change and may give a human birth again. God never condemns any soul forever. The father always tries throughout his life to change his child. The sensitive skin of a Scholar experiences God even through a light miracle. Scholars experience God through unimaginable parts of the already existing creation like seeing the unimaginable boundary of the Universe.
Such greatest Scholar does not need any other miracle. The importance of Cosmic Vision exhibited by the Lord is only indicating the existence of such unimaginable boundary of the creation (Nantosti mama divyanaam—Gita). Thus, for a real Scholar there is no need of a time bound miracle to take place. A human being always investigates the miracle to find out even a trace of possibility to interpret it through logic. The reasons for this are his ignorance about God and deep knowledge about creation. A devotee is quite reverse. He has deep knowledge about God and ignorance about the creation.
Nicely said dattaswami. Are these your own thoughts? When expressing them to us, are you aware of the diffence in Eastern and Western logic that makes it difficult for those with western consciousness and those with eatern conscious to comprehend the logic of the other. In genaral we have a poor understanding of logic and wrongly think it is the same for everyone. Your thoughts are circluar and wholistic, not liniar and exclusive. The liniar and exclusive logic has been best for discovering materialistic structure and developing technology, up to this point. But once we get into quantum physics, it is the east that has the advantage. I don't believe many are aware of the difference in the logic, and this leads to futile efforts to communicate.
How many of us are aware the cultural boundaries of our understanding of reality? Are you sensitive to the fact that you are writing outside of the boundary of western thought? For me you are a piece of sanity, but this may have something to with my incarnations, because I surely am not the normal western thinker, but unfortunately have never directly experienced eastern cultures .At least not in this incarnation. Bridging between the east and west is an real challenge. Thank you so much for trying.
I am sometimes amazed by how comprehensive a thought can be when dressed in the right words. Such as your explanation of the difference imaginable and the unimaginable. In western culture the imaginable God is such a strong part of the culture, even the Godless people are sure this imaginable God is God and therefore it becomes quite frustrating to discuss God with them.
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