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Korean President of Chinese origin?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Korean President of Chinese origin?
    Posted: 26-May-2007 at 02:03
You are correct in your logic, but, only partly and totally wrong in your conclusion.
 
During Qing Dynasty, the Conquerors of Qing Manchu people went to the west and subjugated the Chinese.
 
During Yuan Dynasty, the Mongols went to the South-West to colonialize the Chinese.
 
During Five dynasty period, the Shata Turks went to the south to conquer the Chinese.
 
During the Tang dynasty, the Xianbeis went to the South West to conquer the Chinese.
 
During Sui dynasty, the same.
 
During Nan Bei Chao, the Xianbeis went the same route.
 
During Han dynasty, Liu Bang went to the west.
 
During Qin dynasty, Shi Emperor, an Eastern Barbarian, went to the south-east to conquer the Chinese.
 
Almost the same with Zhou, the Qiangs.
 
During Shang, the Eastern Barbarians departed from the North East and conquered the Chinese.
 
During Xia, the Huns conquered the Chinese in the same as the Shang.
 
During the 3 Huang (Khaans: Kings) and 5 Di(Teer-Deer: Upperlords) resided in the East and ruled the south and the west, the Chinese called the Southern Barbarians, or You Min, You Miao or Man.
 
 
So, your view on the direction is totally wrong and in addition... 
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2007 at 02:07
Shan Dong people are the descendant's of Eastern Barbarians, whereas the Han(-Chinese) are the offspring of Nan Man. So, Shandong people are actually the descendants of ancient Koreans. 
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Posts: 5697 		  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2007 at 04:11
Aquda the tone and implications of your last two posts are clearly unacceptable, and highlight an ethnic agenda. I'll give you the chance to prove me wrong, but you can consider this an unofficial warning.
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Posts: 109 		  Quote Easternknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2007 at 23:00

Im lost.....
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Posts: 8 		  Quote Danny.T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2007 at 13:23
Sorry, even Aquda's interpretation and only one of the many interpretations on the dynasties  is right these people are now all turned into Chinese .   These conquerors are all Chinese now. All these dynasties are Chinese history.




Edited by Danny.T - 28-May-2007 at 07:08
"A little knowledge is a very dangerous thing."
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Posts: 28 		  Quote Intranetusa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2007 at 20:39
Aquda's posts are incorrect and very biased - highlighting a nationalistic agenda. He should know that the term "Chinese" doesn't just refer solely to the Eastern Han population.
 
 
What next? Confucious wasn't Chinese?


Edited by Intranetusa - 27-May-2007 at 20:41
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Posts: 28 		  Quote Intranetusa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2007 at 20:50
 "During Han dynasty, Liu Bang went to the west. "
Liu Bang was originally a native Han and governor of Hanzo, and founded the Han dynasty. The Han word comes from the region that he governered. He sent soldiers west on conquest missions.
 
"During Qin dynasty, Shi Emperor, an Eastern Barbarian, went to the south-east to conquer the Chinese. "
Eastern Barbarian? The 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbarians. That's just a propaganda term for anyone who wasn't a part of the current regime.
 
"Almost the same with Zhou, the Qiangs. "
Wrong. The Qiangs are a Tibetan people. They warred with the Zhou dynasty, but the Qiangs never conquered them as you claim. The Qin state eventually defeated the Qiangs and kept them in check.
 
"During Shang, the Eastern Barbarians departed from the North East and conquered the Chinese. "
Wrong again, the Zhou overthrew the Shang. The Zhou are still Chinese. As for the "Eastern Barbarian" term, any nation-state that wasn't part of the Shang was considered barbarian - including other Chinese states. Just like how the 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbaric.
 
"During Xia, the Huns conquered the Chinese in the same as the Shang."
Wrong. Records indicate the Huns ARE descended from the Xia. The Xia was integrated into the Shang.
 
 
etc etc etc
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2007 at 23:58
So?, Then, you say Korean President Rho is not a Korean or "Turned into Korean"?  Look at the title of this thread, I am talking about the "Origin", O.K?!!!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 00:02
He was not. He was("I, Qiu, am an )  "Offspring of Yin (Shang) State", the Eastern Barbarian, through his mouth. There was no China at that time. He was a citizen, so to skeak, of Lu State, a vassal state of Zhou.
 
What is your definition of "China"?
 
When did it come into being? Bye!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 00:23
Originally posted by Intranetusa

 "During Han dynasty, Liu Bang went to the west. "
Liu Bang was originally a native Han and governor of Hanzo, and founded the Han dynasty. The Han word comes from the region that he governered. He sent soldiers west on conquest missions.
 
 
There is no place like Hanzo. He was born in Pei area together with Lu Wan. That is eastern China now.
 
Originally posted by Intranetusa

 
"During Qin dynasty, Shi Emperor, an Eastern Barbarian, went to the south-east to conquer the Chinese. "
Eastern Barbarian? The 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbarians. That's just a propaganda term for anyone who wasn't a part of the current regime.
 

 
Not only the Koreans in modern Korea are the Eastern Barbarians, but also those people in Bei Jing, He Baei, Shan Dong, North of He Nan and part of Jiang Su (Huai He river) were Eastern Barbarians. They share the legends of 3 Huang (Khaan, Han meaning heaven) and 5 Di (Deer, Overlord) and 3 Wang. They had the same culture (clay pots, flat back head, same type of bronze tools, etc).
 
 
Further, it is clear that Shi Huang Di comes from the Eastern Barbarian group of Ying clan.
 
[/QUOTE]
 
"During Shang, the Eastern Barbarians departed from the North East and conquered the Chinese. "
 
Wrong again, the Zhou overthrew the Shang. The Zhou are still Chinese. As for the "Eastern Barbarian" term, any nation-state that wasn't part of the Shang was considered barbarian - including other Chinese states. Just like how the 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbaric.
 
Originally posted by Intranetusa

 
Look, you do'nt understand the meaning of "Barbarian" at all.
 
It is a relative meaning and not a fixed, or absolute meaning. Shang people considered the Proto-Chinese as Southern Barbarians (南蠻),
as the Mongols (Non-Chinese) considereed the Chinese as Barbarians  ("Nan-giad", meaning "Southern Kitad (南契丹)/Southerners of Kitan" or "Southern Barbarians (南契丹, 南蠻)", or
like the Qing Manchu people who called the Chinese as "Southern Barbarians (南蠻)" or "Nikan (Dwarfs)".
 
Originally posted by Intranetusa

 
"During Xia, the Huns conquered the Chinese in the same as the Shang."
Wrong. Records indicate the Huns ARE descended from the Xia. The Xia was integrated into the Shang.
 
 
etc etc etc
 
Xia people were the descendant's of King YU and more than 20 ancient sources show that he was "a person from Western Qiang" or a "Western Qiang", or "Western Rong".
 
Are you saying these people are the Chinese? They are either Mongols or Tibetans!  Bah!
 
Any way, who said people come from the west to the west? Enjoy that stuff. Haha!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 00:26
Originally posted by Danny.T

Sorry, Aquda's interpretation and only one of interpretations only is right these people are now all turned into Chinese now.   They are all Chinese.
 
So?, Then, you say Korean President Rho is not a Korean or "Turned into Korean"?  What an amoebic way of thinking is this?
 
 
Look at the title of this thread, I am talking about the "Origin", O.K?!!!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 00:31
LOL
Originally posted by Intranetusa

Aquda's posts are incorrect and very biased - highlighting a nationalistic agenda. He should know that the term "Chinese" doesn't just refer solely to the Eastern Han population.
 
 
What next? Confucious wasn't Chinese?
 
You say the title of this title ("Korean President of Chinese origin") is not "BIASED AND NATIONALIST"? What a funny idea you here in there?
 
 
If that is not so, I can say
"Jiang Ze Min, Chinese president of Eastern Barbarian (Korean) origin",
"Jiang Jie Shi, Chinese president of Vietnamese origin", (as can be surely ascertained by historical records or family records), blah blah blah... Ha, ha, ha!
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 00:33
Originally posted by Intranetusa

 "During Han dynasty, Liu Bang went to the west. "
Liu Bang was originally a native Han and governor of Hanzo, and founded the Han dynasty. The Han word comes from the region that he governered. He sent soldiers west on conquest missions.
 
"During Qin dynasty, Shi Emperor, an Eastern Barbarian, went to the south-east to conquer the Chinese. "
Eastern Barbarian? The 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbarians. That's just a propaganda term for anyone who wasn't a part of the current regime.
 
"Almost the same with Zhou, the Qiangs. "
Wrong. The Qiangs are a Tibetan people. They warred with the Zhou dynasty, but the Qiangs never conquered them as you claim. The Qin state eventually defeated the Qiangs and kept them in check.
 
"During Shang, the Eastern Barbarians departed from the North East and conquered the Chinese. "
Wrong again, the Zhou overthrew the Shang. The Zhou are still Chinese. As for the "Eastern Barbarian" term, any nation-state that wasn't part of the Shang was considered barbarian - including other Chinese states. Just like how the 3 Korean kingdoms considered each other barbaric.
 
"During Xia, the Huns conquered the Chinese in the same as the Shang."
Wrong. Records indicate the Huns ARE descended from the Xia. The Xia was integrated into the Shang.
 
 
etc etc etc
 
By the way, does this reply which excluded other dynasties, mean that you admit that other dynasties were not Chinese dynasties or that they were CONQUEROR DYNASTIES?LOL
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Posts: 8 		  Quote Danny.T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 07:38
Originally posted by Aguda

Shan Dong people are the descendant's of Eastern Barbarians, whereas the Han(-Chinese) are the offspring of Nan Man. So, Shandong people are actually the descendants of ancient Koreans. 



Shangdong people was not  ancient Korean.
Shangdon people was part of the Dongyi.

 Koreans if they did exist that time was descendants of one of the many  Dongyi tribes , there were nine Dongyi tribes.

Korean is not equal to whole Dongyi (Eastern barbarians).

 Korean is only part of the Dongyi too, so does Shangdong people and some other Chinese.

Who says President Loh is not Korean now?

Same still there are Chinese citizens state to have Chosen ethnic.
"A little knowledge is a very dangerous thing."
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Posts: 3335 		  Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 16:50
I don't see any big deals with this. Who cares if he is Chinese origin? As long as he does his job (Which I am not too pleased with)... I don't mind at all. I just don't like him for being such an incapable leader. Then again, I always despised leader of the united Korea with exception of Sejong... he was an excellent leader.
     
   
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Posts: 735 		  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2007 at 17:55
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

Aquda the tone and implications of your last two posts are clearly unacceptable, and highlight an ethnic agenda. I'll give you the chance to prove me wrong, but you can consider this an unofficial warning.
 
The screenname is Aguda, named after founder of Jin dynasty, who was a Jurchen conquer of China(part of China).
 
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2007 at 05:28
Originally posted by The Charioteer

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

Aquda the tone and implications of your last two posts are clearly unacceptable, and highlight an ethnic agenda. I'll give you the chance to prove me wrong, but you can consider this an unofficial warning.
 
The screenname is Aguda, named after founder of Jin dynasty, who was a Jurchen conquer of China(part of China).
 
 
 
You are right. Our ancestors were NOT Chinese. We came from different people, culture areas and we use different languages. I am Aguda's descendant and his reincarnation as well!
 
Let Omar bla blah not accept my whatever. He knows nothing! I will let him know why his words are TOTALLY unacceptable to me. He will learn as times passes!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2007 at 05:31
Originally posted by Danny.T

Originally posted by Aguda

Shan Dong people are the descendant's of Eastern Barbarians, whereas the Han(-Chinese) are the offspring of Nan Man. So, Shandong people are actually the descendants of ancient Koreans. 



Shangdong people was not  ancient Korean.
Shangdon people was part of the Dongyi.

 Koreans if they did exist that time was descendants of one of the many  Dongyi tribes , there were nine Dongyi tribes.

Korean is not equal to whole Dongyi (Eastern barbarians).

 Korean is only part of the Dongyi too, so does Shangdong people and some other Chinese.

Who says President Loh is not Korean now?

Same still there are Chinese citizens state to have Chosen ethnic.
 
Oh, my god! It looks that you are much more enlightened than other guys. Where did you even get this great enlightenment? I feel as if I see a Bodistva!
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Posts: 2408 		  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2007 at 08:44
Originally posted by Aguda

Originally posted by The Charioteer

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

Aquda the tone and implications of your last two posts are clearly unacceptable, and highlight an ethnic agenda. I'll give you the chance to prove me wrong, but you can consider this an unofficial warning.
 
The screenname is Aguda, named after founder of Jin dynasty, who was a Jurchen conquer of China(part of China).
 
 
 
You are right. Our ancestors were NOT Chinese. We came from different people, culture areas and we use different languages. I am Aguda's descendant and his reincarnation as well!
 
was you sirious when you wrote this?
Bu mıntıka'nın Dayı'sı
[IMG">http://www.allempires.com/forum/uploads/DayI/2006-03-17_164450_bscap021.jpg">
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2007 at 01:13
Originally posted by DayI

Originally posted by Aguda

 
You are right. Our ancestors were NOT Chinese. We came from different people, culture areas and we use different languages. I am Aguda's descendant and his reincarnation as well!
 
was you sirious when you wrote this?


Yeah I was wondering about that too Confused
After reading that I can't seem to take any of his other arguments seriously anymore.


Edited by lady_dilandau - 30-May-2007 at 01:18
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