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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Malay People
    Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 01:18

Based from wikipedia....

Malays.. they constitute the dominant ethnic group which live in Malaysia, Indonesia, Brunei, the Philippines and East Timor, which together with Singapore and the southernmost part of Thailand (Patani) make up what is called the Malay archipelago.

Here is the map of Malay Archipelago.. It can consider as one of the largest in the world...

 

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Malayarch.png

When I look at this map... wow! one big happy family... hmmm... are we happy?? . But I wonder why the map shows malaysia is a place that is outside from the MA??? strange...



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  Quote OSMANLI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 03:18

Thanks, interesting post. I dont know much about the Malay people so it would be great if you could answer some questions:

Why are the Malay currently divided?

Is there a Pan-Malay movement?

Are all Malay Muslim?

Are Malay religious people?

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  Quote ok ge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 03:29

Interesting Wikipedia map. Australia being out of the Malaysian archipelago makes sense, but not Malaysia. People identify themselves as various races in Malaysia for Chinese, Indians, and Malays. Malays make up the majority of the population.

Official language is Malay. The whole country is Malay-sia, and still, they are out of the map???

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 04:05
Originally posted by OSMANLI

Thanks, interesting post. I dont know much about the Malay people so it would be great if you could answer some questions:

Why are the Malay currently divided?

Is there a Pan-Malay movement?

Are all Malay Muslim?

Are Malay religious people?

Very Interesting questions we have here... I try my very best to answer all of these questions based on my opinion and knowledge (which is not so much....).

1. Malay regions are divided.. probably because of the geographical factors... most of the region land is in island forms.. as u can see from the map... Borneo (consist of Sabah and Sarawak and Kalimantan), Philipines, Sulawesi, Java, Sumatera and Peninsular of Malaysia (by right supposed to be in tht map as MA) so the malay people are seperated by that.. the influence of colonization previously... based on different countries seperated the malay people more... Malaysia by British... Indonesia by Netherland/Holland, Philipines by Spain... I believe this is the factor why currently Malays are divided.

2. Pan-Malay Movement? well previously yes.. there were such movement... during Indonesia confrontation to join malaysia and Indonesia in one country.. called as Indonesia Raya... they attacked Malaysia... and the rest is History...

3. Are all malay muslim? Well.. u are referring to the specific malay in specific country or based on the map? if malay malaysian... like me... we are supposed to be all muslims... here the word 'supposed'... but there's some cases happened where malay changed the religion... if refer to the native malay (the original malay such as negrito, jakun) their belief in animism... some already convert to Islam, Christian, Hindu and etc... If u refer to Malay Indonesia... not all are muslims...

4. Are Malay religious people? in term of Islam or Christian or what? I answer u based on Islam cos I am a muslim... malay like other races too.. u are a turk .. am i correct? there will be some is good in 'dean'... some is moderate... some is simple... but most of malay i can say 98.99% who is muslim... we are devoted to Islam.. yeah.. as far as i can see from my observation and understanding...

I wish my answers are good enough...

 

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  Quote ScythianEmpire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 05:02
Were Malay people the indigenous people of Singapore?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 06:43

Originally posted by ScythianEmpire

Were Malay people the indigenous people of Singapore?

Yes they were... Same as Malaysia, Brunei and other countries which are in MA

Before it was known as Singapore or Singapura in Malay... it was called as Temasik..

Here is a very interesting info i found:

The present-day Malays of the Peninsula and coasts of the Malau Archipelago are described as deutero-Malays and are the descendants of the tribal proto-Malays mixed with modern Indian, Thai, Arab and China blood...

Source: http://www.sabrizain.demon.co.uk/malaya/malays.htm

Cool... got arab blood in me.. lol .. I doubt that...

 



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  Quote Belisarius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 09:03
1. As cahaya says, it has to do with the spheres of colonization. The European powers gave independence to these territories seperately and at different times, making such a union unlikely.

2. Probably, but not among the Filipinos. The staunchly Roman Catholic Filipinos do not to be ruled by Muslims and Protestants.

3. A majority of Malays are Muslim, with the exception of the Filipinos who are about 84% Roman Catholic.

4. I do not know about the rest of the Malay world, but in the Philippines, as in other countries, religion is slowly losing its grip over the people, especially the youth. 
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  Quote MRS 1-AM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 16:23

I Think singaproe is very difference with other malay country becasue of the people,in singapro there have more then 80% is chinese.and they speak chinese,even though english is a official langange of singaproe but the government suggest citizen learn chinese and speak chinese.

           Singapore's population, though small at 4.42 million as of  2005, is relatively diverse compared to most other countries, although neighbour malysia also features a multiracial population. The chinese, who have constituted the majority of the island population since the colonial days, account for 76.8 percent of Singaporeans.malays, who are the indigenous native group of the country, constitute 13.9 percent, though this number includes many Malay ethnic groups from other parts of the malay archipelago including the javaese, bugis,baweans and minangs. indians are the third largest ethnic group at 7.9 percent, consisting of several groupsXtamils, who form the largest Indian group, and others such as malayalees,punjabis and bengalis. The rest are made up of smaller groups such as Arbs, Jews, Thais, Japanese, and the Euroasia community

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 10:36

Based on what MRS 1-AM said is true...

Most population in Singapore currently majority is by the Chinese....

though this number includes many Malay ethnic groups from other parts of the malay archipelago including the javaese, bugis,baweans and minangs

In Malaysia also this ethnic mostly can be found in southern part of Peninsular.. and Negeri Sembilan which is populated by Minang ethnic which is originally from Sumatra, Indonesia. This ethnic applied a culture where women will have more priority than men to be an heir.. this called as 'Adat Pepatih Putih'.

 well... me myself is mixed of Malay Pattani from the south Thailand...

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  Quote TinTin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 09:49

Who are the Malays?

 

Sorry lads, I just cannot resist myself from poking me nose into this subject. I cannot claim to be an expert but for the sake of everyone here I might as well write something that I know.

Malays are the generic name for peoples who live in South East Asia with the exception of the Thais and the Burmese. The European since Middle Ages has always fascinated by the East. Since the time when the Ottoman Empire choked the land passage (The Levant) the European have been pondering for the alternate passage to the East. Columbus took the forbidden route to the West but failed to find East. The Portuguese celebrated when Vasco De Gama circumnavigated the Cape of Good Hope and reached India.

 

The ancient route to the Malay Archipelago

 

 

I am leaving the detail anthropological part of the arguments which until today still being discussed and debated by the experts. Instead I would like to focus on the definition of the term Malays in the present   cultural and the political definition.

 

It is believed that the present Malay stock is originally from the island of Taiwan. Aptly they should be referred to as a neutral name Austronesian. The migration started about 4000 BCE and landed on the island of Luzon and other outer islands of Philippine. About 2000 BCE they spread to north island of Borneo, Mindanao, Sulawesi, the Mulukus and eventually to eastern and central Java. The migration reached the western sea board of  Borneo island, in the vicinity of  Pontianak,  around 1500 BCE and it is believed that here  the early proto-Malay language takes its root.

 

Subsequently around 1500-500 BCE the second migration spread to the eastern tip of Java island crossing the Sunda straits to the island of Sumatra. Sumatra is the springboard to peninsular Malaysia.

 

 

Ethnics spread and diversity.

 

> >

> >

 

As early as 500 CE the first Malay empire, Srivijaya, evolved in the area situated around the southeast Sumatra present city Palembang. It was a major maritime power whose influence stretched up to the present Cambodia. It sent its emissaries to the rulers of China and the kingdom of Chula in India. The Empire of Srivijaya lasted for seven hundred years until it succumbed to the internal power struggles and constant wars with the upstart Majapahit of Java. Srivijaya Empire left it marks in the region in the form of Malay cultures and the regional lingua franca the Malay language.

 

The coming of the European i.e. the Portuguese, Dutch and the English the region was referred as the Malay Archipelago a crescent shaped stretch from Sabang of Aceh to Mareuke of Irian Jaya. A distant equivalent to Helsinki to Ankara.

 

Over many centuries each group evolved into sub-ethnic groups with their own culture and values. Contacts among each other through maritime trading and wars. However the people of Malay Archipelago identify themselves as their sub-ethnic grouping as shown above but at heart as Rumpun Melayu the Malay root.

 



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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 11:27
You forgot about the Malgasy and about the many Melanesian and Polinesian peoples that are also related to Malay prehistoric expansion. I ahven't yet been able to find out wether all native languages of the Pacific islands are Austronesian (mostly Malayo-Polinesian), like Wikipedia says, or not (Ethonlogue Report is confuse).



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  Quote TinTin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 11:57

Indeed my friend. 

As we know from history the Malays were seafaring race. I havn't seen any material concerning the relationship between the Malays and the Polynesian. All I  can tell you is  based on research done by James Michiner when he wrote  the novel' Hawaii'. The Polynesien claimed that their root from the Malays of the SE Asia.

The Malagasy are Malays stock and I was told that the language and custom are akin to the early Malay culture. Frankly I have no  idea how they managed to get there.

AS for the Cape Malays in South Africa the history is quite clear. Bulk of them were shipped by the Dutch from Malacca to serve the early white sattlers in South Africa.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 12:14

Originally posted by Tin Tin


However the people of Malay Archipelago identify themselves as their sub-ethnic grouping as shown above but at heart as Rumpun Melayu the Malay root.

this remind me to UMNO's Song:

Bersatu Kita Bersatu

Dengan Setia Berganding Bahu

Jiwa Teguh Berpadu

Kita Rumpun Melayu


.......

It's sounds almost like this:

Unite we Unite, Always loyal to support,

The heart strongly Unite.. We are the Malay people..

*My translation sounds ugly

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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 14:09
Originally posted by TinTin

Indeed my friend. 

As we know from history the Malays were seafaring race. I havn't seen any material concerning the relationship between the Malays and the Polynesian. All I  can tell you is  based on research done by James Michiner when he wrote  the novel' Hawaii'. The Polynesien claimed that their root from the Malays of the SE Asia.


The do seem linguistically related.

The Malagasy are Malays stock and I was told that the language and custom are akin to the early Malay culture. Frankly I have no  idea how they managed to get there.

Just canoing.

Most likely they sailed from Indonesia to Sri Lanka or southern India and then were carried by the monsoon. Probably they first stayed in mainland Africa (where some Malay apportations are found too) as the Seychelles and other islands of the Indian Ocean that they would have stopped in otherwise were uninhabited at the time of European exploration.

They must have abandoned Indonesia after the local start of the Iron Age but before the arrival of Hinduism. That places the migration around the first centuries of the Common Era.


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  Quote TinTin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 20:37

That sound intresting

Another of my theory is that during the early days they sailed to the east and discovered the South Pacific Islands but they have no skill in using iron and brass as tools.Very skillful sailors but somehow they sticked to the equator and that explained why the Malays never colonised Australia. My second theory is they did discovered the western seaboard of Australia,however, because of the arid condition of the land they refused to settle down. If they could have ventured further east Sidney and Melbourne could be called by another name. 

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2005 at 02:58
Originally posted by TinTin

That sound intresting

Another of my theory is that during the early days they sailed to the east and discovered the South Pacific Islands but they have no skill in using iron and brass as tools.Very skillful sailors but somehow they sticked to the equator and that explained why the Malays never colonised Australia. My second theory is they did discovered the western seaboard of Australia,however, because of the arid condition of the land they refused to settle down. If they could have ventured further east Sidney and Melbourne could be called by another name. 

An interesting thought , TinTin.

Your post on the origin of the Malays in the Malay Archipelago is equally interesting. However, I would like to add that those ppl from Taiwan are believed to be from Yunnan in China.

Experts say that there were three waves of ancient  migration of ppl into the Archipelago :

1. Around 22,000 years ago of Afro-Asiatic race from the Andaman region. They were rather primitive and became the aboriginal ppl like the Sakais, Negritos, Javaman etc.

2. Around 3,000 BCE, the Proto Malays from Yunnan. They cultivated rice and used bronze. They settled by the river banks and pushed the earlier settlers further inland and into the jungles.

3. Around 1,000(?) BCE the Malays from Yunnan who were navigators, potters, weavers, blacksmiths etc.   

 

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  Quote TinTin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2005 at 11:23

I must admit that prior to the arrival of the Malays to the Peninsular Malaysia the place was already inhibited by two types of people : 

  • The dark skin race related to the Australian Aborigines;
  • Asian looked which the researchers called South Mongoloid.

These are the indigenous peoples of the Peninsular Malaysia. I will come back once I get more information.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2005 at 12:59

Here I would like to share some info on Orang Asli

Orang Asli or the indegenious minority peoples of Peninsular Malaysia.. They are considered as original peoples or first people.

From study done by few researches, there are  18 sub-ethnic groups which can be classified in these groups:-

-Negrito
-Senoi
-Proto-Malay

They represent less than 1% of our country population...

Senoi and Negrito are being suggest tht to have historical link with indegenous peoples in Burma, Thailand and Indo-China...

Well.. for proto Malay, their ancestor were believed came from the Indonesian Island..

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  Quote TinTin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Dec-2005 at 20:17

To date we tend to focus on the Malays in Peninsular which is part of Malaysia. However, for the sake of our intenational friends in this forum, we should steer the discussion towards the idea that the Malay race are the people living in 'Nusantara' or the Malay Archipelago. That include the people living, under the new geo-political structure, in the state of Indonesia, Malaysia, Philiphine,Sigapore, Brunei and the young independent state of Timor Leste.

There are so much things to be discovere and discussed under this topic such as:

  • The formation of the several empires like the Srivijaya, Majapahit, Sailandra, Singhasari and the Malacca Sultanate
  • The influencce of the Hindu culture and religion in the region ( including Buddhaism)
  • The Chinese hegemony when the Chinese navy ruled the Southern Sea
  • The influence of the Islam through the Arab and Indian Muslim traders
  • The coming of the Europeans and colonisation
  • The infux of the immigrant from China and India in the region
  • Development after post colonialism

Of course we cannot tell everything in a single breath. 

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Dec-2005 at 00:08
Originally posted by TinTin

To date we tend to focus on the Malays in Peninsular which is part of Malaysia. However, for the sake of our intenational friends in this forum, we should steer the discussion towards the idea that the Malay race are the people living in 'Nusantara' or the Malay Archipelago. That include the people living, under the new geo-political structure, in the state of Indonesia, Malaysia, Philiphine,Sigapore, Brunei and the young independent state of Timor Leste.

There are so much things to be discovere and discussed under this topic such as:

  • The formation of the several empires like the Srivijaya, Majapahit, Sailandra, Singhasari and the Malacca Sultanate
  • The influencce of the Hindu culture and religion in the region ( including Buddhaism)
  • The Chinese hegemony when the Chinese navy ruled the Southern Sea
  • The influence of the Islam through the Arab and Indian Muslim traders
  • The coming of the Europeans and colonisation
  • The infux of the immigrant from China and India in the region
  • Development after post colonialism

Of course we cannot tell everything in a single breath. 

U are absolutely rite.. tht's why we need a forum where other members need to contribute and share their knowledge with others... those points u mentioned.. we can discuss on different topics.. feel free to create one topic tin tin... especially the Malay development after post colonialism.. sounds interesting...  It would be nice to see some post on South East Asia in this forum rather thn to see all about South Asia

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