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Nuclear war and the world

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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Nuclear war and the world
    Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 20:07
Originally posted by Genghis

[QUOTE=Evildoer]Japan was already militaristically crippled when Atom bomb was droped.[\QUOTE]

But they were still going to resist in a final victory or death struggle that would have killed far more people than the bombs did.  That and the Soviets would have probably invaded Hokkaido, and we all know what happens to places the Red Army visits.

yes indeed, it was war to the last and without the emperors call to surrender many more japanese would have died, not to mention allies.  And even when the emperor tried to surrender there was a palace coup to stop him.  I cant stand all the revisionist historians who wan to ake America somehow the badguy against Japan beause of the bombs.

 

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  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 20:03

Originally posted by Evildoer

Japan was already militaristically crippled when Atom bomb was droped.

But they were still going to resist in a final victory or death struggle that would have killed far more people than the bombs did.  That and the Soviets would have probably invaded Hokkaido, and we all know what happens to places the Red Army visits.



Edited by Genghis
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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 19:29
wow, do you try to be so consistently wrong on every issue intentionally, or is it just hapenstance?
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  Quote Evildoer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 17:58

China was not a puppet state. Mao (may he never rest in peace) was conducting his own diplomacy and his own domestic policy.

Japan was already militaristically crippled when Atom bomb was droped. Eisenhower stated the same and opposed the use of the bomb, although he was far from being a humanitarian.

War over Cuba was a direct result of nuclear missles. If soviets were not brining nuclear missles how could there have been a Cuban Nuclear Missle Crisis? By the way, American ships were attacking a Soviet submarine, - some of the crew wanted to fire back, but one of them restrained them. If the sub fired back, there would have been War. Someone in this forum posted an article on this at some earlier date.

That's just alternative history, the WWI theory. People before WWI idealized warfare much more than we do today, so we don't know what would have happened if they had such a WMD.

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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 14:22

 

At this period China was practically a SOviet puppet state, the reason why the Soviet Union did not get move involved was the threat of nuclear war.  Nukes have saved more lives than any force ont eh planet barring medical practitioners.  They prevented me and y family from being wiped out in what would have been a far more bloody invasion of Japan in WW2, they prevented the Korean war from exploding out of control, and they have prevented war of Cuba.

To think that the world would be better off witout nukes is a lack of historical perspective blinded by idealism.  If nukes had existed i the posesion of the major powers of pre-WW1 world, there may have been no WW one, and hence WW2 and many others after that.

 

Originally posted by Evildoer

Janus, Soviet Union was not officially involved in Korean War, although they covertly sent some Migs manned with Soviet Pilots for diplomacy's sake. China was. The Soviets did not even vote against UN military intervention in Korea.

General MacArthur actually wanted to drop something like 10 nukes on China, but American government rejected his crazy ideas.

I hate Oppeneheimer, his ugliness needs to be burst open.

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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 11:21
There was also a documenatary about the security of nukes in Russia. They showed a compound where nukes were held and it had zero guards or any security and the fence had large strips gone so a specially prepaired grouping could walk in there without any special tech and take a few on their trucks......scary!!!
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  Quote Shifty Russian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Oct-2004 at 09:20

Going back to the original question...

It's not likely that nukes are to be used again... how ever, since there are so many of the damn things around, its there's an outside chance that a terrorist or someone nutty could let one off - - - Russian had enough nukes to blow the world 4 times over (so i saw in a doc.)

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  Quote Evildoer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Oct-2004 at 18:27

You mean Afghan-Soviet War? But that was not even near to provoking a full scale war between the two superpowers. Those anti-American anti-Soviet weapon supplying programs were more than common in Cold War.

Stalin and Mao really hated eachother, and China and Soviet Union was getting more and more hostile. It eventually lead to an open border warfare, although it was later on. I wouldn't think that.

Americans did not even have the will to defeat North Koreans. They could not have invaded China considering the amount of initiative they had. Even though their casualties only rose to 50,000 they were too glad to end the war.

Oh, I knew it was Truman. I hate the b*stard so much I cannot give him credit for anything that is good or humanitarian lol!  MacArthur may be a fascist but I like him better to that beak-nosed ignorant petty merchant.



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  Quote JanusRook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2004 at 22:56

Janus, Soviet Union was not officially involved in Korean War, although they covertly sent some Migs manned with Soviet Pilots for diplomacy's sake. China was.

......but if we invaded China and threatened to topple all of communism, how neutral would they have been. Also the US wasn't officially involved in afghanistan but rambo was there.

 

General MacArthur actually wanted to drop something like 10 nukes on China, but American government rejected his crazy ideas.

Actually it was mostly truman who rejected MacArthur 1, although with good reason since the man was an ass. I think he had an idea of using nuclear bombs to bust up beachheads so marines could land with minimal resistance. (They didn't know about the cancer causing aspect yet.)

 

1. I know truman technically counts as the government so I'll give that one to you.

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  Quote Kubrat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2004 at 18:46
To further extend what you said Evildoer, it was mostly America using it's vetoing power in the UN during and after the 1950's...  The Cold War was stupid.
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  Quote Evildoer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2004 at 18:23

Janus, Soviet Union was not officially involved in Korean War, although they covertly sent some Migs manned with Soviet Pilots for diplomacy's sake. China was. The Soviets did not even vote against UN military intervention in Korea.

General MacArthur actually wanted to drop something like 10 nukes on China, but American government rejected his crazy ideas.

I hate Oppeneheimer, his ugliness needs to be burst open.

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  Quote Kubrat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2004 at 17:40

Nukes are necessary for the short green eared Martians coming to take over the world .

Nukes are horrible, horrible things.  We should put them all on the moon and have them ready to launch against any incoming asteroids.

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  Quote JanusRook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2004 at 15:29

What, pro-nuclear people??? Are you all wacky?

Actually nukes are a very large peacekeeping force in the world. If it wasn't for nukes the US and the Soviet Union probably would have gone to war during the Korean War. Costing millions of lives and millions of dollars. Don't underestimate the diplomatic leverage assured mutual destruction can bring.

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  Quote Evildoer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2004 at 14:37

Nuclear bomb is a dispicable weapon.

I wouldn't say nuclear war will happen any time soon, if it will ever occur. Too many nations are afraid of the consequences that might face firing/dropping this weapon.

Nuclear bombs might deter war in some cases, and in others they will provide an excuse to invade a nation.

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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2004 at 11:47

What, pro-nuclear people??? Are you all wacky?

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  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Oct-2004 at 21:35

I love nukes, the physics is amazing, and it's all for a good cause, hurting your enemies.

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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Oct-2004 at 08:47
Sorry for my 2 similar posts, but an error occured and i rewrote it which also didn't immideatly show up here due to an error and i came to write another(a third) one today and i saw them both as replys,!!!!!!!!
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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Sep-2004 at 14:52

nuclear bombs are the best deterent for war, through the cold war there was no devastating WW3, I think nukes and the threat of total destruction is the only thing that can make people receptive to peace....therefore, let the nukes remain throughout the world!!!!!!!!

 

Anyhoo, if the world did get nukes then it would be all cool like Fallout games!

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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Sep-2004 at 13:52
for the gods, i can't reply, bloody error!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Sep-2004 at 13:51

The nukes go off, people die, melt, vaporise and mutate leaving only 1% of the previous humans intact as mutants. They form clans to survive and major and minor skirmishes, whereever they meet antoher clan, will occur! Then, the atmosphere will return to normal and the former mutants become, well, dead as they can't tolerate the high oxygen levels. Then, nature will rule supreme on Earth and forests and grassy fields will cover the once dead fields of radiated dirt. Then, a new species will start evolving into the hegemony of Earth. And this time it isn't the pathetic homo sapiens sapiens, but the immensly powerful species of rabbits!!!!!!!!!!!  The once known little bunnys, shall overrun Earth in a vicious way, not giving mercy to anyone, not even the powerful bear or wolf. Dum-dum-dum-dummmmmmmm....... "Be aware of the creatur dwelling in the forest with long ears, for it will subdue the man itself." which is a quote from Kong Fuzi!!!!!!! dum-dum-dum-dummmmmmmm........

This is a scientifically proven theory my people!!!!!!

 

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