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armenica
Knight
Joined: 06-Sep-2005
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Topic: Karabakh Posted: 20-Feb-2006 at 07:32 |
"Azerbaijan" did not exist before 1920. The majority of the people in
the Caspian Peninsula were Tatars (or Tartars). The Albanians (or as
Armenians called them, the "Aghvan") were assimilated by the Turkic
people were these tribes started to move into the Armenian highland.
The Muslim leaders of Transcaucasia chose the name "Azerbaijan" in the
hope that they could some day also make claims to the actual
"Azerbaijan" which had always been a integral part of the Persian
domain (present east and west Azerbaijani provinces in Iran).
Karabakh (or "Artsakh" as Armenians call it) was actually the last
semi-independent area with Armenian rule (within the Persian kingdom):
"These five principalities in Karabakh were ruled by Armenian families who had received the title Melik
(prince) and were the following: the principality of Gulistan, under
the leadership of the Melik Biglarian family, the principality of
Djrabert under the leadership of the Melik Israelian family, the
principality of Khatchen, under the leadership of the Hassan Djalalian
family, the principality of Varanda, under the leadership of the Melik
Shahnazarian and finally, the principality of Tizk, under the
leadership of the Melik Avanian family. /37/
37) Raffi, The History of Karabagh's Meliks, Vienna, 1906, in Armenian
http://www.armenica.org/cgi-bin/history/en/getHistory.cgi? 7=1=180=999=biglari=9=3=A
Edited by armenica
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Posted: 01-Mar-2006 at 23:27 |
That is what u were told in Armenian high schools
Do u wanna me post Khojali-then u will shame to say a word about armenian 1915 massacre buddy
Karabakh was always belonged Turks, after Shirvanshahlar and Karakoyunlu states, Armenia was nothing during that times, it's great times was behind my friend, open your eyes, then came akkoyunlu, then timuri, then safavid, then russians
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ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
Joined: 11-Aug-2004
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Posted: 01-Mar-2006 at 23:49 |
Originally posted by Taleyran01
Karabakh was always belonged Turks |
At the peak of Azeri population in Karabagh,
they still only constituted 23% of the population of the province
(1988).
Originally posted by Taleyran01
then timuri, then safavid, then russians |
Timur wasn't an Azeri, and the Safavids were
an Iranian Empire. What do Russians have to do with Turks/Azeris?
Originally posted by Taleyran01
Do u wanna me post Khojali-then u will shame to say a word about armenian 1915 massacre buddy |
If you want to discuss Khojali, theres already
a thread for it. I fail to see what that has to do with Azeris having a
claim to Karabagh, though.
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Artaxiad
Baron
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Posted: 01-Mar-2006 at 23:57 |
Do u wanna me post Khojali-then u will shame to say a word about armenian 1915 massacre buddy |
There are other threads about Khojali. Search is your best friend!
Karabakh was always belonged Turks, after Shirvanshahlar and Karakoyunlu states, Armenia
was nothing during that times, it's great times was behind my friend,
open your eyes, then came akkoyunlu, then timuri, then safavid, then
russians |
In my books, history doesn't start in the 1300s.
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mamikon
Sultan
Joined: 16-Jan-2006
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:13 |
welcome to AE Taleyran01
besides that, I dont think any of the Armenians here went to an Armenian high school
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:14 |
From beginning 11th century there was not a single Armenian government were built in Karabakh, unless, those 23 % (in your sources) Turks (but not Azeris) and Armenians living there were under the rule of Turkish states +Timurid, which was a turk himself-I don not even wanna him to be Azeri, He is already Turk
Show me Other threds, give me link that, we massacred u in Khojaly-
U're right, but we came to Azerbaijan in late 6-7th, and then rose there after 11th
I guess u know that, I dont care if u do accept or not
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:14 |
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mamikon
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:18 |
Originally posted by Taleyran01
any school in there
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huh?
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:20 |
any school that u guys go there in the place of High School
Or maybe u dont go to school at all
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mamikon
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:23 |
I go to an American school
and do you mean to tell me there was a country called Azerbaijan before 1900s?
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:25 |
no, there was not any country before 1900 that was called Azerbaijan
It is not the name of the nation, u know probably, it is the name of place, which, some scientists say, comes from Atropatena-Which was not a turkish
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ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:35 |
Originally posted by Taleyran01
From beginning 11th century there was not a single Armenian government
were built in Karabakh, unless, those 23 % (in your sources) Turks (but
not Azeris) and Armenians living there were under the rule of Turkish
states +Timurid, which was a turk himself-I don not even wanna him to
be Azeri, He is already Turk |
If we use your logic, the Byzantine Empire was
an Armenian Empire (many Byzantine emperors were Armenian), and
therefore Greece and Turkey should belong to Armenia. Obviously this
method of thinking about things is not correct.
Originally posted by Taleyran01
U're right, but we came to Azerbaijan in late 6-7th, and then rose there after 11th |
That was in northern Iran, not Caucasia or Karabagh.
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:37 |
That was in Caucasia
Byzantine empires were armenian-
Is it a new "knock-knock" joke
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mamikon
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:43 |
Taleyran01
whats your argument here? what is it you are trying to argue?
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ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:44 |
Originally posted by Taleyran01
Byzantine empires were armenian-
Is it a new "knock-knock" joke |
Nope, its a historical fact.
Basil I becomes the Byzantine emperor and establishes the Macedonian
dynasty; until 1025, Byzantine emperors are at least part Armenian. |
http://www.metmuseum.org/explore/Byzantium/time.html
Anyways, that has nothing to do with
anything. I was just trying to show that you can't claim land just
because some emperor of a foreign empire happens to be part of your
ethnicity.
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Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Resistance
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 00:55 |
If we ruled a land more than 800 years, then today u have not a right to take it from us, especially, when there is not any opposite military back fight
Try it today buddy, u won't be able to cross the border
There will be 2nd Gumru
Give me the names of those empererors that partly are Armenian, I'll search
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mamikon
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 01:23 |
take what Karabakh? its already taken...
u didnt rule the land for 800 years because Azerbaijan did not exist
for 800 years. That land switched from Armenia to Ottoman Empire to
Persian Empire to Russian Empire, it was never part of Azerbaijan.
I am assuming you think Naxichevan was also yours? (well now it is )
The Heraclian Dynasty (575-705) was an Armenian dynasty, Philippicus
Bardanes was Armenian (ruled for only 2 years though), Leo V was
Armenian, this is by year 850, I will stop here since its 2 AM
here and I still got HW to do...look up the other years if you would
like...
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ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 01:27 |
Originally posted by Taleyran01
Give me the names of those empererors that partly are Armenian, I'll search |
Heraclius, Basil II, Leo V, Nikephorus Phokas,
John Tzimiskes, etc. This doesn't mean anything though. My whole point
is that regardless of their ethnic background, those emperors served
Byzantium. Same thing with Safavids; they served Iran, not Azerbaijan.
Timur served himself, not Azerbaijan.
Its like saying America still belongs to England. It doesn't work like that.
Originally posted by Taleyran01
If we ruled a land more than 800 years, then today u have not a right
to take it from us, especially, when there is not any opposite military
back fight |
Even if Turks ruled it for 800 years,
Armenians were still a majority in those provinces. Armenians were
living in Karabagh long before Christ was born while Turks showed up
centuries later.
Originally posted by Taleyran01
Try it today buddy, u won't be able to cross the border
There will be 2nd Gumru |
They wouldn't try to cross the border
because the whole point of the uprising was to end the Azeri military
occupation of Karabagh, and they succeeded. Its Azerbaijan that must
make the next move.
Anyways, are you going to discuss
something...I still don't know what you're trying to argue on this
thread.
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Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Resistance
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 01:54 |
1)That is why Armenian pop. today is not more than 2 million
2)There is not any AZERBAIJANIAN NATION, there is Turkish
3)That is why there is today 8 million Turks living in Azerb.
4)I'll search the biography of your pointless emperors
5)Karabakh is not taken buddy-Go see world map-any except "Made in Armenia" ones
6)Atabeyler, Seljuklar, Karakoyunlu, Akkoyunlu, Safavid, Russian empire, ADR, Soviets-That is how we ruled over 800 years u
7)U wanna take Nakhichevan tooo, hmmm, I guess, U guys dont think about another war that will end with unconditional surrender treaty in Irevan
8)Azerbaijan will make next move, and u will be able to see that move
9)I am trying to argue in this topic that, u took over the land, with the help of russian guys, which it belongd to the nation which name is turkes and to the republic which name is Azerbaijan, And do not make me to bring the staff that u did with the people there
8)
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mamikon
Sultan
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Posted: 02-Mar-2006 at 02:08 |
1)That is why Armenian pop. today is not more than 2 million
Actually Armenian population is 8 million worldwide now. Would have been more if it werent for you genocidal cousins...
2)There is not any AZERBAIJANIAN NATION, there is Turkish
finally, someone came out and said it...
3)That is why there is today 8 million Turks living in Azerb.
what is why?
4)I'll search the biography of your pointless emperors
mmm? at least our Emperors are in international hostorical textbooks, not Azeri children fiction stories
5)Karabakh is not taken buddy-Go see world map-any except "Made in Armenia" ones
De facto it is
6)Atabeyler, Seljuklar, Karakoyunlu, Akkoyunlu, Safavid, Russian empire, ADR, Soviets-That is how we ruled over 800 years u
Azeri children fiction stories
7)U wanna take Nakhichevan tooo, hmmm, I guess, U guys dont think about
another war that will end with unconditional surrender treaty in
Irevan
no, not really...unlike in Karabakh population there is majority Azeri,
no point in taking it. Armenians were driven out a while ago...
8)Azerbaijan will make next move, and u will be able to see that move
sad, you advocate war, that will not change anything
9)I am trying to argue in this topic that, u took over the land, with
the help of russian guys, which it belongd to the nation which name is
turkes and to the republic which name is Azerbaijan, And do not make me
to bring the staff that u did with the people there
that land was always ours...
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