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Kerimoglu
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Topic: Azerbaijan Turk in Russian army in anatolia Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 14:45 |
Mamikon, I congrotulate u and your Armenian middle school education, u know it somehow matches ours, like Noah was turk u know, hmm....
Zagros, there were significant number of originally Azerbaijani officers in Russian army in WWI but we never were enemies with Ottomans, man, only Saffavids, when they became Persian after Shah Abbas, they began fighting Ottomans, also, if 2 turks are fighting, that doesn not mean that one of them is Iranian or Armenian - A BIG LOL
Mamikon, what the hell are u talkin about? Nuri Pasha came and mashed Armenian bolshevik party and English Centro Caspian Dictatorship and Lenins help forces like a mushroom man. IN the biggest hill in BAku there are laying over 200 SHAHIDS of Ottoman army that fought and died for our independence and after that, in Democratic Republic, we had Musavat party mainly, and actually, not a single Armenian in the Parilament, remember March 31.
Before posting anything here, think that Armenian Lobby and its members will not do a cr.p here with their 45 000 year old language, becouse at least it is a liberal forum, dear friend!
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History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow!
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mamikon
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Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 16:29 |
and your source is?
ps: I did not attend middle school in Armenia
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Kapikulu
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Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 16:41 |
Originally posted by Zagros
Azaris were historical enemies of Osmanli, Osmanli invaded Iranian Azarbaijan in WW1 and commited much atrocity - so maybe they wanted revenge. |
It is true that there had been frictions between Azeris and Ottoman Empire in the past..That doesn't put them into a classification of "historical enemy" as well...Safavids/Qajars have been historical enemies of Ottomans, not the Azeris as a whole.It is also untrue that they committed "much" atrocity. Persia was already a playground of Russians and British anyway. And Ottoman movement was not something full-scale, was only an intervention to counter the Allied forces.
It was actually General Baratov of Russia who first was in Persia with his division.
Edited by Kapikulu - 12-Mar-2007 at 16:56
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We gave up your happiness
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we couldn't find neither;
we made up sorrows for ourselves;
we couldn't be consoled;
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kotumeyil
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Posted: 13-Mar-2007 at 08:36 |
In his book "Travel to Erzurum", which passes in 1829 Russian-Ottoman War, Puskin tells that Russian Army included Turkic people, especially Tatars. However I just took a short look into the book. I didn't completely read it. Maybe it includes more details about their behaviour towards Turks.
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[IMG]http://www.maksimum.com/yemeicme/images/haber/raki.jpg">
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 09:29 |
Carter Vaughn Findler - Oxfor University Press - Dear Mamikon.
P.S. Your source is sure from Armenian mid. schools, nowhere else u could find such cr.p
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mamikon
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 09:50 |
You have provided an author, a publisher - whats the Title of the book.
P.S. Since when does wikipedia count as an Armenian mid. school
crap..if you had bothered to look at page 1 of this thread, you would see that I
sourced wikipedia.
Edited by mamikon - 16-Mar-2007 at 09:51
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 09:57 |
The Turks in World History
Wikipedia is crap anyways. So if there is an Azeri or Armenian articles - they're both crap too, just like mid schools in Armenia
Edited by Kerimoglu - 16-Mar-2007 at 09:59
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Mortazaa
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 10:19 |
I dont know why russian army treated so harsh at eastern anatolia. I am from trabzon, and I heard from my elders, Russians did not treat bad to turks.
There were muslim soldiers(or turkic) at russian army too. My grand mother said, she remember that these soldiers gave her candies, and they are sad(Infact she said, some of them cried) for ottomans situation.
At erzurum and eastern anatolia, they treated totally different.
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 12:54 |
sure. There were lots of tatars.
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mamikon
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Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 23:12 |
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
The Turks in World History
Wikipedia
is crap anyways. So if there is an Azeri or Armenian articles - they're
both crap too, just like mid schools in Armenia |
Dont you think "Turks in World History" is a little broad to describe the specifc events in Baku in 1918?
Does it specifically say that the first Azeri government in 1918 was
not dominated by Bolsheviks, but by Musavatists? Can you point
me to the page where you read that? Because it will take only 15 min.
for me to go get it and verify what you are saying, I hope you dont
lie.
PS: What are you so obsessed with Armenian middle schools? As I have said I did not attend an Armenian middle school.
And yes, today they are bad, compared to those 30 years ago. However
this is the case with all school in all post-Soviet countries, not just
Armenia.
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DayI
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Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 07:58 |
Mamikon you seem allways to question sources of Turkish side, show us your sources then?
Im interested what are your sources?
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Kapikulu
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Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 12:46 |
Please calm down the tone of discussion.
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We gave up your happiness
Your hope would be enough;
we couldn't find neither;
we made up sorrows for ourselves;
we couldn't be consoled;
A Strange Orhan Veli
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mamikon
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Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 14:42 |
Baku Commune 1917-1918; class and nationality in the Russian Revolution
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mamikon
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Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 15:45 |
Originally posted by Mortazaa
I dont know why russian army treated so harsh at eastern anatolia. I am from trabzon, and I heard from my elders, Russians did not treat bad to turks.
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They are treated harshly because otherwise the pseudo-historical claims that Armenian and Russians massacred 1 million muslims during WWI would not make any sense (not that they do anyway)
Edited by mamikon - 17-Mar-2007 at 15:46
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 03:17 |
Mamikon why u talk without reading the book. It has dedicated 6 pages on 1918 events in Azerbaijan.
Also Thomas Getz gives short information - 20 pages in his Karabagh war book, about 1918 Azerbaijan.
Go ahead and read them and then complain about my source.
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mamikon
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 05:47 |
I am not complaiing about your source, just asking a question. However,
I really dont think the book you posted would give you the details
about the Azeri government, when it was set up.
With regards to Thomas Goltz. Do you mean the book titled Azerbaijan Diary? because
when I read it, I still did not get information on the Azeri state at
its beginnings. Also, he does not really try to hide his pro-Azeri
leaning when he discussed karabakh.
You should read the book I posted, its an interesting read.
p.s. did you know Thomas Goltz was a persona non-grata in Azerbaijan
under Heydar Aliev, since he severly criticized Aliev's regime and was
much more in favor of Elchibey.
Edited by mamikon - 19-Mar-2007 at 05:50
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 06:12 |
so on Thomas Goltz - u re denying the thing u said yourself!
Well u maynot think, what about u get the b ook and read it - hey really, Are u in Armenia or outside, cose if u're in Armenia it would be harder to get the book.
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History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow!
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mamikon
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 06:19 |
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
so on Thomas Goltz - u re denying the thing u said yourself! |
huh? Read my post carefully. I said he doesnt explain what happened during the first months of the Azeri state.
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
Well u maynot think, what about u get the b ook and read it - hey
really, Are u in Armenia or outside, cose if u're in Armenia it would
be harder to get the book. |
Which book? I have the book by Thomas Goltz. The other book is in the
University library. Can you please tell me what pages are about
Azerbaijan in 1918? I dont really feel like flipping over 300 pages...
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Kerimoglu
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 06:28 |
it is not 300 paged book, read pages 142 and 184.
Haydar and Elchibay are opponents. If he worked for Haydar, howecome he was favor for Elchibay?
P.S. u say he was onesided - of course he would, everybody would - everything is obvious - there 4 resolutions of UN on that. We have such saying for the ones thinking like u - Have u eaten your head man???
P.S. 2. -Thats good that u have got the book in Libraray.
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History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow!
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mamikon
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Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 07:04 |
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
it is not 300 paged book, read pages 142 and 184 |
I meant the Turks in World History, not Azerbaijan Diary. I read the latter, not the former.
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
Haydar and Elchibay are opponents. If he worked for Haydar, howecome he was favor for Elchibay? |
When did he work for Heydar? Did you actually read the book? Did you not notice his harsh criticism of Heydar Aliev.
Maybe years after he worked, I am not sure, but I seriously doubt it.
Originally posted by Kerimoglu
P.S. u say he was onesided - of course he would, everybody would -
everything is obvious - there 4 resolutions of UN on that. We have such
saying for the ones thinking like u - Have u eaten your head man??? |
no comment...
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