Irish are Really the Sons of Mil

The Salian Franks, a Germanic speaking people, traced their ancestry to the Sicambri, a clan of Cimmerians, via the Carolingians and Merovigians (cf. Merlin “Born from the Sea”).   Clovis (466-511 CE) the Merovingian was responsible for having united the Frankish empire.   He was the first Christian king of France, and during his baptism he was referred to as a Sicambri.

Originally posted by mojobadshah The Salian Franks, a Germanic speaking people, traced their ancestry to the Sicambri, a clan of Cimmerians, via the Carolingians and Merovigians (cf. Merlin “Born from the Sea”).   Clovis (466-511 CE) the Merovingian was responsible for having united the Frankish empire.   He was the first Christian king of France, and during his baptism he was referred to as a Sicambri.

No, Gregor only wrote, "proud Sugambri". Whether Clovis, who died one generation before gregor was born, called himself so is unknown. The Sugambri disappeared in the 1st century CE. They were settled left of the Rhine by the Romans after they were defeated. Salians are first mentioned in 357 CE, Franks were first known in 291 CE. Hard to construct any relation between Sugambri and Salii. Merovingian traditions show as well connections with North Sea germanic people, but not with the steppe.

Originally posted by beorna Originally posted by mojobadshah The Salian Franks, a Germanic speaking people, traced their ancestry to the Sicambri, a clan of Cimmerians, via the Carolingians and Merovigians (cf. Merlin “Born from the Sea”).   Clovis (466-511 CE) the Merovingian was responsible for having united the Frankish empire.   He was the first Christian king of France, and during his baptism he was referred to as a Sicambri. No, Gregor only wrote, "proud Sugambri". Whether Clovis, who died one generation before gregor was born, called himself so is unknown. The Sugambri disappeared in the 1st century CE. They were settled left of the Rhine by the Romans after they were defeated. Salians are first mentioned in 357 CE, Franks were first known in 291 CE. Hard to construct any relation between Sugambri and Salii. Merovingian traditions show as well connections with North Sea germanic people, but not with the steppe.

In Roman and Merovingian times, it was a custom to declare panegyrics. These poetic declarations were held for fun or propaganda to entertain guests and please rulers. Those panegyrics played an important role in the transmission of culture. One of the ritual customs of these poetic declarations is the use of archaic names for contemporary things. Romans were often called Trojans, and Salian Franks were called Sicambri. An example of this custom is remembered by the 6th century historian Gregory of Tours (II, 31), who states that the Merovingian Frankish leader Clovis I, on the occasion of his baptism into the Catholic faith, was addressed as a Sicamber by Saint Remigius, the officiating bishop of Rheims. At the crucial moment of Clovis' baptism, Remigius declared, "Now you must bend down your head, you proud Sicamber. Honour what you have burnt. Burn what you have honoured." It is likely that this recalled a link between the Sicambri and the Salian Franks, who were Clovis' people.

More examples of Salians being called Sicamber can be found in the Panegyrici Latini, Life of King Sigismund, Life of King Dagobert and other old texts.

The Carolingian kings of the Franks traced Merovingian ancestry to the Germanic tribe of the Sicambri. Gregory of Tours documents in his History of the Franks that when Clovis was baptised, he was referred to as a Sicamber with the words "Mitis depone colla, Sicamber, adora quod incendisti, incendi quod adorasti."'. The Chronicle of Fredegar in turn reveals that the Franks believed the Sicambri to be a tribe of Scythian or Cimmerian descent, who had changed their name to Franks in honour of their chieftain Franco in 11 BC.

http://www.whenthenewsstops.org/2012/08/girl-traces-us-presidents-family-tree.html

Originally posted by mojobadshah http://www.whenthenewsstops.org/2012/08/girl-traces-us-presidents-family-tree.html

But as you see, even Barak obama!

I have learned several things in the internet. One thing is, that I do not trust genealogies I haven't verified by myself. I am doing family research too and I once found a great family tree of an progenitrix. This tree related here with persian, babylonian, assyrian, makedonian and jewish kings, it even made these progenetrix (and so me) a descendent of pharao necho II. When I tried to verify these tree I very quickly found, that there were, to be handsome, some faults in it. Sometimes a child was added to the wrong father or mother or if a generation or parents weren't know, they were invented. It was a very smart done family tree, but a faked one.
I do not know the family research of these young girl. So I don't want to claim she faked it, even not that she made mistakes. But if you can't link the tree here, so that I or others can verify it, I am sceptical.

What I concede is, that if you go back in time and use the male and female lines, you can get a lot of people as ancestors. especially if you have anoble person, even if it is just a single one, the chance to be related withlots of nobles is great.
I told you above, I share ancestors with the queen, too. The farer you go back in time, the more famous people one can find. E.g. can I trace a line back to Hugo Capet, my 35th greatg-randfather. Hugo Capet is a 4th great-grandson of Imma of Schwaben, who belongs to the Agilolfingers. The Agilolfingers are related with the lethinge, kings of the Lombards. I am as well related with henry I of france, my 33rd great-grandfather. Via him I am related with emperors like Leo Vi and Basileos I (or maybe Michael IIIfor insider!), via him I am as well with the above mentione Ingelger, the first of the Anjou. In Ireland I am related with Loisig Mac Morda, Donnchad mac Domnaill Remair, Brian Boruma, and tadg mac cathal. I have Charlemagne a several times in my tree, all around the 40th great-grandfather. I have as well Louis IV L'Outremer as 35th great-grandfather. Via him I am related with Alfred the Great, who himself is said to be the 7th grat-grandson of Bertha, a daughter of Charibert I, himself the great-son of Clovis. Clovis wife is a Burgundian, descendent of Gundiok, probably the son of Gundahar of Burgundy. Well, I could go on for hours. And if the young girl is right I share the same ancestor with the US presidents, John Lackland, my 26th great-grandfather.
26th great-grandfather means, that John Lackland is 1 of 268.435.456 theoretically grandparents in that generation (if I calculated correct). Just imagine how many others could claim descendence of him, too, if the would knew about their ancestry?

Originally posted by Windemere Thanks for all of the above posts. There are probably a great many people throughout the world who descend from Charlemagne, Hugh Capet, Brian Boru, Alfred the Great.( Anyone who descends from King John of England (John Lackland) automatically has a descent from Alfred the Great).  These people likely have innumerable descendants. But being able to trace the descent is impressive.

I allways joke, find one, get all.

Haven't you seen the King Arthur movie where he's a Sarmation? Also might be worth reading "From Scythia to Camelot."  And Celtic god Lugh's weapon is a fiery spear from Persia.  

Also, the House of Anjou were incorporated into the Grail legend of Parzival as the lineage of Fisher Kings known as Gahumert, Gandin, Percival and his brother Feirefiz.  Gahmuert was a corruption of the name Gayomaretan, the first mortal in Zoroastrianism.


 

Further to my last post, there is much academic argument as to whether or not Mil Espana, or Miletius or his sons ever visited Ireland, although there seems to be some consensus that he did live about the time of Ptomely II. I have not seen any evidence of him having been Scythian, although that's what the myths say. Do you have any references about this?

Originally posted by mojobadshah Haven't you seen the King Arthur movie where he's a Sarmation? Also might be worth reading "From Scythia to Camelot."  And Celtic god Lugh's weapon is a fiery spear from Persia.

 
I saw the movie. But that what it is, a movie. It is based on a roman commander Lucius Artorius Castus, chief of a sarmatian unit of the Roman army in the late 2nd century. The Artus of the saga mainly fought against the saxons, which was 200 years later. But that's what I said above. The mythical Artus can be a conglomerate of several persons.

Originally posted by mojobadshah Also, the House of Anjou were incorporated into the Grail legend of Parzival as the lineage of Fisher Kings known as Gahumert, Gandin, Percival and his brother Feirefiz.  Gahmuert was a corruption of the name Gayomaretan, the first mortal in Zoroastrianism.

 
Wolfram of Eschenbach probably invented these story in the late 12th or early 13th century, in its first part based on the Parzival of Chretien de Troyes. But the oriental journey is as it seems an invention of Eschenbach. There are a lot of stories, lots of myths, e.g. that the merovingians are descendents of Jesus via Maria Magdalena. Well, a lot of fiction and phantasy.