Originally posted by pinguin
My dear friend, you are absolutely wrong. I am a Spanish speaker and I do have an inside view to Spanish language and culture that allow me to say with property that the word MORO (Moors) was used to name ANY MUSLIM in Spain by the PEOPLE, not by the historians.
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I don't think you are a Spanish speaker at all while your assumed "inside view" may very well be as full of, for the lack of a better word, sh*t as...well, your insides?
Some Spaniards may indeed refer to Muslims as Moors but many Spaniards also use the terms "Arabe" and "Muculmanos" to describe any Muslim.
Originally posted by pinguin
The English term MOOR and the ancient term MAURO, are not exacly the same that the term MORO in Spain. So when you read "The Moors of Spain" please be kind to translate "The Muslims of Spain".
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This is of course an example of the literary corruption that attempts to deceive the reader because "Muslim" in Spanish is not Moor but "Muculmano".
Now rebadging one word for another may suit your own personal fantasies but it's nevertheless delusional. The Spanish term Moro has a different meaning to that of the Spanish term Muculmano.
Originally posted by pinguin
It may be so. Actually the invaders of Spain were Arabs and Berbers of North Africa, Caucasians both. |
Oh don't worry, it is so but that doesn't suit you does it? You of course are still living in fantasy land even though the circus has long gone home.
You of course fall back to talking in vague terms without providing any details of which invasions, when in time such invasions occurred and where such invasions took place.
But of course you're unable to communicate in any detail at all because your fantasies could then be easily proven baseless and unfounded. So you simply deal in the currency that is vague talk.
Originally posted by pinguin
There you are ABSOLUTELY wrong. Al-Andalus is the name Arabs gave to Spain. It comes from Vandalus, the name of the german tribe that was on power before the Muslim invasion. Even more, today the Spanish province of Andalucia mantain the name Al-Andalus alive.
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Actually, like many children at the circus, you're the one that's being fooled. The only reason you believe Al-Andalus is the name given to Spain is because it's what you want to believe and it's what has been forced fed to you by the circus organizers.
The Al-Andalus written about by the Saracens was a island, Spain is not an island but of course little details like these are not mentioned. If such important details were to be mentioned, the children might dare to make sense of it all and God forbid even ask questions.
There is a province in Southern Spain popularly mapped as Andalusia but it's not the original name and just because it's popular it doesn't mean it's correct.
It's foreigners and the historically illiterate which are behind the incorrect labelling of Spanish territory and Spanish history in general. It's reached a stage where Spaniards themselves are so infected with the fantasies of foreigner origin that they themselves not only believe it but even worse, propagate it.
Just because it's popular it doesn't mean it's correct or accurate.
While the English speaking world uses the name Germany to describe the European nation north-east of France, the Spaniards, Portuguese and French call it Allemania and the inhabitants Allemani.
The point is, the title Al-Andalus was coined not by the Spaniards, the Saracens, Arabs or Moors but by some idiot, usually English, historian who popularized the fantasy that Al-Andalus was Spain instead of Sardinia and Corsica which the Saracens actually invaded in the 720s AD.
Spain has always been known as Spain, Hispania, Iberia, Celiberia and never has a Spanish province ever been called anything like Al-Andalus.
There is not one ancient historical document ever calling a province of Spain as something remotely close to the term Al-Andalus.
The Vandal and Visigothic links are of course similar fantasies where amature historians have mistaken Gothic and Vandal presence in the region of Armenia (also known as Iberia) and translated such events as happening in the region of Spain.
Further more, they've intangled geniune events of Vandal, Gothic and Arab incursions in Iberia (Armenia) which did occur in the 8th century with unrelated events that occured in Iberia (Spain) much later in the 12-13th century.
Hence the absurdity of Gothic, Vandal presence in Spain. Where original texts record Gothic incursions in a province of Gaul near the Danube river in modern day Romania and Hungary the corrupt and child like English translations reads Gothic and Vandal incursions in Galicia, Spain where they've translated Galatia to be Spanish Galicia when infact it's a Gallic province by the Danube river that should be mentioned.
Originally posted by pinguin
There was a parallel invasion to Sicily but they were in Spain at the same time. |
There was never any invasion of southern Spain in 711 AD. It's just the invasion of the islands of Al-Andalus which was Sardinia and Corsica. From Corsica the Saracens (Arabs) landed by ship in Southern France where they were eventually met by Charlemagne in and around 730 AD.
By rebadging Spain as Al-Andalus, have the circus managers been able to fool children into thinking that all of Spain was conquered and that the Muslims reached all the way to southern France where they wre finally defeated by Charlemagne in 730 AD. We are then told that the muslims retreated back to Al-Andalus, where people think Al-Andalus means Spain, and lived happily ever after.
The truth is that the Saracen Arabs did invade southern France but, as documented, they arrived by ship a few years after having conquered Sardinia and Corsica - the true Al-Andalus.
The people which propagate the fantasy that Southern Spain was invaded in 711 AD and in 2 days the entire peninsula (mind you a peninsula larger than both the Italian and Greek peninsulas put together) was conquered source their information from the texts that actually refer to the Saracen invasion of the island of Al-Andalus (Sardinia) and their attempt to conquer southern France.
Originally posted by pinguin
That's really ridiculous and reveals lack of knowledge. Don't you know about Visigothic Spain? Don't you know there are lots of words of German origin in Spain? Don't you know there are many blond Spaniards as well?
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If you're not competent enough to see through the fairy tales of Al-Andalus being something called Spain then you're certainly not going to see through the fairy tales of something called Visigothic Spain.
I think you'll find more words in German being of Spanish origin since Spanish is Latin based and the Germans didn't even have a writing system.
Further more, it's only natural for there being a certain amount of blondism in the Spanish population since they're a Celtic people - Celtiberians.
Blondism is found in every Celtic nation from Portugal to Belgium and France.
Originally posted by pinguin
Moreover, the Christians recovered almost all Spain for themselves at those times. Only the kingdom of Granada remained in Muslim hands for some centuries more. |
That's right, this invasion in the 12-13th AD century was defeated an only the portion of Granada (no more Al-Andalus eh?) remained as an Islamic province as a vassal to the Christian kings.
Because of the little impact of this genuine invasion in the 12-13th AD century have fairy tales been invented and historical facts distorted to create the fantasy of a 700 year Islamic rule over Spain.