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The most important people in your country’s history
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Emperor Barbarossa View Drop Down
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The most important people in your country’s history
    Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 09:15
Originally posted by Ponce de Leon

The declaration of Independence has the word "Our Creator" and I interpret that as Jesus.

Allejuhah! Or whatever it is spelled
    

So what, the Declaration of Independence was not written by Jesus(and neither was the Bible). Jesus has no important part in our country's history, I doubt the man even knew that there was an American continent.

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Posts: 2967 		  Quote Ponce de Leon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 22:51
I said that "I" meaning just me, interpret the declaration as including Jesus. I am not saying it is fact.

Just saying that it is true!
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 22:56
Lonce de Peon, would you stop distorting facts? It is not humorous.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Aug-2006 at 23:38
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

Lonce de Peon, would you stop distorting facts? It is not humorous.
 
Lighten up, this forum does not need either Christian or Atheist Fundamentalism, both are just as bad as each other.
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 09:11
First, I'm an agnostic, not an athiest. Second of all, athiest fundamentalism is a heck of a lot better than Christian fundamentalism. I doubt you know what true Christian fundamentalism is. Third of all, Jesus has no real part in my country's history, and to say so shows Christian bias.

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Posts: 3387 		  Quote Aelfgifu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 09:45
Originally posted by Earl Aster

Kommenois, I would definatly dispute JRR Tolkien as a British major historical figure. Although his books have become childrens classics, and they do have pieces of Anglo-Saxon myth behind them, he is not that huge a figure. I think its' because of this film that most people seem to have this misconception.
 
Although I do agree that he was not a major figure in the shaping of England, I think you underestimate his work. There are not simply pieces of myth behind them. The more I learn about Anglo-Saxon and Scandinavian early medieval culture, the more I realise the genius behind the books, not just the LOTR, but also very much the Silmarilion. Nothing in his books is accidental or simply made up for the heck of it. Everything has its roots in real literature and culture. It is amazing...
 
Sorry for the off-topic post.
 
on topic: For the Netherlands the most important figures must be William of Orange-Nassau and his sons Maurits and Frederik-Hendrik.
 

Women hold their councils of war in kitchens: the knives are there, and the cups of coffee, and the towels to dry the tears.
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Posts: 2967 		  Quote Ponce de Leon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 15:09
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

First, I'm an agnostic, not an athiest. Second of all, athiest fundamentalism is a heck of a lot better than Christian fundamentalism. I doubt you know what true Christian fundamentalism is. Third of all, Jesus has no real part in my country's history, and to say so shows Christian bias.


Hey! Just remember what our pal Stephen Colbert says!

"Isisnt the term agnostic really an atheisit without balls?"

     
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 16:07
Nice joke, Ponce.

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Posts: 4262 		  Quote Northman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 16:42
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

Originally posted by Ponce de Leon

The declaration of Independence has the word "Our Creator" and I interpret that as Jesus.

Allejuhah! Or whatever it is spelled
    

So what, the Declaration of Independence was not written by Jesus(and neither was the Bible). Jesus has no important part in our country's history, I doubt the man even knew that there was an American continent.
 
 
Probably not Barbarossa, but His followers, Christians, has been THE most influental and powerful part in the US history ever since the Declaration of Independence - and they still are.
 
 
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 19:05
I never said that was not true. But Ponce is acting like the founding fathers were such good Christians even though two of the founding fathers, Jefferson and Washington, were non-Christian deists.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 20:59
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I never said that was not true. But Ponce is acting like the founding fathers were such good Christians even though two of the founding fathers, Jefferson and Washington, were non-Christian deists.
 
And?....
 
I've heard Fundamentalist Atheists rant and rave about prominent scientists and others (I can't remember the name of the most recent one), who have 'converted' from Atheism to Deism calling them 'cowards' among other things.
 
Atheist dogmatism is just as bad as Christian dogmatism, both lead inexorably to either theocracy or state atheism.
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Posts: 5697 		  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 21:44
athiest fundamentalism is a heck of a lot better than Christian fundamentalism
Only just.
The two are very similar, I've never heard of an militant atheist yet. Which is why you get a 'just'
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Posts: 2967 		  Quote Ponce de Leon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 22:01
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I never said that was not true. But Ponce is acting like the founding fathers were such good Christians even though two of the founding fathers, Jefferson and Washington, were non-Christian deists.

Two of them may not have been. But the other ones were!\


God Bless the USA!!!!
    
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Emperor Barbarossa View Drop Down
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Posts: 2888 		  Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Aug-2006 at 22:08
Originally posted by Digenis Acritas

Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I never said that was not true. But Ponce is acting like the founding fathers were such good Christians even though two of the founding fathers, Jefferson and Washington, were non-Christian deists.
 
And?....
 
I've heard Fundamentalist Atheists rant and rave about prominent scientists and others (I can't remember the name of the most recent one), who have 'converted' from Atheism to Deism calling them 'cowards' among other things.
 
Atheist dogmatism is just as bad as Christian dogmatism, both lead inexorably to either theocracy or state atheism.

And who has the most power, athiest fundamentalists or Christian ones? And the very fact that there is a disproportianate number of Christian fundamentalists compared to athiest ones. This forum is full of athiests, yet there is not one athiest fundamentalist. Yet I have seen many Christian fundamentalists(doesn't necessarily mean evangelicals). Also, the athiest fundamentalists do not have programs on television designed to steal money from people.


Edited by Emperor Barbarossa - 07-Aug-2006 at 22:12

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Aug-2006 at 06:37
Doing a top 10 most important portruguese personalitys is hard
1- Afonso Henriques ( 1st king, defeated the armies of islam )
2- Luis Vaz de Cames ( greatest literary figure )
3- Infante Don Henrique ( the man behind the portuguese discovery saga )
4- Vasco Da Gama ( the man that discovered the path to India by sea )
5- Nuno Alvares Pereira ( the hero against the spanish invasions )
6- Viriato ( the hero against the roman legions )
7- Fernando Pessoa ( biggest poet )
8- Pedro Alvares Cabral ( The man that discovered Brazil )
9- Bartolomeu Dias ( the first man to cross the Cape of Good Hope )
10- Pedro 1 ( great king, inspiration for Shakespeares Romeu and Juliet )
and i could continue ...
 
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Posts: 0 		  Quote Great Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2006 at 13:06

if there is a God i hope he will forgive you the words ''USA center of civilization''What did USA made a? Every scientist is from Europe or Asia. And USA is a country not CIVILISATION. IM sorry to say it (nothing against usa realy) but USA is a country like many others that my country has seen for 1400 years  and probably it will dissapear like these other countries.Civilization is in Europe and Asia. 



Edited by Great Khan - 06-Sep-2006 at 13:07
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Jeru View Drop Down
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Posts: 57 		  Quote Jeru Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2006 at 14:20
Originally posted by Great Khan

if there is a God i hope he will forgive you the words ''USA center of civilization''What did USA made a? Every scientist is from Europe or Asia. And USA is a country not CIVILISATION. IM sorry to say it (nothing against usa realy) but USA is a country like many others that my country has seen for 1400 years  and probably it will dissapear like these other countries.Civilization is in Europe and Asia. 

 
Not true!There were many great civilizations in America(including USA) but European colonists extinguished them.Dead
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Posts: 1929 		  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2006 at 14:26
Not true!There were many great civilizations in America(including USA) but European colonists extinguished them.Dead
 
Yes, but those "Civilizations" do not reflect at all historically on the modern American people. The modern American people (USA) are a melting pot of cultures and peoples. Great Khan is just pointing out (and quite rightly too) that the modern USA is not a civilization but just a nation. No offense, but this is true.
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Posts: 57 		  Quote Jeru Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2006 at 14:48
Originally posted by Earl Aster

Yes, but those "Civilizations" do not reflect at all historically on the modern American people. The modern American people (USA) are a melting pot of cultures and peoples. Great Khan is just pointing out (and quite rightly too) that the modern USA is not a civilization but just a nation. No offense, but this is true.
 I was mostly reffering on "Civilization is in Europe and Asia".
Never said that modern USA is a civilization,it's more of a mutliculture nation.No offence takenSmile


Edited by Jeru - 06-Sep-2006 at 14:49
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Posts: 1929 		  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2006 at 05:35
Lets try:
1) Bradman (for having at batting avg of 99.96)
2) Captain Cook (for opening up British colonialism)
3) Whitlam (for giving a hard kick when it was needed)
4) Bradman (for having at batting avg of 99.96)
5) the man who named Lake Disappointment
 
I'm sorry, but i don't think that sportsmen can be counted as very important figures
 
Originally posted by Earl Aster

Kommenois, I would definatly dispute JRR Tolkien as a British major historical figure. Although his books have become childrens classics, and they do have pieces of Anglo-Saxon myth behind them, he is not that huge a figure. I think its' because of this film that most people seem to have this misconception.
 
Although I do agree that he was not a major figure in the shaping of England, I think you underestimate his work. There are not simply pieces of myth behind them. The more I learn about Anglo-Saxon and Scandinavian early medieval culture, the more I realise the genius behind the books, not just the LOTR, but also very much the Silmarilion. Nothing in his books is accidental or simply made up for the heck of it. Everything has its roots in real literature and culture. It is amazing...
 
Yes, i can appreciate that Tolkien did produce an interesting and evokative work, but people treat it (only after the film) as on a par with books like "Crime and Punishment". And even if he was a great writer, he cannot be considered a very large figure in the sum of british personallities. If you want to have your opinion about him, thats' fine for you, but i don't think that you can place him in a list of leading Britions
 
 
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