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flyingzone
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Topic: Feminism - has it gone too far? Posted: 03-Aug-2006 at 19:09 |
Originally posted by bg_turk
At home it was always my father that cooked and did the cleaning. |
You should be very proud of your father as he is a wonderful role model. His positive influence on you is manifested in your open-minded attitude towards many gender and sex issues that I have noticed.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 03-Aug-2006 at 19:38 |
Originally posted by flyingzone
It is "male-dominated society" that is the problem here, not what women should or should not wear. |
Every society on this planet is currently male-dominated and has always been male-dominated. I'm sorry you can't deal with reality.
Originally posted by flyingzone
F**k patriarchy!!!!! |
Screw feminism. Patriarchal societies are needed so that law and order may be maintained in societies.
Originally posted by flyingzone
And how about men engaging in premarital sexual relations? Is it more permissible than women engaging in premarital sexual relations? |
Men are judged differently. Sorry, but there are different codes of conduct for men and women, for adults and children, for the elderly and the young. Again, I am sorry you cannot deal with reality.
Originally posted by flyingzone
How about MEN working out at the gym religiously. I am pretty sure the majority of the gym rats are men, not women. |
Males who workout at the gym religiously do so for recreational reasons. Women workout in order to appear more attractive and hence, conform to society's expectations. That is reality, I'm sorry you find it hard to deal with it.
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flyingzone
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Posted: 03-Aug-2006 at 19:56 |
You are dead right about yourself. You are a chauvinistic a**hole.
You don't have to feel sorry about me "finding hard to deal with" all that cr*p that you regard as the sacred norms. I live in a forward-looking reality whereas your so-called "reality" is backward and extremely outdated.
You know what I am sorry for? I am sorry for the women who have to live with/around you and have to deal with your attitude.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 03-Aug-2006 at 20:16 |
flyingzone,
I treat my women extremely well. I'm actually a very open-minded person, but I do not let my liberalism interfere with morality. If you feel that it is natural for a young woman to be pressured into sexual relations before she is ready, starve herself to fit the media's image of what beauty constitutes, talk back to her parents and brothers, and dress in an inappropriate manner -then I am glad you find me to be a chauvinist asshole. :)
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annechka
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Posted: 04-Aug-2006 at 17:16 |
Master Blaster I feel you have missed the point on feminism.
Feminism involves thinking, evaluating and making choices. Some wrong or inadequate decisions will be made. BUT and this a big concept, the choice is made by the woman, not by any man for her. If the parenting process has been anyway successful, this woman will have the intellectual , ethical, emotional basis on which to make decisions. But being human, like men are. (at least I hope they are ) women are also fallible and mistakes will happen. Like men they make mistakes, but their own mistakes.
Also feminity/feminism is defined by the woman..
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flyingzone
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Posted: 05-Aug-2006 at 00:52 |
Originally posted by Master_Blaster
flyingzone,
I treat my women extremely well. I'm actually a very open-minded person, but I do not let my liberalism interfere with morality. If you feel that it is natural for a young woman to be pressured into sexual relations before she is ready, starve herself to fit the media's image of what beauty constitutes, talk back to her parents and brothers, and dress in an inappropriate manner -then I am glad you find me to be a chauvinist asshole. :)
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Three times in your previous post you said, "I am sorry you cannot deal with reality".
Do you feel equally sorry for Abraham Lincoln, Martin Luther King, or Nelson Mandela who could not deal with the "reality" of racial injustice? People like you, in a different era, would have been those wanted to enslave other human beings for their own economic benefits, who opposed desegregation or who supported apartheid just because those were the "realities" of their time.
And just listen to yourself, "I treat MY women extremely well." Even if it's just a slip of the tongue, it shows your patronizing attitude towards women. Those are not YOUR women. No woman belongs to you. They belong to themselves.
Edited by flyingzone - 05-Aug-2006 at 11:24
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 14:36 |
By "my women" - I meant the women I am intimately involved with. It wasn't a slip of the tongue. Do you refer to "your girlfriend" as "everyone's girlfriend"?? By stating it as "my women" - I was referring to women I have relationships with. It wasn't meant as a chauvinistic possessive remark - just as I am sure my girlfriend refers to me as "my man" even though I do not belong to her.
I am sorry you are so unfamiliar with English jargon.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 17:56 |
Originally posted by annechka
Master Blaster I feel you have missed the point on feminism.
Feminism involves thinking, evaluating and making choices. Some wrong or inadequate decisions will be made. BUT and this a big concept, the choice is made by the woman, not by any man for her. If the parenting process has been anyway successful, this woman will have the intellectual , ethical, emotional basis on which to make decisions. But being human, like men are. (at least I hope they are ) women are also fallible and mistakes will happen. Like men they make mistakes, but their own mistakes.
Also feminity/feminism is defined by the woman..
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No, I did not misinterpret feminism. You did. The title of the thread is "Feminism - has it gone too far" - and I have responded to that question.
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annechka
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 10:26 |
2 comments...
The question should have defined the poser's definition of feminism. By my definition as stated above feminism has not gone far enough.. Fanaticism inhabits every movement.
"my women" - I meant the women I am intimately involved with
I am familiar with English. My women implies ownership. I treat the women I know implies more respect etc. My has the connotation and denotation of ownership.
Edited by annechka - 07-Aug-2006 at 10:27
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Chilbudios
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 12:11 |
I treat the women I know implies more respect etc. My has the connotation and denotation of ownership. |
You don't think it's about ? Like in "my dear" or "my boy/girlfriend" or "my wife/husband" or "cara mia" or "mon sauvage" ? The woman (man) I know can be an office colleague, a business partener, a high-school friend, an ex-lover, a parent, a relative, etc..
I think this is a manifestation of a radical unconstructive feminism, while Master Blaster, with his chauvinism, sits in the opposite corner.
Like they say, the opposites attract
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morticia
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 15:58 |
Well, Master Blaster has every right to express himself and render his opinion. I admire him for his honesty in conveying his true feelings. I find that many men think like him. It only proves to me that the women's rights movement is far from over. However, I'm hoping that he does not mistake "feminism" with "control". Traditionally, men have always been in control of women and, therefore, it's hard for some men to let go of such control. Some men will never understand the difference, and, even if and when they do, they will never succumb to it as a matter of principles in how they have been raised. That sort of mentality takes decades (if not centuries) to change. As a woman (on behalf of myself and my daughter), all I want are the same rights and choices which men have. Nothing more, nothing less!
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"Morty
Trust in God: She will provide." -- Emmeline Pankhurst
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 19:41 |
annechka jaan
My "familiarize yourself with English jargon" comment was intended for flyingzone - not you. And, you are correct, I could have worded it in a more respectful manner, but I didn't b/c that wouldn't be me - that would be the political correctness forced upon us by the radical feminist left. I did not intend to imply ownership. Chilbudios interpreted it correctly, it was intended as affection.
Edited by Master_Blaster - 07-Aug-2006 at 19:42
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 19:44 |
Originally posted by Chilbudios
I think this is a manifestation of a radical unconstructive feminism, while Master Blaster, with his chauvinism, sits in the opposite corner.
Like they say, the opposites attract |
I am a bit smitten by annechka's intelligence despite her feminist flaws. No doubt she'll try to feminize me and turn me into a soft-hearted metrosexual, but it'll be worth the sacrifice.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 19:51 |
Originally posted by morticia
Well, Master Blaster has every right to express himself and render his opinion. I admire him for his honesty in conveying his true feelings. I find that many men think like him. It only proves to me that the women's rights movement is far from over. However, I'm hoping that he does not mistake "feminism" with "control". Traditionally, men have always been in control of women and, therefore, it's hard for some men to let go of such control. Some men will never understand the difference, and, even if and when they do, they will never succumb to it as a matter of principles in how they have been raised. That sort of mentality takes decades (if not centuries) to change. As a woman (on behalf of myself and my daughter), all I want are the same rights and choices which men have. Nothing more, nothing less!
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I'm not opposed to feminism altogether, I'm just opposed to radical feminism. The other day I saw three women in hard hats standing at a construction site watching the men work. All three of the ladies had on their dirty blue overalls, and came equipped with measuring tape, a hammer, and a toolbox, but none of them were able to perform any of the construction jobs other than holding up a sign which read, "SLOW DOWN - ROAD WORK IN PROGRESS" - I couldn't help but chuckle to myself.
I'm all for equality- but as my example indicates, feminism has gone too far. Instead of hiring capable male employees, the construction company was forced via feminist lobbying to employ three incapable females who due to their physical make up were not able to perform the duty requirements.
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red clay
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 21:52 |
Originally posted by Master_Blaster
Originally posted by morticia
Well, Master Blaster has every right to express himself and render his opinion. I admire him for his honesty in conveying his true feelings. I find that many men think like him. It only proves to me that the women's rights movement is far from over. However, I'm hoping that he does not mistake "feminism" with "control". Traditionally, men have always been in control of women and, therefore, it's hard for some men to let go of such control. Some men will never understand the difference, and, even if and when they do, they will never succumb to it as a matter of principles in how they have been raised. That sort of mentality takes decades (if not centuries) to change. As a woman (on behalf of myself and my daughter), all I want are the same rights and choices which men have. Nothing more, nothing less!
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I'm not opposed to feminism altogether, I'm just opposed to radical feminism. The other day I saw three women in hard hats standing at a construction site watching the men work. All three of the ladies had on their dirty blue overalls, and came equipped with measuring tape, a hammer, and a toolbox, but none of them were able to perform any of the construction jobs other than holding up a sign which read, "SLOW DOWN - ROAD WORK IN PROGRESS" - I couldn't help but chuckle to myself.
I'm all for equality- but as my example indicates, feminism has gone too far. Instead of hiring capable male employees, the construction company was forced via feminist lobbying to employ three incapable females who due to their physical make up were not able to perform the duty requirements. |
That occurs much more frequently with men than it does women, men who are hired simply because they are men, the fact they aren't worth their weight in warm spit is tolerated. I know 30 women I would hire in a heartbeat over a man. All of them could work most men into the ground and know how to do a job once, not until they get it right, right the first time. Fact- Women have 60% less absentee problems, fewer problems with alcohol and train much faster.
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"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
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annechka
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 22:15 |
I am a bit smitten by annechka's intelligence despite her feminist flaws. No doubt she'll try to feminize me and turn me into a soft-hearted metrosexual, but it'll be worth the sacrifice.
and this is supposed to impress me?
human beings are really quite nice
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 22:58 |
No, it wasn't supposed to impress you. This is another one of your feminist short comings - you think every man that compliments you wants sex.
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Aelfgifu
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 05:40 |
Originally posted by red clay
That occurs much more frequently with men than it does women, men who are hired simply because they are men, the fact they aren't worth their weight in warm spit is tolerated. I know 30 women I would hire in a heartbeat over a man. All of them could work most men into the ground and know how to do a job once, not until they get it right, right the first time. Fact- Women have 60% less absentee problems, fewer problems with alcohol and train much faster. |
You are quite right red clay. In societies where females are treated as equal, far more girls attend university than men. Not because they are smarter, but simply because they are more devoted, more interested and just work harder. This is even visible in my family: me and my sister both attend(ed) university, while our brother, who is just as smart, settled for a lower level, simply because he does not have the drive to do the uni.
At this rate, it will not be long before the male-focused top levels will have to be replaced by equally capable woman, without any interference from government. (which is not very large anyway over here. Woman are quite capable of getting jobs on their own.)
I am surprised in your devotion here, it is clear that Master Bullsh*t here is quite beyond help. All that remains is to wish lots of good luck to 'his' women, they are going to need it.
Edited by Aelfgifu - 08-Aug-2006 at 05:41
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Women hold their councils of war in kitchens: the knives are there, and the cups of coffee, and the towels to dry the tears.
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annechka
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 10:19 |
you think every man that compliments you wants sex.
No. but it is interesting that that is your interpretation of my comment.
I appreciate sincere compliments.
Aelfgifu I quite agree with you about education. I have found encouragement makes a difference on whether men or women go to university..
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morticia
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 14:51 |
Originally posted by Master_Blaster
I'm not opposed to feminism altogether, I'm just opposed to radical feminism. The other day I saw three women in hard hats standing at a construction site watching the men work. All three of the ladies had on their dirty blue overalls, and came equipped with measuring tape,a hammer, and a toolbox, but none of them were able to perform any of the constructionjobs other than holding up a sign which read, "SLOW DOWN - ROAD WORK IN PROGRESS" - I couldn'thelp but chuckle to myself |
Well, I look at it as a position that women can assist in. Instead of using an able-bodied STRONG man to hold up the signs, I see nothing wrong with using women in that capacity? The point is that women are good employees, they are hard workers if given the chance, and, although some are lacking in physical strength, they can offer assistance in one way or another in just about any field in the workforce. I am sure that salary commensurates with experience.
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"Morty
Trust in God: She will provide." -- Emmeline Pankhurst
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