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Don Quixote
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Topic: Irish are Really the Sons of Mil Posted: 23-Dec-2013 at 18:22 |
Irish are not close descendants of the Celts, but are closest to the Basqies "...One of the oldest texts composed in Ireland is the Leabhar Gabhla,
the Book of Invasions. It tells a semi-mythical history of the waves of
people who settled in Ireland in earliest time. It says the first
settlers to arrive in Ireland were a small dark race called the Fir
Bolg, followed by a magical super-race called the Tuatha de Danaan (the
people of the goddess Dana).
Most interestingly, the book says that the group which then came to
Ireland and fully established itself as rulers of the island were the
Milesians - the sons of Mil, the soldier from Spain. Modern DNA research
has actually confirmed that the Irish are close genetic relatives of
the people of northern Spain...". http://www.sott.net/article/263587-DNA-shows-Irish-people-have-more-complex-origins-than-previously-thought
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medenaywe
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Posted: 24-Dec-2013 at 03:37 |
Irish are also NaDeNaJ=nadenay=Divine genuine!Exellent!
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beorna
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Posted: 24-Dec-2013 at 04:58 |
It seems this combines facts with fiction and wishfull thinking. Of course are the irish close related with other western people. The main Y-DNA is R1b. The reason herefor is not sure. But most likely is, that it spread from a refugium in SW-Europe, where some human populations escaped to, during the LGM. From here the repopulated western Europe. It is hard to believe, that the Irish did know about that far days.
There are several invasions to Ireland recorded. The first was those of Cessair, who came around the deluge. 300 years later came the second wave under Partholon, both from Spain. Both were descendents of Noah. they were followed by the people of nemed from Scythia, then the Fir Bolg and the Tuatha de danann. The last invasion is those of the Milesians from Spain. And of course let us not forget the Fomori.
It should be clear, that, if we want to combine a historical event with the deluge, it can only happen at the end of the LGM, when the glaciers melted away. It would be remarkable, if the medieval irish would remember those times. More likely is, that medieval scholars invented these biblical relations.
Nemed should arrive around 2000 BC from Scythia. Their name is already celtic. But their people died or left and ireland was deserted for long years.
The Fir Bolg followed. Some connect them with the Belgae. But the belgae didn't arrive in britain before the 2nd century BC and in ireland they arrived even later. Short after them arrived the Tuatha de danann, who were descendend of the nemeds. O'Reilly identifies them as Dumnonii.
Well, the last wave were the Milesians. They came from Spain, but their origin lay far back in Scythia and Egypt. That's what the chronics want to make us believe. If the Irish people would descent from them, the q-celtic would have come very late to Ireland. Archaeological records have not a single evidence for this. Who the Milesians were is hard to say. There was a spanish unit of the roman army in Britain. maybe some left to ireland. But maybe it is simply invented.
So it is true, that irish people are related with western people, but not especially with basques, but with all. These people came during the neolithicum. Celtic speaking people came later and not as mass migrations. It is difficult to find them by DNA research, because they as well came from mainly R1b areas. Celts are as well not a genetical group, but a linguistic or cultural group. Such people can't be identified with DNA tests.
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medenaywe
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Posted: 24-Dec-2013 at 06:48 |
We can call approach above "Roman" approach.Hi Beorna! ("Divide et impera" approach)
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Windemere
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Posted: 24-Dec-2013 at 11:47 |
Well, although I believe that although the predominant tribal descent of the modern Irish is Celtic {probably from Iberia), since very early medieval times there's been a significant admixture of Viking and Anglo-Saxon-Norman.
Edited by Windemere - 24-Dec-2013 at 12:02
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Windemere
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Cyrus Shahmiri
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 02:09 |
I have talked about Vasku (basque) in the north of Iberian Peninsula and Osku (Uskaya in ancient Mesopotamian sources) in the south of Caucasian Iberia in this thread: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28131According to Celtic creation myth a man
named Glas, the eponymous ancestor of the Gaels, migrated from
Egypt and settled in the west of the Caspian sea, modern Gilan (Gelas or Gelae
in the ancient sources), several generations later, his descendants were invaded
by Scythians, probably in the eighth and seventh century BC, their leader named
Agnoman died on the Caspian Sea and his son Lamfhind took leadership of his
people to the Iberian Peninsula. There are several historical evidences which prove this migration, like Celtic statue menhirs:
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beorna
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 06:20 |
a propos about mouthless https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSKCAuTjGqywoMGMH_O0z2x52VFhQmZcOz8TkJEZE6DVFlrlCQbtA
Edited by beorna - 25-Dec-2013 at 06:25
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medenaywe
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 06:52 |
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medenaywe
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 07:06 |
Uska=narrow
Vasku=sounds like personal name Vasko....Willl try all in Origins.
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beorna
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 09:33 |
Let us talk about science, please!
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Cyrus Shahmiri
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 10:21 |
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medenaywe
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 10:34 |
Sorry language is out of science as i can see!
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beorna
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 11:12 |
Originally posted by medenaywe
Sorry language is out of science as i can see!
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No, linguistic is not out of science. But just because two terms in two areas far away from each sound similar, they don*t have to be related. I am from near Hannover, but it has neither to do with Han Chinese nor with the god Hanuman.
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medenaywe
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 11:19 |
Both of them were sentences once that describe the same syllables.Hadrian has the same Ha as both of words above.But thats my final commentar.Regards beorna!
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beorna
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Posted: 25-Dec-2013 at 11:31 |
megalith cultures in western and middle europe are older than 3200 BC
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toyomotor
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Posted: 26-Dec-2013 at 22:27 |
I'm afraid not. According to scientists, the Irish are a mixture of people from the UK, France and the Celts. The Celts apparently had their origins on the Iberian Peninsula, Migrated North then West until they reached Ireland and Wales. I think it was about 600AD that the Irish started settling in Scotland, mixing with the existing Picts.
See J.P. Mallorys book, "The Origins of the Irish".
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toyomotor
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Posted: 26-Dec-2013 at 22:34 |
Further to my last post-The Book of Invasions or Lebor Gabala-has been dismissed as a collection of myths. Notwithstanding the fact that a person known as Mil Espania, Milesius or Mil Soldier of Spain is mentioned in historic texts, there is no evidence of him or his sons being in Ireland.
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beorna
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Posted: 27-Dec-2013 at 11:28 |
Originally posted by toyomotor
I'm afraid not. According to scientists, the Irish are a mixture of people from the UK, France and the Celts. The Celts apparently had their origins on the Iberian Peninsula, Migrated North then West until they reached Ireland and Wales. I think it was about 600AD that the Irish started settling in Scotland, mixing with the existing Picts.
See J.P. Mallorys book, "The Origins of the Irish". |
I know these kind of thesis, with an western, iberian origin of the Celts. But till now it is strongly in contrast with the history of indo-europeans. So the region where the Celts evolved is eastern France, southern Germany and Switzerland. From there it spread to the Iberian peninsula. Celtiberian cultures start on the Iberian peninsula in the 6th century, maybe even later. Hard to believe, that they migrated then back to Gaul and from there to Ireland or that they used the direct way across the sea. Celts came from Gaul via Britannia to Ireland. The inhabitants of Ireland are mainly descendents from older, western people. Celts as invaders were rare, but their culture strong enough to celtizise the island.
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toyomotor
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Posted: 27-Dec-2013 at 19:26 |
Sorry, I can't agree. We'll leave it at that.
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beorna
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Posted: 28-Dec-2013 at 07:14 |
You don't have to agree. But it is a history forum, so why don't you bring your arguments?
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