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tadamson
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Topic: Mongol Armor? Posted: 12-Jan-2006 at 20:34 |
Originally posted by Temujin
Turnbull of course isn't an authority on Mognols anyways, and the book is mediocre to say at least...
re: shields. well, Gorelik, who is the authority on Steppe
archaeology (armoury & weapons) always depicts Mongols with
shields, including heavy cavalry, but then, he always only shows
warriors which have the hgihest possible status and the most armour
& equippment possible,s till i think shields are fairly common for
mongols and not uncommon for heavy cavalry, Timurs heavy cavalry and
heavy cavalry of Mamelukes for example also used shields. |
Contemorary illustrations of Timurid troops show very few heavy cavalry
with shields, and these are normally hung on the horses
hindquarters. I'm not impressed with Gorelik's books, he is
seriously over generous in the equipment he depicts. Also the
primary sources are clear, the more armour a cavalryman wore, the less
likely he was to use a shield. Though, in truth, it's that
the illustration is a very late period metal shield that I find most
dissapointing.
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rgds.
Tom..
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poirot
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Posted: 12-Jan-2006 at 21:31 |
Originally posted by tadamson
Also the primary sources are clear, the more armour a cavalryman wore, the less likely he was to use a shield. |
correct
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AAAAAAAAAA
"The crisis of yesterday is the joke of tomorrow.� ~ HG Wells
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shurite7
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Posted: 15-Jan-2006 at 16:57 |
Originally posted by Temujin
I disagree with the shield, in fact shields were widely used by Mongols |
As stated earlier shields were not widely used by Mongol heavy cavalry. In eastern armies, shields were not widely used by cavalry. As the Mongols traveled further west more of them adopted the use of a shield, still it wasn't the norm.
Ch
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HistoryGuy
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Posted: 25-Jan-2006 at 08:40 |
Mongols in those first pictures seem to be a little bit more hairier than the Chinese....
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هیچ مردی تا به حال به شما درباره خدا گفته.
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Posted: 19-Mar-2006 at 22:35 |
Originally posted by poirot
Here are two paintings of Mongol Cavalry:
Mongol Cavalryman
Mongol Cavalry in battle
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The picture is a total nonsense. The Monghol warrior is shown carrying a Chinese sword called Liuyedao furnished in a style of the 19-20th century. Anybody interested in ancient Monghol weapons, particularly armour, should get a book by Gorelik " Weapons of the Ancient East" Atlant Publishers, 2004 , Moscow-St. Petersburgh. It is in Russian, though...
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Temujin
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Posted: 20-Mar-2006 at 17:01 |
btw, can you tell me which Russian books on Steppe warriors did Gorelik illustrate?
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Posted: 26-Mar-2006 at 14:27 |
This is actually a Tatar warrior's armor, but i think its similar enough because they were in the same horde though different tribe ...
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tadamson
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Posted: 26-Mar-2006 at 18:06 |
Originally posted by CamokaGurth
This is actually a Tatar warrior's armor, but i
think its similar enough because they were in the same horde though
different tribe ...
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Whare is the image from?
If it's 'Tartar' are we talking 17thC ukraine ?
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rgds.
Tom..
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Erdene
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Posted: 23-Apr-2006 at 13:26 |
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Erdene
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Posted: 23-Apr-2006 at 13:28 |
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raygun
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Posted: 23-Apr-2006 at 21:21 |
Does the mongols have a standardised armor design? From the pictures, I have an impression that each indiv had to fabricate his gear from whatever stuff he can obtain...
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BigL
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Posted: 23-Apr-2006 at 21:49 |
troops were punished by death if they didnt have the standard equipment.
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shurite7
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Posted: 01-May-2006 at 19:22 |
Originally posted by BigL
troops were punished by death if they didnt have the standard equipment. |
What do you mean by standard equipment? Do you mean a person should have the standardized stuff such as a bow, quiver, lasso, horse, saddle, etc or do you mean the equipment had to be the same as all the others in their unit? By 'same' I mean same style of armour, same clothing and so forth.
Yes, you are correct, they were punished if their equipment was not kept in proper order and maintained properly.
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Chris
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Posted: 08-May-2006 at 06:59 |
Originally posted by perdon
mogols are like this? I think they look like chinese!!! |
don't be fool idiot.
i think uzbek people look like eskimos.
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Posted: 08-May-2006 at 20:22 |
Originally posted by tadamson
Originally posted by CamokaGurth
This is actually a Tatar warrior's armor, but i think its similar enough because they were in the same horde though different tribe ...
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Whare is the image from? If it's 'Tartar' are we talking 17thC ukraine ?
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*Tatar... the turkic peoples who were a part of the Golden Horde invading Eastern Europe (Russia, Ukraine etc.)
and yes they were a part of the Ottoman Empire in the 17th century, live in the areas of Tatarstan and Crimea(southern Ukraine). They were known as the Crimean Khanate after the breaking of the Horde.
(based on my research "Tartar" with the "r" was the work of European change that started from the "Tatary"(just used as the areas Tatars lived at) made related to "Tartarus" from Greek mythology )
*and PLEASE dont confuse Tatars with Mongols ... ive seen many mistakes like this in western(actually American ) history books etc. Tatars were turkic while Mongols were mongoloid
Edited by CamokaGurth
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Snafu
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Posted: 09-May-2006 at 07:45 |
Steppe nomads have always been influenced by Chinese society (and sometimes vice versa), so it's no surprise that Mongol armor is reminiscent of Chinese armor. Many components of their armor were probably purchased directly from Chinese merchants.
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Posted: 13-May-2006 at 17:24 |
camokagurth wroye
*and PLEASE dont confuse Tatars with Mongols ... ive seen many mistakes like this in western(actually American ) history books etc. Tatars were turkic while Mongols were mongoloid
Dude Turks are mongoloid(mostly) so are chinese and japanese.
the term monogoloid is used to point out a genetic hmmm.. something that links several races to gether.
It's Mongoloid, Caucasoid, Negroid and few more.
Edited by ahiska
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Seljuk
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Posted: 13-May-2006 at 18:41 |
Originally posted by ahiska
camokagurth wroye *and PLEASE dont confuse Tatars with Mongols ... ive seen many mistakes like this in western(actually American ) history books etc. Tatars were turkic while Mongols were mongoloid
Dude Turks are mongoloid(mostly) so are chinese and japanese. the term monogoloid is used to point out a genetic hmmm.. something that links several races to gether.
It's Mongoloid, Caucasoid, Negroid and few more.
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Turks are mixed of Mongoloid and caucasoid since the beginning of their existance chinese sources points out that turks(xiong-nu,tujue and some others) has some caucasian features like strong hair growth. Of course percantage of caucasian-mongoloid mixture changed over time
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Tar Szernd
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Posted: 23-Oct-2006 at 08:23 |
Hi!
Where were this photos made?
Thanks:
TSZ
Originally posted by vulkan02
here is some pics I found recently.
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HistoryGuy
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Posted: 23-Oct-2006 at 19:57 |
Mongols are East Asian Turks and West Turks are Central Asian, but West Turks are mongoloid as well (the way they look is like intermediate Mongoloid and Europoid)..
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هیچ مردی تا به حال به شما درباره خدا گفته.
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