Semiramis

It looks like i may possibly have been wrong about Semiramis, though possibly not. I've rearranged the first post matches point by point. It is possible that they might perhaps be able to each and all be picked apart because i wasn't careful with my sources. It looks like Semiramis could be any of a number of times (including Nimrod, Gilgamesh, Sargon, Hammurabi, Tukltininurta, Shamsiadad 5).

Semiramis: name Semiramis/S(h)ammu-ramat/Shamiram (supposed/proposed to be from summat "dove (goddess loves her)", or shem "name" + aram "exalted", or  shemiramoth "images/things of Shemiram", or "manifestation of the exalted", or "Semiramis goddesses"]).
Hammurabi: name (C)hammu-rabi/Khammu Rabi/Khammuragas/kimta-rapashti/'ammu-rapi (from Sumerian khammu/khamu/khamala "lotus/plant" or a god Hammu or 'ammu "paternal kinsman", + raba/rabi "great" or rapi "healer"?); (and/or Shamsiadad 1/[Sosarmos])
Homai: Homai.
[There are some known other possible examples of s(h)/(c)h and m/g/b interchanges within/between the languages.]

Semiramis: legendary/myth, mentioned in/by Berosus,
Hammurabi: historical/archaeological, not mentioned in Berosus / one source reckons he is also mentioned in/by Berosus?

Semiramis: described as “king”/“wore a garment that did not show whether she was man or woman”/queen,
Hammurabi: toga like robe [that looks feminine-ish-like], (darling of the sun god,) king/lugal/en/"lord";
Homai: queen.

Semiramis: Babylon(ian)/Assyria/Chaldea queen,
Hammurabi: Babylon king, [Old Assyrian Period,] A list of Hammurabi's ancestors has some same names as early kings of Assyrian king list.

Semiramis: 42yrs (or 55yrs Belus) (62 yrs old),
Hammurabi: 42yrs or 55 yrs, [21 yrs / 56 yrs Venus tablets?],
Homai: 32 yrs.

Semiramis: wife of Ninus son of Belus,
Hammurabi: associated with/close to date of Belus,

Semiramis: warrior/conquered whole middle eastern world/invaded Kush & India/military campaign against Medes & Chaldeans,
Hammurabi: a victorious general/warrior / won series of wars / all of Mesopotamia / empire,
Homai: Persian.
Pundarika: Indian.

Semiramis: founded/(re-)built Babylon/Hanging Gardens/embankments/walls/many cities,
Hammurabi: public works/great builder of cities/irrigation systems/temples/fortifications/walls, had to deal with floods,

Semiramis: daughter of Syrianess, Syrian letters,
Hammurabi: Amorite/W Semit/from Syria,

Semiramis: Ninus demanded Semiramis from Menones/[Onnes],
Hammurabi: demanded return of statues taken by Khedorlaomer,

Semiramis: of Mede mountains (north), (campaign against Medes,) 'Semiramis Mts' (Persia).
Hammurabi: Kassite from Elam mountains,
Homai: Persian.

Semiramis: “woman of palace of Shamsi-adad [5?]”,
Hammurabi: conquered Shamsi-adad [1]'s dyn,

Semiramis: "1st", [1st king of Assyria, built Nineveh,] start of Babylonian history,
Hammurabi: [Old Assyrian/Shamsiadad 1,] 1st Babylonian dyn/Old Babylonian/Hammurabi, [Venus tablets].

Semiramis: Nineveh/Ninus/Ninyas, Ishtar/Astarte,
Hammurabi: Nineveh temple of Ishtar, [Venus tablets],

Semiramis: plants/flowers/trees/hanging gardens,
Hammurabi: lotus/plant,
Pundarika: lotus.

Semiramis: Shammuramat-Su,
Hammurabi: Nahar-Khammurabi,

Semiramis: beauty, (semi) divine/deity/goddess,
Hammurabi: lotus a symbol of beauty and divinity,

Semiramis: date 2200/2192/2182/2006/1996/1987/1965/1910 / 1255 / "c800/740" ; Ctesias' Attosa ("Semiramis (2)"?) date 1448- 1425/1428-1421;
Hammurabi: date "2290-2235"; [&/or "ca 1565-1522 bc" for Hammurabi?]; [synchronism of 1st Bab dyn with 13th dynasty of Egypt (Moses ca 1400s was end of 12th dyn)]; [still-present orthodox 1st Bab dyn date is either 1848 (high) / 1792 (conventional/middle) / 1736 (low) / 16xx (ultrashort/ultralow)]; [Venus tablets have been dated as either 2113/2105 bc / 1977/1956 bc / 1419 bc* / 8th cent bc]; [Hammurabi connection with Kedorlaomer?];

Semiramis: women are known for law even nowadays; Semiramis noted for or associated with wisdom / known for intelligence, &/or "daughter of god of wisdom", "decreed Behistun inscription", Syrian letters, [Simmos/Simmas,] ....
Hammurabi: law code, Shamash/Samas (god of justice/law) gives law code to Hammurabi.

Semiramis: shepherd Simmos/Simmas, Semi-,
Hammurabi: shepherd of his people, Shamash/Samas/Utu, Sippar,

Hammurabi: after Adusin/Abilsin of Babylon, &/or after Waradsin &/or Rim-sin/Eri-aku of Larsa.
Homai: successor of Ardshir.

(I may be wrong about uncertain things like this sometimes, but I'm pretty sure I am not wrong about some other things like the 12 battles of Arthur, etc though.)


Edited by Arthur-Robin - 07-Jan-2015 at 12:12

welcome back Sharrukin. 

I agree that Hammurabi was a king. The idea i had was that Semiramis who is legendary was not really a queen but that that is corruption from the robe of Hammurabi on law code stela (&/or lotus etc). I will have to check the other statues like you mention. I don't remember Gudea's looking much like Hammurabi's but more like "Turanian". I could be wrong about Semiramis/Hammurabi.

I believe some of the dates are not literal but "code", or confounded, some do seem to coincide. I guess i will have to try decrypt them if/when time.


belus 2286/2231/semiramis/assyrian 2006 - 1306/[1500?]yrs - median 700bc. (easy/simple version)*

observations Babylon 2234 bc - 1903 yrs - Aristotle 331bc.

kutirnahunte 2285/2220 bc - 1850/1635 yrs - ashurbanipal/650.

... - 1805 yrs - 712bc.

ninus 2192 bc - 1995 yrs - philip 197bc.

babylon built 2231 bc - 1002 yrs - Trojan 1229 bc.

belus - 322yrs - trojan.

observations began 2473/2243 bc - 720/490/[480]yrs - phoroneus/1753 bc.

72 books Bel.

assyria/1220bc - 520 years" - 700bc.

Semiramis 1255bc - 526yrs - Phulus/Pulu/TP 729 bc.

1965 bc/ Ninus & Semiramis 1910bc - (33 desc/1070 y - Sardanapalus/c840bc/Medes - 870yrs) 1995 yrs - V Pat c 30ad.

semiramis "c800/c740bc" - "200yrs"/5gens/6gens/[170/166y?] - nitocris/[last]/labynetus*/cyrus.

king built Borsippa ziggurat - 42 ages - nebuchadnezzr 2.

sargon/naramsin 3750/2750bc - 3200/2200yrs - 550bc/nabonidus [labynetus].

* more confusing version
belus 2286/2231/1st king assyria/built nineveh/ninus/2200/2006/semiramis/start babylonian history/ninyas - 1500 yrs (33/30 gens/decs /"for many"/1500/1400/1360/1306 yrs (20 gens for 1000 yrs (1448/1425/1428/1421) - trojan war 1184bc - 408 yrs) - 776/sardanapalus/800/700bc/median - 9 medes for 250 yrs) - astyages/cyrus/550bc.



Edited by Arthur-Robin - 11-Jan-2015 at 15:10

error in transmission slash reporting aside....who then based on academic interp is the most reliable? whose veracity.. all being equal.. stands the test?

there is an old axiom in history that says the 'closer the observer' even he who uses suspect sources (as we might view them) to the alleged event... again all being equal.... reigns supreme.

Originally posted by Centrix Vigilis error in transmission slash reporting aside....who then based on academic interp is the most reliable? whose veracity.. all being equal.. stands the test? there is an old axiom in history that says the 'closer the observer' even he who uses suspect sources (as we might view them) to the alleged event... again all being equal.... reigns supreme.

I agree if i understand you correctly (though i guess i may perhaps not always practise it?). Orthodox academia always seem to me to say modern scholars are best and early/original/traditional sources are "suspect" (though they do have their chronologies tracing developments back through literary developments/evolution/embelishments/additions to earliest sources). I'm the opposite i prefer traditional sources over modern scholars theories.

Herodotus' depends on things like what the 5 generations is, etc?

Originally posted by Sharrukin I doubt that the word translated as "generation" can mean anything more than how we would use It in modern usage or the span of a reign. If used in as in a span of 25 years, then no more than 150 years until the end of the Babylonian kingdom.   Greeks seem to use generation or the span of a reign like something like 33 years, so in this cause nothing higher than 200 years. A study of Herodotus may yield how he uses the word in other passages.

It could be so that it is same as generation elsewhere in his 9 books. But it could also be as i have wondered that it could mean other. Compare the other sources i listed 30/33 generations, 42 ages, etc. Compare 5 generations could even match 5 Shamsiadads. Compare that he says like Berosus that Assyrian power was 500 years. So i maintain that his generation / 5/6 generations could be anywhere from 200 to 500 years, which can fit anywhere between Hammurabi/Shamsiaddad 1 (true date ca 1400s) and Shamuramat/Shamsiadad 5 "ca 800 bc" (time of Jonah?). A generation can be 30 years (modern/Genesis 11), 40 years (biblical), 100/110/120 years (Abraham/Egypt/etc).

I greatly regret I'm not 30 years younger. My passions now instead are not necessarily of research...but are directed elsewhere.

Yeah, me too.   That is why I'm not here most of the time.   It is probably safest to take Herodotus at his context and not try to find some secret "code" for "generation".   Semiramis - 200 years tops down to the fall of Babylon or about 740 BC.   This would coincide with the reign of Esarhaddon of Assyria, which in turn would be short another 70 years to the time of Shammuramat, the Assyrian queen.