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A question regarding what i can post.

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aslanlar View Drop Down
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  Quote aslanlar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: A question regarding what i can post.
    Posted: 20-Jun-2007 at 18:59
I was wondering if i could start a post on the armenian genocide issue. I know it's black-listed but i would like to make it a poll, and ask there to be no posts on the topic, just voting.
It would be set out like..:

Are you of Turkish descent and support the genocide
Are you of Turkish descent and deny the genocide
Are you of armenian descent and support the genocide
Are you of armenian descent and deny the genocide
Are you 'neutral' and support the genocide
Are you 'neutral' and deny the genocide

As i said, i hope it will only be a poll and there will be no posts.
Would that be possible or still not allowed?
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  Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jun-2007 at 19:10
AE Community Information, News and Announcements section should give you an idea.
 
Otherwise, check AE's telescreen.
     
   
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  Quote aslanlar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jun-2007 at 19:34
Yes i see it's blacklisted :P That's why i was wondering if i could just have a poll with no posts.
Lucky i ran it by you first :)
Anyway, thanks, and sorry for the time.


Edited by aslanlar - 02-Jul-2007 at 08:46
"The league is alright when sparrows dispute but it can do little when eagles argue" -Mussolini
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  Quote Balaam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2007 at 02:02
I think it would be much safer to stay away from the topic altogether....
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  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2007 at 09:12
Since our experience has shown that certain topics have had very explosive tendencies in the past we felt the need to diminish the capacity for ethnic flame wars. Certainly we still see passionate racial discussions on the forum today, however they will not include blacklisted ones, polls or otherwise.

Edited by Seko - 21-Jun-2007 at 09:35
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jul-2007 at 23:57
A poll with no votes? How about a hamburger with no burger, a yacht without a sail,or a dog with no tail? (only put in that bit about the dog because it rhymes.) Serious issues get more serious by being serious about them. What I like about learning to face history is the inner development of being impartial. This means accepting many unjust situations do take place. For the sake of peace in the wider world we cannot do anything about them until the parties in question can agree on a solution.   
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  Quote Byzantine Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Jul-2007 at 01:06
Originally posted by elenos

Serious issues get more serious by being serious about them. What I like about learning to face history is the inner development of being impartial. This means accepting many unjust situations do take place. For the sake of peace in the wider world we cannot do anything about them until the parties in question can agree on a solution.
 
After seeing the way EVERY single "discussion" on the Armenian genocide at AE has turned into a flamewar and a waste of forum space, it is quite predictable what will occur in the next topic on the subject.  Trust us, AE mods and many members are sick of seeing these topics.
 
Do you honestly think you can create some kind of international rapprochment on the issue by starting yet another topic at the forum?  The only people who would take part are those who would spew their hatred and start another despicable fight.  Everyone else has sense enough to stay out of the blacklisted topic.
 
So why not start a topic on something new and interesting and leave this tired old subject alone?  Better yet, how about contributing to a thread that does not have controversial subject matter.  Why must every post be some revolutionary idea whose aim is to bring about world peace in one strike?
 
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  Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Jul-2007 at 01:10
Originally posted by elenos

Serious issues get more serious by being serious about them. What I like about learning to face history is the inner development of being impartial. This means accepting many unjust situations do take place. For the sake of peace in the wider world we cannot do anything about them until the parties in question can agree on a solution.   
 
Ideally, yes. But hey, I am not a moderator. I don't have to go through their suffering...
     
   
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  Quote mamikon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jul-2007 at 05:26
Do you honestly think you can create some kind of international rapprochment on the issue by starting yet another topic at the forum?  The only people who would take part are those who would spew their hatred and start another despicable fight.  Everyone else has sense enough to stay out of the blacklisted topic.
 
 
So true...
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  Quote armenica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 05:36
I think that it's a very poor way of handling similar kind of issues, when instead of having a normal controlled discussion a certain topic is black-listed all together. That's after all what a specific part in the discussion (the denilist in this particular case) strive for.

These kind of issues, not only should, but MUST be discussed so the reality and the truth is presented. A well organised and dignified discussions and presentation of facts and sources wouldn't harm anyone (as long as we keep on to presenting facts and arguing for our point of view).

I deeply regret that the admin of this forum chose to kill the discussion all together, rather than controlling it and punishing those who violated the forum rules.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 06:22
armenia, none of us was happy about the topic being blacklisted. It came after hundreds of warning,, dozens of bans, and god only knows how many reminders.
There was no dignified discussion, its seems this is one topic where our honored Turkish and Armenian members can't get along. And it is not in the best interests of the forum to revist this issue at this time.
 
 
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  Quote Balaam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 06:25
armenica it has been tried over and over again but every single discussion had turned into nationalist flame wars, if they were to be taken off the blacklisted topic list then the same thing would happen again. It is just much easier and better for all if they stay there.
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  Quote armenica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 06:30
Well, the topic is being discussed in 3-4 other forums that I'm member of, and even if the subject might tend to overheat from time to time (which is quite natural due to the subject) those discussions have never come to bans or more important black-listing the entire subject. This forum is the only one which I know of that the question of the Armenian Genocide is tabu.

I just felt that the decission to ban the topic was unfortunate when there are obvious other examples where civilised people can argue pro and con without calling each other names and ittirating admin to such point that they choose to ban it all together.

I wonder: are there any other topics which are banned in this forum or is this specific to the Armenian genocide?
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  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 08:54
AE Community Information, News and Announcements
 
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  Quote armenica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 08:58
Ah... I see. It's rather mostly topics that has to do with Turkey and accusations regarding the treatment of people under Turkish rule plus some other. OK, I get the picture.


Edited by armenica - 11-Sep-2007 at 08:59
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  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 09:09
No. You don't get the picture! Your subtle intent to insinuate is obvious. Our blacklist came from experience regarding all of those topics. They were created by the previous administration and are maintained by this current one.
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  Quote aslanlar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 09:21
I'd just like to add, there was a typo when i first made this post. My intent was to create a poll with no posts, but only votes.
"The league is alright when sparrows dispute but it can do little when eagles argue" -Mussolini
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  Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 09:39
Aslanlar, you offered two options in terms of the genocide, support or deny..What about 'disagree with?'...Not everyone was going to either say it was a good thing or deny it ever happened. But anyway, a poll without comments is akin to a questionnaire with 'just' as an answer option..It would be a pointless exercise.
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  Quote armenica Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 10:27
Originally posted by Seko

No. You don't get the picture! Your subtle intent to insinuate is obvious. Our blacklist came from experience regarding all of those topics. They were created by the previous administration and are maintained by this current one.
 
No, I don't agree. Do you imply that this forum has less civilised members who are not able to discuss issues in a dignified matter? What about the other forums that this kind of issues are allowed to be discussed without black-listing the topic?
 
Generally I can't see why the admin can not block a certain user instead mass-punishing the entire community. That's not the correct way to handle the question and certainly not in this question since silencing the truth about the Armenian genocide is exactly what the denilist part wants to achieve.
 
As far as it goes for Turkish-specific topics, I think it's hard to help not noticing that half the black-listed topics are Turkey-related. That's just an observation which I think everyone would agree with. As I see it there are no roon in this forum for criticizing anything that could be wrong with Turkey, its past or presence. Isn't this the gist of this black-listing?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Sep-2007 at 11:30
Originally posted by armenica

Ah... I see. It's rather mostly topics that has to do with Turkey and accusations regarding the treatment of people under Turkish rule plus some other. OK, I get the picture.
 
The blacklist has nothing to do with Turkish favouritism on this forum, there are various nationalities represented both by its contributing members, and the AE staff that oversees the running, and administration of this forum, and website. It is just that such topics are futile as they always end up unproductive due to the "flame wars" they create.
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