Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

for OSMANLI

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12
Author
Mortaza View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar
Avatar

Joined: 21-Jul-2005
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3711
  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: for OSMANLI
    Posted: 26-Jul-2005 at 16:16

Originally posted by Al Bedawi

im rather satisfied.

Theres one of me and 14-16 of you who have done nothing but run your mouths about the arabs all day and now when I say one to two things you cry?


Good Point Maybe If Turks dont want to hear bad thing from Arabs, They should not say it too.

 

Back to Top
Menippos View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 24-May-2005
Location: Greece
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1134
  Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Jul-2005 at 20:50
And I think that one day the Moderators or the Administrators should make a clean-up of all those flame-war threads, because half of our members are mostrly occupied by trying to prove to others that our tomato is better than your tomato, instead of educating themselves about history with arguments supported by logic and proof or at least references. Thank god that there are some "hidden" threads, away from the eyes of the trolls, which still treat history as a value and not as a means!
CARRY NOTHING
Back to Top
Peace View Drop Down
Immortal Guard
Immortal Guard


Joined: 29-Jul-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
  Quote Peace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 15:56

Arab nationalism was at first started by christian writers in lebanon, in the late 19th century, and the christian schools (sent by the french) helped also(these were before young tuks), and these writers were put into the trial and executed(for spreading over ideas that is against the base idea of the ottoman state as a muslim country and not an ethnic one).

But if we take a look on the ottoman empire it was an islamic empire,The sultans are of turcoman origins, the Janisseries were from current-day albania, and there were artists from the whole ottoman state who built Istanbul like artists and painters from egypt, The official language was arabic, and it is said that Selim Khan wanted to convert turkish speaking people to arabic but he was opposed by the oloma, for this is no reason for this.

The ottomans sent troops to Andalucia, Indonesia, china, fought Portugals for their attack on mulsims in india and kicked the spanish out of the middeterrean sea, they fought only for islam.

I wonder whether people who call themselves arabs, wuold still arabs if the ottomans didn't rule the middleeast and north africa, ofcourse they would have been conquered by the rising power of the spanish which would have easily defeat the already weakening Mamlukes( they had already begun to conquer some cities in north africa like Tarablus), and arabs would face the same destiny of South America and Granada, and they would be now christian spanish-talking people(no body survives the inquisition!!), or they woud have been conquered by russia and face total annihilation like muslims in Crimea or volga-bulgaria, what else would have hapenned?

I think that we all should be thankful to the ottoman state and review our nationalism.

Back to Top
countrymercury View Drop Down
Immortal Guard
Immortal Guard


Joined: 01-Aug-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
  Quote countrymercury Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Aug-2005 at 04:57

What is to say Arab is a bad condition under ottoman Empire refers to not known any bad conditions of turks in Turkey at the same time 

Back to Top
Al Bedawi View Drop Down
Knight
Knight
Avatar

Joined: 28-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 72
  Quote Al Bedawi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Aug-2005 at 11:10
Ottomans REFUSED to aid adalusia as Bo'abdil and his Fathers before them claimed to be the Khalifate amir ul Muslimeen , and The British (or english) at that time declared that if the Turks (or anyone else) should interfre with the Reconquista that they would not be allowed to trade with them.

the Ottomans had several dealings with the Kings of northern europe and especially with the english and its important markets and access to ghent (a belgian city) and did NOTHING to assist the Muslims of spain.

Infact the Turks Paid the ransom of the Dahimmitude  to the spanish crown after grenada fell and did NOTHING to assist the Muslimeen of this land.

They then settled the jews in southern syria. 
An army of sheep led by a lion would defeat an army of lions led by a sheep.
Back to Top
The Guardian View Drop Down
Shogun
Shogun
Avatar

Joined: 12-Jul-2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 237
  Quote The Guardian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Aug-2005 at 20:55

Ottomans REFUSED to aid adalusia as Bo'abdil

YEah.Like we were going to win.

remember what boabdil's mother said?

''cry like a women for the things that you could not keep like a man''

 

It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up.
                             &nb
Back to Top
Al Bedawi View Drop Down
Knight
Knight
Avatar

Joined: 28-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 72
  Quote Al Bedawi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Aug-2005 at 00:05
it was .

You may do well to weep like a woman for those things you failed to defend like a man.
An army of sheep led by a lion would defeat an army of lions led by a sheep.
Back to Top
Cengiz Kagan View Drop Down
Janissary
Janissary
Avatar

Joined: 06-Jul-2005
Location: Mongolia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
  Quote Cengiz Kagan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Aug-2005 at 17:45
Originally posted by Al Bedawi

it was .

You may do well to weep like a woman for those things you failed to defend like a man.


You're the one who is crying.......so that makes you a ????????
TANRI TURKU KORUSUN
Back to Top
Peace View Drop Down
Immortal Guard
Immortal Guard


Joined: 29-Jul-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
  Quote Peace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Aug-2005 at 12:43

Kings of Granada asked for help from both the mamlukes and the ottomans, but the  major militaristic confrontation was held by the ottomans, when bayezid II ordered Kamal Raeis for the first time to help Spanish Muslims in 1487, and that order was based on the request of the ruler of Granada who sent a poem to the ottoman state telling about the Christian Spain attack on Muslims, and asking for help and support to save Muslim Spain from the hands of the enemies, and since then the ottoman ships roamed the western middetearean and launched pirate attacks against commercial European ships and also provided the moriscos (Muslims who were forced to be Christian ) with weapons, and moreover defending northern African ports against European invaders.

chemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" />> >

Anyway, after the ottomans conquered northern Africa, they offered an alliance with the kingdom of morocco, to launch reverse attack against Spain, so that Muslim expansion through Europe to be from the west of Europe in addition to the east, but the king of morocco refused since he was afraid of an ottoman domination over his kingdom.

> >

By the way, the Jewish came to the ottoman state, not the ottomans settled the Jewish.

> >

> >

> >

Back to Top
Peace View Drop Down
Immortal Guard
Immortal Guard


Joined: 29-Jul-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
  Quote Peace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Aug-2005 at 12:45
Originally posted by countrymercury

What is to say Arab is a bad condition under ottoman Empire refers to not known any bad conditions of turks in Turkey at the same time 

what time are you talking about

Back to Top
OSMANLI View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel
Avatar

Joined: 24-Nov-2004
Location: North Cyprus
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 740
  Quote OSMANLI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Aug-2005 at 07:54

Firstly i am shocked at what is being said in this topic. I havent logged on for a while and when i do i see people posting things that their grandfathers have said, which to be honest i the things said are quite silly and have no place here.

Al Bedawi thank you for your first thread, you had many interesting yet true points. However you did not explain the tale of when the Yemenis asked for Ottoman help aginst the British,whenthe Turks came the Yemenis and British jointly attacked the Turks. Plz explain.

If the Arabs did not except the authority of the Turkish Caliph the true they had a fair point although the Sharia says that those that try to divde the unity of the Ummah should be killed. WHy after independents did the Arabs not bring back the Caliph, if it was so important to them?

The point about Muslim Spain is not quite true. As the TUrks at thetime had internal problems and yet sent a few ships (Not nearly enough to do much good)

I try to make points not as a Turk but as a historian. THis is what i have learned from my research. Do not get insulted for you to are a brother

Back to Top
Fizzil View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 03-Nov-2004
Location: United Arab Emirates
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 197
  Quote Fizzil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Aug-2005 at 21:33

Most unfortunate events it was when the arabs revolted against the ottomans, if i was an arab i'd fight with the turks against the british and their arab allies. Its all history now..

Let me address a few points:

Quote from Osmanli:

Al Bedawi thank you for your first thread, you had many interesting yet true points. However you did not explain the tale of when the Yemenis asked for Ottoman help aginst the British,whenthe Turks came the Yemenis and British jointly attacked the Turks. Plz explain.

I think the entire point was a ploy, i'm not sure really but based on historical reasons the yemenis were under heavy ottoman influence before the british started to intervene in the arabian peninsula, in another point i have to stress is the yemenis are back stabbers, not ordinary backstabbers at that, not even the british remained for too long. Most famous example is when they fought the saudi army in the morning, and fought the egyptian army THAT IS helping them at night (yemeni civil war during the hieght of arab nationalism).

If the Arabs did not except the authority of the Turkish Caliph the true they had a fair point although the Sharia says that those that try to divde the unity of the Ummah should be killed. WHy after independents did the Arabs not bring back the Caliph, if it was so important to them?

The objective of the arab revolt was to rid itself of ottman rule, and establish a united arab state from morroco to the gulf, with a caliph at the center who is the sherrif of mecca, the british promised them they would establish an arab state, but they didn't quite get through with their promise.

I'd say between WWI 1918's till the 1950 was enough time for the dreams of a united caliphate to erode and arab nationalism to fester and grow. On the turkish caliph, i can't recall his name, he is considered a legitimate caliph.

The point about Muslim Spain is not quite true. As the TUrks at thetime had internal problems and yet sent a few ships (Not nearly enough to do much good)

I read that too, the turks were the only defenders of Islam, up until attaturk abolished the caliphate. The only arab states who successfully fought european colonisation were the omanis and to some extent the algerians. I wouldn't blame them however most arab states were not that well off, the ottomans were the only force that is able to project their forces and mobilise them effectively.

To Osmanli: I am arab too and none of your posts offend me, i really admire your behaviour and conduct on these forums, you are a very humble, decent and intelligent person.

I wish every muslim would be like you, but thats wishful thinking only

Back to Top
barbar View Drop Down
General
General
Avatar
retired AE Moderator

Joined: 10-Aug-2005
Location: Italy
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 781
  Quote barbar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Aug-2005 at 05:03
Originally posted by Oguzoglu

"Turk has no friend but Turk."

My grandpa, 1990s...

I'm sorry to say this that I think your grandpa is a narrow-minded person.  Friends are earned. You can never be friends with others if you try to exclude them from your circle of friendship. 

Originally posted by Fizzil

I think the entire point was a ploy, i'm not sure really but based on historical reasons the yemenis were under heavy ottoman influence before the british started to intervene in the arabian peninsula, in another point i have to stress is the yemenis are back stabbers, not ordinary backstabbers at that, not even the british remained for too long. Most famous example is when they fought the saudi army in the morning, and fought the egyptian army THAT IS helping them at night (yemeni civil war during the hieght of arab nationalism).

And I think above saying is appicable to Yemenis. They seemed to be  the friends of their own. Personally, I despise them.

Originally posted by Fizzil

The objective of the arab revolt was to rid itself of ottman rule, and establish a united arab state from morroco to the gulf, with a caliph at the center who is the sherrif of mecca, the british promised them they would establish an arab state, but they didn't quite get through with their promise.

I'd say between WWI 1918's till the 1950 was enough time for the dreams of a united caliphate to erode and arab nationalism to fester and grow. On the turkish caliph, i can't recall his name, he is considered a legitimate caliph.

No one should blame Arabs for their nationalistic activities whatever the aftermath was. They had the right to try to gain the power to decide their own fate.

Originally posted by Fizzil

I read that too, the turks were the only defenders of Islam, up until attaturk abolished the caliphate. The only arab states who successfully fought european colonisation were the omanis and to some extent the algerians. I wouldn't blame them however most arab states were not that well off, the ottomans were the only force that is able to project their forces and mobilise them effectively.

What an objective point!!!!

Originally posted by Fizzil

To Osmanli: I am arab too and none of your posts offend me, i really admire your behaviour and conduct on these forums, you are a very humble, decent and intelligent person.

I wish every muslim would be like you, but thats wishful thinking only

I've got exteremly happy to read this post!

 

Back to Top
OSMANLI View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel
Avatar

Joined: 24-Nov-2004
Location: North Cyprus
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 740
  Quote OSMANLI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Aug-2005 at 08:33

WOW, Shukran Fizzil. Your comment "I wish every muslim would be like you, but thats wishful thinking onlytrully" means a lot to me.

Shukran also to brother Barbar for your thread. Although the Oguzoglu's grandfathers saying "Turk has no friend but Turk." is actually a famous quote by Ataturk. My grandfather to has told me this. Your right in saying that it is a narrow minded thing to say. I for one have freands of TUrkish and non TUrkish ethnicity such Greek Cyp., Yemeni, Pakistani, Tamil, Muslim, Christian, Hindu etc.

We must remember that history is a lesson for us all, for we must not make the same mistakes of the past. This can only be done by propergating unity between the Ummah whilst still having respect for non-Muslims.

Once again thank you

Back to Top
Evrenosgazi View Drop Down
Consul
Consul
Avatar

Joined: 17-Sep-2005
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 379
  Quote Evrenosgazi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Oct-2005 at 08:56
I think this topic is really disgusting.A Bedevi tell a word and we are dealing with it , cant we see his complex about Turks, so this Bedevi ruled his camel we ruled the world our difference is that we are not equal
Back to Top
ok ge View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar
Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 29-Aug-2005
Location: Saudi Arabia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1775
  Quote ok ge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Oct-2005 at 11:28

Evrenosgazi,

    This topic was last discussed in the 22nd of August. Today we are in the 1st of October.

D.J. Kaufman
Wisdom is the reward for a lifetime of listening ... when youd have preferred to talk.
Back to Top
Hamoudeh View Drop Down
Knight
Knight


Joined: 06-Dec-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 75
  Quote Hamoudeh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Dec-2005 at 14:44

Originally posted by Al Bedawi

The Fact that Sufis were allowed to visit the graves of The Sahaba and Play music Much to the protests of The Sherieef of Mekka.

I think you raise several good points and concerns, but I would like a reference for this particular one: name, date, exact statements and source.

Ma`salam

 

 

Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Dec-2005 at 00:27
Originally posted by ok ge

Evrenosgazi,

    This topic was last discussed in the 22nd of August. Today we are in the 1st of October.

and now is 09/12/2005...

Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.094 seconds.