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Best Special Forces of Modern Armies

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  Quote raygun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Best Special Forces of Modern Armies
    Posted: 10-May-2006 at 21:29

Which special forces is the best in terms of toughness, training and equipment of the modern armies? The Green Berets? The SAS? The Spetnaz? The Israeli Golanis???

 

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  Quote Russian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-May-2006 at 16:42
Originally posted by raygun

Which special forces is the best in terms of toughness, training and equipment of the modern armies? The Green Berets? The SAS? The Spetnaz? The Israeli Golanis???




the toughest and most ruthless are most likely Spetsnaz, they are also the best trained in hand-to-hand combat and knife throwing don't believe me, look up "Systema"

Spetsnaz are known for having the toughest training. Even British admit that Spetsnaz soldiers are some of the toughest and most ruthless soldiers on battlefield. Also, I heard one Spetsnaz instructor saying how they were training soldiers: first an instroctor twists your arm so that you scream, then another guy comes and starts to hit you with a knife handle, then you have to chose between being stabbed with a knife or have your arm broken. Practicing this in the west simply will not be allowed.

Have you guys heard of one of spetsnaz assignments:

In 1985, when terrorists took over the Soviet embassy in Beirut, a Spetsnaz strike team infiltrated the embassy, abducted four of the terrorists and sent one of their decapitated heads in a bag to the terrorists' leader. The following day all the hostages were released.

link: http://www.spetsnaztraining.com/view/spetsnaz

SAS are VERY good too, I saw a video about them, it is one awesome special ops, they have some of the best equipment. British in general take all secret and elite stuf super seriously, their intellenence was one of the most secret in the world.

Edited by Russian
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  Quote Dampier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-May-2006 at 16:48
'Tis true..Spetnatz lack loads of equipment but they are very experienced and thier training program is ridiculous to say the least...
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  Quote Illuminati Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2006 at 23:55
the secrecy and covert nature of these units makes it almost impossible to judge who is the best. All are extremely well outfitted and all have premiere training. most of thier missions go unreported.

At most, we could dig up a few known missions. But taht isn't enough to adequately judge who is teh best. More importantly, training doesn't determine whose best. Combat experience can make a soldier with less training far better than an unexperienced soldier with no combat experience.

Spetsnaz are known for having the toughest training. Even British admit that Spetsnaz soldiers are some of the toughest and most ruthless soldiers on battlefield. Also, I heard one Spetsnaz instructor saying how they were training soldiers: first an instroctor twists your arm so that you scream, then another guy comes and starts to hit you with a knife handle, then you have to chose between being stabbed with a knife or have your arm broken. Practicing this in the west simply will not be allowed.


Russia doesn't have a monoploy on intense training. Don't think for a second that the West doesn't train their soldiers in many of the same ways.

THe US for example has program (I forget the name) that simulates how a soldier will be treated if captured. It's just as rough as breaking a bone, which by the way is BS. The Spetnatz don't break the arms or stab every recruit. they may be intense, but they can't do that to every recruit because those kinds of actions can injure a recruit permanently making him unable to be a SF soldier

Plus, we'd be foolish to assume that Spetsnaz, Delta, SAS, etc...are the most elite units our countries have. There are reports that the US has some units that aren't known about. I'd assume that the UK and Russia has similiar units. but I guess we can only really debate about the units we know exist



Edited by Illuminati - 19-May-2006 at 00:12
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  Quote Russian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2006 at 00:44

Originally posted by Illuminati



the secrecy and covert nature of these units makes it almost impossible
to judge who is the best. All are extremely well outfitted and all have
premiere training. most of thier missions go unreported.

At most, we could dig up a few known missions. But taht isn't enough to
adequately judge who is teh best. More importantly, training doesn't
determine whose best. Combat experience can make a soldier with less
training far better than an unexperienced soldier with no combat
experience.

Spetsnaz are known for having the toughest training. Even British admit
that Spetsnaz soldiers are some of the toughest and most ruthless
soldiers on battlefield. Also, I heard one Spetsnaz instructor saying
how they were training soldiers: first an instroctor twists your arm so
that you scream, then another guy comes and starts to hit you with a
knife handle, then you have to chose between being stabbed with a knife
or have your arm broken. Practicing this in the west simply will not be
allowed.


Russia doesn't have a monoploy on intense training. Don't think for a
second that the West doesn't train their soldiers in many of the same
ways.

THe US for example has program (I forget the name) that simulates how a
soldier will be treated if captured. It's just as rough as breaking a
bone, which by the way is BS. The Spetnatz don't break the arms or stab
every recruit. they may be intense, but they can't do that to every
recruit because those kinds of actions can injure a recruit permanently
making him unable to be a SF soldier
Plus, we'd be foolish to assume that Spetsnaz, Delta, SAS, etc...are the most elite units our countries have. There are reports that the US has some units that aren't known about. I'd assume that the UK and Russia has similiar units. but I guess we can only really debate about the units we know exist





Well, if he is injured and can not serve anymore, he is not tough enough, no, that's just joke.

Spetdnaz, trust me, is trained in much more brutal way, especially in hand-to-hand combat.
    
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  Quote DukeC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2006 at 15:38

I like the British SBS. They don't have the high profile of some other special forces but they are some of the most professional soldiers in existance. Like the SEALs not only do they have to master combat on the ground they have to deal with the challenging marine environment.

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  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2006 at 17:28
What about red berets?I heard they are more specialised and better than the green berets.
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  Quote Roadkill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2006 at 08:41
 -I'd say SAS on top followed by FSK, then Spetsnaz. FSK is Norway's Special Forces and are top class, but they lack the experience that SAS has. Spetsnaz are crazy people, yes, but that doesn't mean that they are the best. They are reckless and foolhardy. But hey, that's Russia for you.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
-- Albert Einstein (1879-1955)
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  Quote Dampier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2006 at 18:02
Red berets? If you are talking about the British Paratroops (who started the whole red beret thing and are also known as the Red Devils) then  probably not but it isnt for lack of trying, they are tough, tough men.
 
 
SBS isnt as good as SAS but they are still quite excellent. Royal Marine Commandos, while not quite a Special forces unit are similarly excellent.
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  Quote Russian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2006 at 21:28

Originally posted by Dampier

Red berets? If you are talking about the British Paratroops (who started the whole red beret thing and are also known as the Red Devils) then probably not but it isnt for lack of trying, they are tough, tough men.


SBS isnt as good as SAS but they are still quite excellent. Royal Marine Commandos, while not quite a Special forces unit are similarly excellent.

    

I am thinking here, we are arguying about best special forces, and what are the criterions, according to which we are judging?
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  Quote Dampier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-May-2006 at 13:25
The Red Berets arent special forces (quite).
Criterions would be stuff like; training, equipment, experience, special skills/abilities
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2006 at 19:55
Originally posted by Dampier

The Red Berets arent special forces (quite).
Criterions would be stuff like; training, equipment, experience, special skills/abilities
 
apt enough hence......RANGERS lead the way..but any of those nominated and discussed can equaly claim so........lets talke mountaineering for example in a tactical situation....what say you now........?


Edited by Wulfher ap Clun - 10-Jun-2006 at 11:04
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  Quote Dampier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2006 at 18:22
Umm...all SF units do mountain training...obviously certain units would be better than others (Alpini) but thats the same as comparing the SBS and Delta Force- SBS are maritime specialists, that why you need generic criteria.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jun-2006 at 14:11
I see your point clearly and perhaps i stated mine poorly...RANGERS for example also recieve maritime type insertion training but not to the degree that an SBS person  or SEAL might....but in general their fields of expertise were and remain.
 
1. Mountains.
2. Jungles.
3. desert.
4. anti-insurregency ops.
5. long range reconn.
6. combat raids/ambushes.
7. military advisors for friendly spec/ops forces in transistion or formation.
 
all obviously from the strategic mission/ops perspective....thanks for your replyLOL
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  Quote raygun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jun-2006 at 13:08

Thks for all replies guys. My personal choice wld be the Spetnaz.

I've read Victor Suronov(sp?) book on Soviet's special forces and it seems that the Spetnaz were REALLY tough. They had to do a 40km marathon non-stop wif gas mask on cross-country. Talk about gasping for air!
 
 
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  Quote Laelius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jun-2006 at 17:09
I'd go with units like the 22snd SAS, Delta Force, and Seal Team 6.  These units are the cream of the crop, according to the founder of Delta they would take 60 men from Army Special Forces, Rangers, Airborne each of which was already a crack soldier in his own right and then pick maybe 2 or 3.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2006 at 22:23
The overuse of hand to hand combat can be quite dangerous.  Hand to hand combat is usually used as a last resort once you have ran out of ammo and can't get back up.  And for the best special forces.........the one we don't know of.  Delta, SEALs, and Force Recon are quite good though.

Edited by jetsetter - 14-Jun-2006 at 22:25
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  Quote Gargoyle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Jun-2006 at 08:43
    
Best Special Forces of Modern Armies?????

This Question is impossible to answer, unless every Special Forces from every Army in the World competes against each other in some kind of a "World Cup" (shall we say) of Special Forces. Some of the competitions could include: Fitness, Marksmanship, Rapid Incident Response,Recconnaisance...etc... only then can we know who is the best.

My money is on the Australian Special Air Service Regiment, and the 2nd French Foreign Legion Parachute Regiment (2eme REP)






    

Edited by Gargoyle - 17-Jun-2006 at 08:59
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jun-2006 at 06:27
ssh gargoyle its better noone knowsEvil Smile
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  Quote Dampier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jun-2006 at 08:19
Originally posted by Gargoyle

    
Best Special Forces of Modern Armies?????

This Question is impossible to answer, unless every Special Forces from every Army in the World competes against each other in some kind of a "World Cup" (shall we say) of Special Forces. Some of the competitions could include: Fitness, Marksmanship, Rapid Incident Response,Recconnaisance...etc... only then can we know who is the best.

My money is on the Australian Special Air Service Regiment, and the 2nd French Foreign Legion Parachute Regiment (2eme REP)






    
 
You Aussie copy cats, just because you want something as good as the British SAS!WinkWink
 
(I jest, there were after all many Aussies in the original WW2 SAS regiments).
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