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Attila the Hun-is he Asian or Indo-European?

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arras View Drop Down
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  Quote arras Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Attila the Hun-is he Asian or Indo-European?
    Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 08:55
xi_tujue >> excuse me but I don't understand your question. Who claim who?

All Indo-European people originate in Asia Minor from where they migrated westward and formed all moderm European nations (as well as historical ones like Celts, Romans, Thracians...) others migrated east to become Indian peolpe (originaly Aryana people who qonquered local non Indo-European people) Some migrated north like Georgians and Armenians. Turks and Iranians are also Indo-European.

To be Indo-European doesnt allways mean also the same ethnical origin. Some groups could simply come under influence of Indo-European people and accept theyr culture and language. Of course Indo-Europeans came under influence of other races and cultures as well.

But generaly term Indo-European have racial and linquistic meaning.

Indo-Europeans were originaly refered as Japhetic people. Name come from one of three soons of Noe to whoom they should be descendants.
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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:01
Originally posted by arras

Huns were Indo-European people as well as Allans, Sarmatians, all Turkic tribes, Scithians, Bulgars, Avars and other nomadic people who came from central Asia. Etnicaly they had same origin as most other European, Iranian and Indian (Aryana) people and their language was part of Indo-European group. There are some doubds if Ugro-Finish languages are part of Indo-European group but then that Hungarian people are direct descendants of Huns is questionable. Some historians claim it is only part of national myth like many similar across other nations.
Notice that people of Hungaria don't call themself Huns but Magiars and they don't call their country Hungaria.

Do not be confused about their "asiatic" look.
The identification of the Huns and the Hungarians is purely mythic. This mythic connection is strong and in my opinion the Hungarians feel the Huns as ours.
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  Quote Scytho-Sarmatian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:03
Originally posted by Giannis

Scytho-Sarmatian, you can purchase the dvd Attila from here if you want www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00013T79Q.
Thanks, Giannis.  I'll check it out.
 
 
 
Arras-
 
We understand what you are saying.  Attila's army did include I.E. peoples, for sure.  We are just pointing out that the leadership of the Huns was probably non-I.E. Asiatic.
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  Quote arras Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:11
Scytho-Sarmatian >> why do you think? Becouse of theyr "asiatic" look? Turks also look asiatic and they are Indo-Europeans.
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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:18
Originally posted by arras

Scytho-Sarmatian >> why do you think? Becouse of theyr "asiatic" look? Turks also look asiatic and they are Indo-Europeans.
Confused When you said asiatic you do not mean mongoloid, don't you?
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:20
no, turks are not IE, they speak an altaic language! I think u are confused, Turkish is not related to indo-european except for loan words.
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  Quote arras Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:25
Raider >> no :)

Zagros >> well I might be ...can you please write more about it? Or point to some sources of info about Turkic people and their origin?


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  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 09:54
Turkish grammar and vocab is enriched with persian no doubt
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 11:04
Originally posted by Raider

When you said asiatic you do not mean mongoloid, don't you?

Originally posted by arras

Raider >> no :)

Wow, too many negations! So where you use asiatic you could use mongoloid?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Slavs, are also from central asia and don't look particularly mongoloid.

I think that the true answer to the question is that he is niether Asian nor European (he certainly isn't Indian), but a mix as all people are.
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  Quote Lmprs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 11:09
Turkic people were definitely not Indo-European. This is the first time I hear such a claim.

They spoke an Altaic language, the same as we speak today.

Racially, they might be something between Mongoloid and Caucasian. Or simply Turanoid? I am not sure.
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  Quote arras Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 11:41
Omar al Hashim >> I think he ment "mongoloid" in slightly diferent meaning than you.

and as to origin of Slavs opinions differ. There are 2 theories: of migration from teritory near Volga and one of origin in central Europe. There is still Japhetic theory I already mentioned but not all modern historians respect it.

But back to the topic, here are two interesting links you may look at:

http://members.tripod.com/great-bulgaria/Central-Asian-Nomads-Unite/origins.html

http://www.kroraina.com/huns/mh/index.html
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  Quote Kids Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 13:04
"When you said asiatic you do not mean mongoloid, don't you?"
 
Most of academic books I read about Huns relate Huns (especailly the descriptions of Attila from the Greek author) to the modern East Asians and Mongolians.
 
Interestingly, according to ancient Chinese records about Xiongnu, Xiongnu were described as people with blue eyes. So, I guess if Xiongnu, who lived closed to East Asia, had Indo-European appearance, there is no doubt that later Huns (whether they are related to Xiongu or not) must have Mongoloid characters.
 
Afterall, Center Asia has been described by historians as high way to civilizations; different people met and interact.
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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 13:22
Originally posted by Giannis

Scytho-Sarmatian, you can purchase the dvd Attila from here if you want www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00013T79Q.
Ive seen a much newer movie then that "Atilla the Hun" whas the title.


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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 13:27
Originally posted by Kids

"When you said asiatic you do not mean mongoloid, don't you?"
 
Most of academic books I read about Huns relate Huns (especailly the descriptions of Attila from the Greek author) to the modern East Asians and Mongolians.
 
Interestingly, according to ancient Chinese records about Xiongnu, Xiongnu were described as people with blue eyes. So, I guess if Xiongnu, who lived closed to East Asia, had Indo-European appearance, there is no doubt that later Huns (whether they are related to Xiongu or not) must have Mongoloid characters.
 

yea after hearing from Chinese sources i got confused little bit, they also described some Kok-Turuk khans from ashina clan as having blond hairs and blue eyes but that doesnt mean they where IE-people or something similar.

Last days i heard enough crazy theory's about Huns origins, even Koreans claim they where a lost Korean tribe (i swear i read it somewhere) Ouch
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  Quote ijjas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 13:31
Let' s ask a witness.

Priscus at the court of Attila

http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/jod/texts/priscus.html

    

Edited by ijjas - 07-Jul-2006 at 13:53
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  Quote Maziar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 14:45
If Huns were IE so why there were a groupe among them called "white Huns"? I mean there must be a reason to differe the white Huns from another Huns, don't you think?
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 14:55

white huns are Indo-European ?

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  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 15:20
Originally posted by Mortaza

white huns are Indo-European ?

 
some claim that they're persian
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 15:33
Hun comes from the Turkish word 'Kun'. Like most empires of the Steppes, the Huns were a conglomerate of nations. It actually means 'people or nation'.
 
The Ak Kun (White Huns) were also known as the Hepthalites by the Greeks and Ye-Tai by the Chinese. The Chinese recorded that the Ye-Tai may have been part of the YuehiChih from western China (whom were driven out by the Huns proper). After wars with the  Persians and GokTurks the divided White Huns traversed to Europe. Some believe they eventually were the Avars.
 
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  Quote Maziar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 15:44
Originally posted by Mortaza

white huns are Indo-European ?

have i claimed that?
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