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A new era of islamic calvinism??

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  Quote DocStaph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: A new era of islamic calvinism??
    Posted: 09-Sep-2006 at 20:17
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

Ahhh so the rich will be able to complet the five pillars of islam, and the poor can only hope and dream to complete the last pillar...Ahhh sorrows..

No. The poor can complete the hajj requirement by fasting. See [2:196].

After a brief search through the Qurans index on the USC site. I can't find any mention of Hajj cleansing your past sins.
 
Ahhh that is unfair indeed! Why should have to fast when there dreams and thoughts are set upon the kabba which they bow to on a daily basis. Sorrrows.. You have been given the opportunity to fulfill the 5 pillars where as the poor have to fast and fast more.. What about will happen to their Liver? OR wait a minute, lets discuss malnutrition and dehydration.. Endlist less of symptoms arise from fasting in onsense.. I must admit fasting is healthy on certain level.. But your statment that these poor who have noo food in the first place should fast more.. I am completely dumbfounded on your statment.
 
Go back up and read my statement in regards to your statment... Where did five pillars evolve from? Which Book? What is the purpose of Hajj?
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  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2006 at 20:59
Originally posted by Quran 2:192

] And complete the Hajj or 'umra in the service of Allah. But if ye are prevented (From completing it), send an offering for sacrifice, such as ye may find, and do not shave your heads until the offering reaches the place of sacrifice. And if any of you is ill, or has an ailment in his scalp, (Necessitating shaving), (He should) in compensation either fast, or feed the poor, or offer sacrifice; and when ye are in peaceful conditions (again), if any one wishes to continue the 'umra on to the hajj, He must make an offering, such as he can afford, but if he cannot afford it, He should fast three days during the hajj and seven days on his return, Making ten days in all. This is for those whose household is not in (the precincts of) the Sacred Mosque. And fear Allah, and know that Allah Is strict in punishment.


I think your being intentionally difficult. Its simple, if you can afford to do Hajj during your life time then you must. If you cannot afford it, you don't.


Edited by Omar al Hashim - 09-Sep-2006 at 21:03
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  Quote Scorpius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2006 at 21:28
Originally posted by DocStaph

Where did five pillars evolve from? Which Book?
 
They are written in Quran. I will try to show you a few of the verses but actually there are more verses than I am presenting here.
 
 
SALAT (CONTACT PRAYERS)
 
The Dawn Prayer
 
"O ye who believe ! let those whom your right hand possess, and those of you, who have not reached puberty, ask leave of you at three times before coming into your private apartments -before the Morning Prayer, and when you lay aside your clothes at noon (in summer) and after the night Prayer. These are the three times of privacy for you. At other times there is no blame on you nor on them, for some of you have to attend upon others and to move about freely according to need. Thus does ALLAH make plain to you the Signs; for ALLAH is All-Knowing, Wise."
[24:58]
 
The Noon Prayer
'Observe Prayer from the declining and paling of the sun till the darkness of the night, and recite the Qur'an at dawn. Verily, the recitation of the Qur'an at dawn is specially acceptable to ALLAH.'
[17:78]
 
The Afternoon Prayer
"Watch over prayers, and particularly the middle Prayer, and stand before ALLAH submissively."
[2:238]
 
The Sunset Prayer and The Night Prayer
"And observe Prayer at the two ends of the day, and in some hours of the night. Surely, good works drive away evil ones. This is a reminder for those who would remember. "
[11:114]
 
SHADADA (DECLERATION OF FAITH) [1]
 
"[1] God bears witness that there is no god but HE - and also do the angels and those possessed of knowledge, maintaining justice; [1] there is no God but HE, the Mighty, the Wise. "
[3:18]
 
FASTING
 
"The prescribed fasting is for a fixed number of days, but whose among you is sick or on a journey, shall fast the same number of other days; and for those who are able to fast only with great difficulty, is an expiation - the feeding of a poor man. And whoso does good of his own accord it is better for him. And fasting is good for you, if you only knew. Ramadan is the month during which the Quran was revealed, providing guidance for the people, clear teachings, and the statute book. Those of you who witness this month shall fast therein. Those who are ill or traveling may substitute the same number of other days. GOD wishes for you convenience, not hardship, that you may fulfill your obligations, and to glorify GOD for guiding you, and to express your appreciation."
[2:184-185]
 
HAJJ
 
"You shall observe the complete rites of Hajj and`Umrah for GOD. If you are prevented, you shall send an offering, and do not resume cutting your hair until your offering has reached its destination. If you are ill, or suffering a head injury (and you must cut your hair), you shall expiate by fasting, or giving to charity, or some other form of worship. During the normal Hajj, if you break the state of Ihraam (sanctity) between `Umrah and Hajj, you shall expiate by offering an animal sacrifice. If you cannot afford it, you shall fast three days during Hajj and seven when you return home - this completes ten - provided you do not live at the Sacred Masjid. You shall observe GOD, and know that GOD is strict in enforcing retribution."
[2:196]
 
ZAKAT (Obligatory Charity)
 
"The only people to frequent GOD's masjids are those who believe in GOD and the Last Day, and observe the Salat, and give the obligatory charity  (Zakat), and do not fear except GOD. These will surely be among the guided ones."
[9:18]
 
"The believing men and women are allies of one another. They advocate righteousness and forbid evil, they observe the Salat and  and give the obligatory charity  (Zakat), and they obey GOD and His messenger. These will be showered by GOD's mercy. GOD is Almighty, Most Wise."
[9:71]


Edited by Scorpius - 09-Sep-2006 at 21:34
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  Quote DocStaph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Sep-2006 at 14:43
Thank you scorpius for answering my Q's. I greatly appreciate the information you have provided.
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  Quote DocStaph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Sep-2006 at 14:45
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim


I think your being intentionally difficult. Its simple, if you can afford to do Hajj during your life time then you must. If you cannot afford it, you don't.
 
 
Oh no! This discussion has taken a detour! let's get back to the original discussion in regards to communism and islam being similar or with similar ideas.Smile
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  Quote Scorpius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Sep-2006 at 16:14
Originally posted by DocStaph

Thank you scorpius for answering my Q's. I greatly appreciate the information you have provided.
 
You are very welcome Tongue
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  Quote Timotheus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Sep-2006 at 22:00
Very interesting how it's called "Islamic Calvinism" and references a loosening of rules. It's actually very historically accurate, as that is actually what Calvin did (among many more important things), but usually in the western world "Calvinism" is met with a shudder of hate and disgust and loathing of fundamentalists.
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