Decay of the Ottoman Empire

 Britain, France, Spain, and Portugal were the big colonial powers of the new world simply because of their location, the Ottoman empire was far to the east, theres no way the west would allow Ottoman ships to get to the Americas, without this the Ottoman Empire fell behind the western powers, as everybody else was expanding elsewhere and moving on, the Ottoman empire was left behind and drifted further and further behind.

 Hence why its often been said that, the Ottoman empire was an empire living in the past, it didnt advance whilst others were advancing so a decay in an ever changing and advancing world was inevitable.

Edited by Heraclius

Originally posted by HulaguHan Every empire is�born, lives and dies. This is a rule, IMHO, what we are discussing is not meaningful.� Ottoman Empire is gone because it has to be gone.

I cant agree with this. Death does not just come to the footsteps of an empire and say "well your done". A serioes of troubles and bad events occur that bring the empire to that point. Considering that many empires have lasted centuries. The degradation builds up and catches up with the empire. It happened to the Romans, and every other empire.

Hey guyz this is my first message. This is an interesting topic what if the turks discovered the New World? Well i would say wait couple a months and buy Age of Empires III (the age of discovery). There are 8civilazations including The Ottomans !!!  Its a strange idea: Turks in America, but we shouldnt forget that after conquering Konstantiniyye in 1453, European powers had to seek alternative routes for their trade: this was the beginning of the new discoveries. Ensemble Studios focuses on somethingelse (which is damn right):

" The Ottomans had a powerful navy, an extensive experience with ruling a multi-lingual empire, excellent ships, and trade routes extending east and south making far longer voyages than it would take to go to the New World. It was clearly within their power. "
ES_Sandyman (VIP)

"The Ottomans didn't need to go to the new world. The Ottomans were already fabulously wealthy because they controlled the trade routes to Asia. They had great scientists and engineers, and one of the best navies on the planet. Had they wanted to go to the new world, there is no doubt they would have done so.
In fact, Columbus and Spain reached the Americas attempting to find a Pacific route to Asia to, you guessed it, compete with the Ottomans.
But if you want to land Janissaries in Mexico, ally with the Aztecs and compete with the Spanish, go for it. They are without a doubt the hardest civ to play, but they're fun."
ES_DeathShrimp (VIP)

(my english is very bad srry for that, my dutch and turkish are much better )

Originally posted by Ottoman_AKINCI Hey guyz this is my first message. This is an interesting topic what if the turks discovered the New World? Well i would say wait couple a months and buy Age of Empires III (the age of discovery). There are 8civilazations including The Ottomans !!!  Its a strange idea: Turks in America, but we shouldnt forget that after conquering Konstantiniyye in 1453, European powers had to seek alternative routes for their trade: this was the beginning of the new discoveries. Ensemble Studios focuses on somethingelse (which is damn right): " The Ottomans had a powerful navy, an extensive experience with ruling a multi-lingual empire, excellent ships, and trade routes extending east and south making far longer voyages than it would take to go to the New World. It was clearly within their power. " ES_Sandyman (VIP) "The Ottomans didn't need to go to the new world. The Ottomans were already fabulously wealthy because they controlled the trade routes to Asia. They had great scientists and engineers, and one of the best navies on the planet. Had they wanted to go to the new world, there is no doubt they would have done so. In fact, Columbus and Spain reached the Americas attempting to find a Pacific route to Asia to, you guessed it, compete with the Ottomans. But if you want to land Janissaries in Mexico, ally with the Aztecs and compete with the Spanish, go for it. They are without a doubt the hardest civ to play, but they're fun." ES_DeathShrimp (VIP) (my english is very bad srry for that, my dutch and turkish are much better )

How are they going to get there? Through Gibraltar? Go south round Africa and you have a problem beating north before you get to the easterlies. That's if you can get down the Indian Ocean and round the Cape in the first place.

I guess you have to take over the Maghreb, and get out via Casablanca or some such place. But Ottoman control of the Maghreb wasn't that secure.

The real breakthrough here was with the Western invention of multi-masted square rig, to which Columbus converted the Nina and the Pinta in the first leg of the voyage. Still the major factor was economic - why waste time and money on a difficult voyage west when there were much more profitable and easier pickings going east?

 

Originally posted by Vlad Catrina The tolerance of the Ottomans was incredible. I don`t know why people consider them so cruel.

Now lad, I am sory to argue however you see, hehe well it is quite the opposite. Thanks to them the culture of the occupied European nations was reapeatedly burned and destroyed. Such as Monestaries, history information , RELIGION, etc. I don't know how these cultures have pulled it off for so long.

Also the people of those nations suffered genocides after genocides, and even slavery during the long 5 cent. period. I read about one of the occupied nations how it had 2 mill when Britain had the same amount. centuries later Britain has 10 times this while the occupied nation has around the same.

The nations of Eu. were basically taken out of progression.

not just Armania lad, In Serbia, Bulg. , Greece and up to Croatia-Slovenia I believe....... people were killed probably daly for them beng Christian. And if they loose their religion than culture follows and then identity overall.

"I cant agree with this. Death does not just come to the footsteps of an empire and say "well your done". A serioes of troubles and bad events occur that bring the empire to that point. Considering that many empires have lasted centuries. The degradation builds up and catches up with the empire. It happened to the Romans, and every other empire."

Very true Iskender Bey ALBO.

 

"Depends which empire you talk about ... some empires die of internal "disease" like Rome, Ottoman, Han Dynasty etc. While others are killed by other aggressive younger soon-to-be empires. Some examples are the Khwarezim Shah Persian empire, the Seljuk and even the Mongol empire. They generally follow the rule that the faster they grow the quicker they also fall."

 Thats true too vulkan02....

Edited by Praetorian

Originally posted by Thracian Originally posted by Vlad Catrina The tolerance of the Ottomans was incredible. I don`t know why people consider them so cruel. Now lad, I am sory to argue however you see, hehe well it is quite the opposite. Thanks to them the culture of the occupied European nations was reapeatedly burned and destroyed. Such as Monestaries, history information , RELIGION, etc. I don't know how these cultures have pulled it off for so long. Also the people of those nations suffered genocides after genocides, and even slavery during the long 5 cent. period. I read about one of the occupied nations how it had 2 mill when Britain had the same amount. centuries later Britain has 10 times this while the occupied nation has around the same. The nations of Eu. were basically taken out of progression.

Compare your source with others.One high school student could distinguish how fabricated that british pop. example...A book is not a holy thing.Some books are like treasure;some are garbage.

And without doubt noone suffered more than Turks during the decay of the ottoman empire.Because It was the Turks whom were pushed out of the lands they used to live.It was The Turks who always retreated.It was the Turks who lost the battles...It was  TheTurks who didnt have any big power on their backs.

Got the differance?

Ottomans cruelly punished any uprisings. That's true. However, killing people just because they were Christians didn't take place. Because they were the real tax sources of the Empire. Non-Muslims paid higher taxes than the Muslims... I mean Ottomans dealt with money, rather than religions, culture, etc. For example they hated nomadic Turkish tribes, because they weren't settled so they weren't paying taxes and they were severely punished by Ottomans. On the other hand, tax paying Christians were employed in government, especially in foreign affairs (as translators or diplomats)... Also slavery is a different concept. A slave can be bought and sold by his/her owner or he/she is confined to a part of land to create surplus production for the owner/landlord. So slavery didn't take place (except the castrated men in the harem at the classical times)... But of course you can complain about the harsh treatments and cruelty against the uprisers... 

Edited by kotumeyil

Now this is getting very ridiculous. Was what I wrote even read by anyone who has so strongly "countered" my statements. I do believe that I mentioned how the people of -from Greece all the way to Hungary and, I believe Slovenia, were literary experienced SLAVERY, KILLINGS OF PEOPLE IN HORRIBLE WAYS

You believe? Is Ottoman history a religion to you? Or do they make young brains believe these in your country (noting that Thracians are Turks today)

is considered to be the darkest, most horrible period of its history

Of course it is, non-believer Muslims were occupying the lands of the followers of real God and Christ.

cultural destruction

I wish it was. Then we'd have no communication problems with you today, and you'd join us in the non-English board! Shame on Ottomans, for not totally erasing your culture...

occupied Eu countries which, by then, have LITERALY went through absolute HELL

There was no EU those times, so the occupied lands didnt belong to EU. Well, if those lands became a hell during the Ottoman period, why didnt they become a heaven now? People became to massacre their brothers because of ther religion after the Ottomans there, is this what you call heaven? Then I prefer the united Ottoman hell instead of the Balkan city states of our age...

But I agree on you that Ottomans suffered much from those liberations, they werent necessary at all...