America's Political Transformation

Originally posted by opuslola Lenin's intentions did not work? How about Stalin's?

Lenin's intentions were good, Stalin was simply a power hungry dictator.

Originally posted by opuslola You know TGS, that there is an old saying which, I would guess, most of you Socialists either ignore or since you educational level is so high, that you have forgotten or discarded years ago! It is; "The road to perdition is paved with good intentions!" Hell, Hitler had them, so did Castro and Che', so did Mao, so did Mussolini, and Pol Pot! All of the above could easily be classified as "progressive socialists!"

No, Hitler COULD NOT be considered a progressive because he was clinging on to OLD ideas, such as racism and world conquest. Hitler appealed to conservatives. Get your facts straight.

Castro and Che WERE progressives because they wanted to change the world for the better, but they failed, These are also two people whose intentions were good. Do you even know anything about Che's life? I suggest you find out and understand what his motivations were.

Originally posted by opuslola Well, it seems that they succeeded in "progressing" about 200 million people out of their lives! (note two hundred million may not be correct, but what true progressive gives a shit about a few million or so?)

And all the hundreds of millions of people that conservatives have killed doesnt mean a thing to you? Atleast when progressives kill its for change, conservatives kill to maintain the status quo or even worse, take us further back.

Originally posted by opuslola Of course America has had its share of progressives, I would guess that A. Jackson, and T. Rooseveldt, and "the president who would keep us out of war" was one of the best? President Hoover, however, would not make your list! But President Barry Obama, probably would? Oh! I am sorry, it seems he gave up his childhood nickname "Barry", a few years ago! But, don't worry about it, he still has a close group of "progressive" advisors, heck one even used to promote "bombing Federal Offices", and "Power plants", and "communication towers", etc.! Hey, a guy like that can surely be called "progressive" can he not? I for one, wonder why? Oh! I must modify the above post by stating what TGS will soon be writing! It surely will began by mentioning that I am a respondant from the "racist state of Mississippi"! Come on TGS, I just know you can't help but mention it? Laugh!

You're argument makes no sense and you I dont think you get what this conversation is about. And I like how once again you blame Obama for a mess that a conservative got this country in to.

Originally posted by Gerry57 The recent Supreme Court Decision on Corporate financial influence into our corrupt political system proves that America's Political Transformation is moving on as the Zion's have planned. As long the people accept "Capitalism" as a form of economic engine in our country.Then we can never achieve our aspiration of having the GOLD standard compare to the rest of the world. I'm not convince the "Tea Party"campaign is no better or effective than The "Change" that our new President had promised. Each politician, lawyers, and corporate board of directors must be held accountable. To instill honesty,I suggest a public hanging on Sunday with a nation-wide Bar-Ba-Que!We have no one or party that represents us and not one thing to force chance, except to tear apart our present system and start over. We must a multi-party system.Every party would receive the same amount of money to spend and six weeks to campaign for office. Negative campaigns style tactics would not be allowed. State what you or your partywould do to improve the lives of all Americans. No company would be allow to send money or speak in favor of any party or person running. All companies in American must be American owned. All illegals and their illegally American born family members must be deported.

I agree with a few things in your post. We should have a multi party system, and parties should all have an equal amount of money and time to campaign, and campaigns should be kept short. In Japan for example, every candidate gets an hour on tv to make their case, irregardless of party or number of followers.

With regards to deporting illegals, thats a monumental task which at this point is impossible. Also, many of the illegals have children that are US citizens.


Edited by TheGreatSimba - 24-Jan-2010 at 13:20

Originally posted by opuslola His motives? Murder, terrorism, torture, all wonderful motives! I suppose as you wrote, that you and they support the killing of millions so the masses might be better off? Well I also have "motives", and since it is good enough for Che' and company, then my motive(s) would be the end of terrorism to reduce the innocent people killed by them!

Here is the definition of the word motive:

1 : something (as a need or desire) that causes a person to act

now re-read what I said, and then reply once you've figured it out. Thanks.

Originally posted by opuslola I suggest we nuke all nations that sponser and support terrorists! Heck we might well kill a few hundred million, but I would cerainly feel good about my motives, which really was "to save lives!"

Well, our presidents have killed tens of millions of people on that premise So you're a little late, they beat you to it!

Originally posted by opuslola Please read about National Socialism? They were quite ready to go to bed with other Socialist nations, like the USSR! Soviet Russia even supplied the NAZI war machine with supplies! The CPUSA wrote wonderful accounts of the beneficial Socialists within the NAZI government, and how their acts opened the world to "true Socialism!", etc.

What does this have to do with anything? I'm confused. and no, the NAZI's were never in bed with the USSR except for the late 30's and early 40's when they need Soviet neutrality during their invasion of Poland. The NAZI's hated communism, and Slavs in general.

Originally posted by opuslola But of course they would also happily write that Mother Teresa was a cross dressing capitalist homo-sexual making millions of dollars of the poverty of poor Indians! chuckle Really they would!

What are you talking about? I'm so confused....

Originally posted by opuslola I would suggest that FDR would have more respect from me if he had said "We have nothing to fear but large government", rather than the phrase he actually said!

He did great things for this country, but I wouldn't expect you to know anything about that.

Originally posted by opuslola BTY, Obama and his progressive friends have in one years placed the USA into more debt that both of the Bush administrations! I believe it now exceeds over $60,000 dollars for every man, woman and child in the USA! The average family of five now owes over $300,000!

Oh my god...seriously? Obama has to pay for a war that Bush started, he has to pay to get us out of an economic crisis that Bush started, and he has to pay to fix a health care system that is falling a part because Bush did not do a single positive thing in 8 years.

Yea, its Obama's fault because your memory only goes back a year.

Originally posted by opuslola While I believe that you support taxes, I really doubt that you are willing to pay "your fair share?" Fair means "equitable" amongst other things, so merely divide the current debt by three hundred million or so, and that would be your "equitable" share!

I willing to pay more than my fair share. I'm willing to pay extra so that another human being has access to health and a better quality of life. Thats what seperates me and you I guess.

Do you even read other peoples posts? Why enter a discussion if you just ignore others and when they counter your arguments you simply do not reply but instead go off on another tangent? This isnt productive at all.

By the way, thats a very neutral reliable non-biased source you got there...bravo, I sure am speechless now.




Edited by TheGreatSimba - 24-Jan-2010 at 20:49

As far as deporting illegals and their illegal American born children would be a Hugh task, but not impossible. You first authorized local and police forces to check for illegals. Check school records and Social Security numbers of parents.Then the final phase is to mandated every company from one person to a million to sign up for the E-verify program. Then you go to every company and check everyone information. If a company is caught then they would be fined $100,000 dollars per illegal. Letting all illegals that will be allow to drive back across the border or make arrangements at the local airport to receive their flight home. Then we must use military troops to check people at their home. If things don't seem right.Then you run a background check to determined if they are really legal. At the end America would be a better country and all Americans would have a job with good pay and benefits. Hitler had some good ideas and good policies.I also feel he allowed people around him to give him very bad advice. Saving your culture, music, roots, and heritage is a very good idea it seems to me.

Zenn, wrote; "You call progressives as "those who strive for change for the advancement of society..."
This is the ideal of progressives.   Those who want progress, so to speak.   
However, the progressive "movement" has either rest in the hands of, or been mimicked by, the socialist minded for a century in the U.S.    Most of those things advanced under banner of "progressive" tend to fit less into the spirit of 'advancement' and more in the vane of social programs, social experimentation, and social justice.

I'm not trying to sound conspiratorial, however, because I think it is understandably within the nature of political powers are to take advantage of "movements" when they can, not unlike how advertisers jump on and take advantage of fads.   
What happens, though, is that the movement's ideals get consumed by the larger powers."

Thanks for your post! You do seem to see things from a uniqued viewpoint, just like TGS! My regards to both of you!

How-ever, (those deadly words, laugh!), IK feel that you are somewhat simplistic? That is, you seem to itemize people and groups into "for" or "against" your views!

For example TGS, wrote these words; "I just defined progressive, its those who strive for change for the advancement of society..."

And I would, in opposition, state that the meaning of "progressive" leans more to the "One step at a time", meaning than "getting better?"

It means, that one must have the guts to take every chance to "change" America, not via "revolution", which even the Beatles were against, to the Beatles word "Evolution", which is but one letter different than "R-evolution!", etc. So, "progressives" have decided to take every step, as not a "giant step", but as a "mouse step!", and it will only take a longer time to overcome the formerly educated "middle class", until they will forget the "real" past, and like lambs, be led into the slaughter that is formulated by every true "progressive" in history!

When it come to eliminating the "un-educated" and the "un-educatable" class, I might well agree? But, it would make me an accessory to so much violence, bloodshed, and pain, that I could not, in any good thought, ever countanence such a plan!

But, it seems, way too many of our current leaders, are again ready to "clear the field", as it may well be said! (remove the worthless)

Progressive-ism, merely means "one step at a time!" The way to progress from "a" to "z" is by merely moving along a timeline whereby, "b" becomes "f" and then "l", etc.!

Times that allows the "progressive" unit to skip letters only happens rarely! And, today it seems is one of those times? (The Obama administration)

But, perhaps "they" have been caught in time?

Edited by opuslola - 25-Jan-2010 at 19:01

Hey! I am glad you also watch the show! Maybe you will become able to pay attention next time? (actually if the Obama administration has its way, we all may be so poor that we cannot afford to pay attention? chuckle!

And, thanks! I thought I remembered the gist of his remarks and black-board demonstrations quite well!

I thought the "A - Z" analogy was quite impressive! You might well know than my remarks concerning Hitler and National Socialism, was mostly culled from one of Beck's earlier shows! Neat, huh?

By the way his TV show comes on at four PM Central time! Don't miss it?

And, do your really think that Merriam-Webster knows better than Glenn? Laugh!

You might well know that another definition of "progressive" is;
"progressive 5
Definition: advancing in severity; "progressive paralysis"

The site for the above definition is; http://ardictionary.com/Progressive/12493

Also this; "4.[adjective] favoring or promoting reform (often by government action)
Synonyms: reformist, reform-minded"

The above definition is from;
http://www.elook.org/dictionary/progressive.html

You must understand TGS, that just because the word "Progressive" contains the simple word "Progress" does not automatically prove that "reforms" or "government actions", will actually result in "Progress", any more than you can prove that "Regressive" policies, which does not receive a friendly definition in most cases, will result in "Regression!"

You might well want to read this? http://www.thefreedictionary.com/regressive

Just what would you determine is a "regressive tax?" as opposed to a "Progressive" one?

I would support the theory that the Government of the USA, is more like a "cancer" than anything else! Thus, when ever a cancer progresses, the patient gets worse off, etc., but whenever one can force the cancer to regress, then the patient might well survive!

Yes indeed, your progressive buddies may well increase the "severity" of the current situation, and lead the USA into a period of "paralysis?"

Seriously! (Note that there is no chuckle or laugh here!)

And, note that in our PC world, about the only time I can now use the word "Retard", is to describe actions designed to "retard" the growth / spread of government, or a cancer, or even a forest fire! Laugh!

Regards,

Edited by opuslola - 26-Jan-2010 at 11:11

Yes Zenn, your remarks are correct! In a Capitalist system, growth is expected to create "progress", in that more people, meant more workers, and more consumers, etc.! and I.e. more sales, and profits!

False projections concerning growth was it seems one of the main problems with the SS System and its failure! That is, it was expected that a strong growth in the population was not only expected but had to occur for this "Ponzi" scheme of sorts to have any real chance of working.

Thus, lower growth rates, helped to create a pure consumer oriented society, whereby more goods were able to be produced via improved industial methods, robotics, etc., and greater productivity! The developement of psychological studies in the advertising industry then were able to actually create a demand for products that had never before existed nor were they all products with a real use!

But, the above describes Capitalism and not Progressive-ism, aka Socialism, etc.

TGS recently wrote that; "Lenin's intentions were good.." Well, here are his intentions;

"Lenin

The revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat is rule won, and maintained, by the use of violence, by the proletariat, against the bourgeoisie, rule that is unrestricted by any laws.[9]

A state of the exploited must fundamentally differ from such a state; it must be a democracy for the exploited, and a means of suppressing the exploiters; and the suppression of a class means inequality for that class, its exclusion from democracy.[9]

The proletariat cannot achieve victory without breaking the resistance of the bourgeoisie, without forcibly suppressing its adversaries, and that, where there is forcible suppression, where there is no freedom, there is, of course, no democracy.[9]

And if you exploiters attempt to offer resistance to our proletarian revolution we shall ruthlessly suppress you; we shall deprive you of all rights; more than that, we shall not give you any bread, for in our proletarian republic the exploiters will have no rights, they will be deprived of fire and water, for we are socialists in real earnest, and not in the Scheidemann or Kautsky fashion.[9]

The dictatorship of the proletariat, i.e. the organization of the vanguard of the oppressed as the ruling class for the purpose of suppressing the oppressors, cannot result merely in an expansion of democracy. Simultaneously, with an immense expansion of democracy, which, for the first time, becomes democracy for the poor, democracy for the people, and not democracy for the money-bags, the dictatorship of the proletariat imposes a series of restrictions on the freedom of the oppressors, the exploiters, the capitalists. We must suppress them in order to free humanity from wage slavery, their resistance must be crushed by force; it is clear that there is no freedom and no democracy where there is suppression and where there is violence. — The State and Revolution"

Thus his "good intentions" meant "exploiting the exploiters", execution, murder, starvation, etc.! There could be no leniency (Lenin-cy?) given! A good pun, eh? Or was it a play on words? Laugh!

Thus, Lenin's words from above; "The proletariat cannot achieve victory without breaking the resistance of the bourgeoisie, without forcibly suppressing its adversaries, and that, where there is forcible suppression, where there is no freedom, there is, of course, no democracy.[9]"

As well as; "The revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat is rule won, and maintained, by the use of violence, by the proletariat, against the bourgeoisie, rule that is unrestricted by any laws.[9]"

Remember the above were Lenin's, "good intentions!" Boy, I am glad he had no bad intentions! chuckle!

Regards,

Edited by opuslola - 26-Jan-2010 at 12:23

Dont get progress and progressive mixed together. Progress is a vocabulary word that can be used in many different forms, like "I made progress on my essay today".

Progressive or progressives refer to a certain ideology.

At Opuslola, read a dictionary and understand the meaning of the words I am saying.

"Good intentions" and "motives" do not mean what he did or what he wanted to do, they are defined by what outcomes he wanted to achieve, which were good ones, such as equality for all, justice for all, building a utopia on Earth, etc...

Obviously, he failed.... pick up any history book. Why do I even have to explain this?

And while we are on the subject, the capitalist system has killed tens of millions more people than the Soviet Union's communism.


Edited by TheGreatSimba - 26-Jan-2010 at 13:59

As far as not been able to run and produce food for our country is alittle naive. There are plenty of people in every state in prisons who can work in the fields. With alot fewer people in our country "illegally".We can produce what we need.If it looks like we need more people then, and only then shall we allow some type of Alien guest worker program can be allowed. They must have a GPS chip implanted and be forced to live at the farms or alien housing securely locked up every night. I'm alittle shocked that you don't have any faith in our race of people to take care ourselves.We have done a good job during the ice age and during our journey though Europe. Once we have our country back. If one's has nothing to hide, then one wouldn't care and would want the law breakers punished and sent home.Then the people will elect politicians who we serve our needs rather than the special interests, the Elite and Corporations. Caught doing other wise would be public hanging on Sunday. It sounds like you may be afraid of returning our country back to the original constitution. Any changes;then the American people will decide. Now onto Hitler. History will be able to remind you that German Territory was stolen from the Fatherland and transferred to Poland and Austria. I feel Hitler or any other leader has a right to take back what belongs to them. Between America and the British they gave away what wasn't their decision to make. Now to the money changers. When they were in Russian and cause a deal of trouble there.The Gypsy's then started traveling Europe.They was trying to squeeze the money market in Germany as they have done here in modern day American. It took courage and vision to resit the traveling tramps, thieves and liars.The Jews could have left, but they decided to stir the pot. As far as saving your race, heritage, customs, music, and our linkage. I can only guess you aren't aware of your linkage. May I suggest you read the history books prior too and after the WWII. from the libraries across Europe.You may really be surprised about what you learn.

Gee! TGS, it seems we have created something like a "firestorm?" Ain't it great?

But, dear sir, it is you and your ilk that are deluded by false prophets!

You wrote; "BTW, your precious Glenn Beck was one of the biggest critics of the United States Health Care system just before Obama got elected. Then all of a sudden he makes the ridiculous claim that "it is the best health care system in the world..."

While I do not rememeber "herr doktor Beck" saying what you remember, I would not disagree! You must see, herr doktor must cultivate what ever plants that might grow from his fertilizer? chuckle!

But, for you to say that you are flummoxed?(sp) by my other posts, is remarkable!
Your were actually confused by these words?

"Originally posted by opuslola


You must understand TGS, that just because the word "Progressive" contains the simple word "Progress" does not automatically prove that "reforms" or "government actions", will actually result in "Progress", any more than you can prove that "Regressive" policies, which does not receive a friendly definition in most cases, will result in "Regression!"

You might well want to read this? http://www.thefreedictionary.com/regressive

Just what would you determine is a "regressive tax?" as opposed to a "Progressive" one?

I would support the theory that the Government of the USA, is more like a "cancer" than anything else! Thus, when ever a cancer progresses, the patient gets worse off, etc., but whenever one can force the cancer to regress, then the patient might well survive!

Yes indeed, your progressive buddies may well increase the "severity" of the current situation, and lead the USA into a period of "paralysis?"

Seriously! (Note that there is no chuckle or laugh here!)

And, note that in our PC world, about the only time I can now use the word "Retard", is to describe actions designed to "retard" the growth / spread of government, or a cancer, or even a forest fire! Laugh!"

I think that maybe you should re-read the above? And, take a deep breath, and think? Laugh!
regards,