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Janissary
Joined: 23-Aug-2007
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Topic: Most inventive Civilization? Posted: 24-Aug-2007 at 12:12 |
Where are the Egyptians?
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"It aint what you don't know that gets you in trouble; it's what you know for sure that just ain't so."
-Mark Twain
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west49ur
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Joined: 28-Jan-2007
Location: Canada
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Posted: 16-Aug-2007 at 23:49 |
what about Babylon?,and all of mesopotamia?
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pekau
Caliph
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Posted: 13-Aug-2007 at 20:58 |
Chinese or Greeks.
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LaurenD
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Posted: 13-Aug-2007 at 18:12 |
COMPARE MAN-HOURS PER INNOVATION:
What makes the Greeks "most inventive" by most any (non-agenda-driven) standard becomes clear when one considers just how few people were actually involved in generating their massive cultural and technological output.
Begin with the fact that we're talking about a handful of city-states, with limited populations. Then consider that in fact most of what we consider monumental came from just one of those (Athens) -- and this without the full contribution of slaves and women. Consider too they did all of it without the full-time jobs that might have supported their undivided attention to technological development. Also, the brief time-frame in which most of that output was developed. You're left with maybe 35 to 50 people in total, contributing 90 percent of the innovations, most of whom lived within a 150 years of one another. And they did this with lifespans much shorter on average than our own -- the comparison in man-hours is staggering. Finally, consider the fact that a great deal of what they created is no longer known to us (we have references to many Aristotelian works no copies of which exist today).
There is no other civilization in history that produced so much, from so few, in such a short span -- THIS is what makes the Greeks incomparably innovative.
It takes tens of thousands of Americans being paid to work 40 hours a week in positions of research and development to show anything like the innovative character of a single ancient Greek city-state.
Incomparable!
- Lauren D.
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LaurenD
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Posted: 13-Aug-2007 at 18:08 |
COMPARE MAN-HOURS PER INNOVATION:
What makes the Greeks "most inventive" by most any (non-agenda-driven) standard becomes clear when one considers just how few people were actually involved in generating their massive cultural and technological output.
Begin with the fact that we're talking about a handful of city-states, with limited populations. Then consider that in fact most of what we consider monumental came from just one of those (Athens) -- and this without the full contribution of slaves and women. Consider too they did all of it without the full-time jobs that might have supported their undivided attention to technological development. Also, the brief time-frame in which most of that output was developed. You're left with maybe 35 to 50 people in total, contributing 90 percent of the innovations, most of whom lived within a 150 years of one another. And they did this with lifespans much shorter on average than our own -- the comparison in man-hours is staggering. Finally, consider the fact that a great deal of what they created is no longer known to us (we have references to many Aristotelian works no copies of which exist today).
There is no other civilization in history that produced so much, from so few, in such a short span -- THIS is what makes the Greeks incomparably innovative.
It takes tens of thousands of Americans being paid to work 40 hours a week in positions of research and development to show anything like the innovative character of a single ancient Greek city-state.
Incomparable!
- Lauren D.
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elenos
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Joined: 13-Jun-2007
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 19:22 |
Once the migrant lives in another place the place he or she goes to gets the credit. Many ancient Greek inventions came from immigrants but like in the US they gained more recognition than they would have in their own country.
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elenos
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 11:38 |
Originally posted by elenos
America leads in some aspects of inventive because they actively encourage the immigration of leading people in their particular field. Many thing s"invented" there came from the brains of migrants. |
That's no kidding, and not only in the U.S. but in the rest of the Americas as well.
In Argentina an European immigrant invented the penball! and in Chile the first sun powered plant in the world to produce drinking water from sea water was build by a sweedish immigrant in the 19th century!
That's curious, isn't?
Pinguin
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Lmprs
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 10:47 |
Modern era inventions cannot be associated with any nation / civilization, if you ask me.
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elenos
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 10:28 |
America leads in some aspects of inventive because they actively encourage the immigration of leading people in their particular field. Many thing s"invented" there came from the brains of migrants.
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elenos
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Seko
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 10:22 |
I would have to go with the Americans. The US more precisely. Especially from the 19th century onward.
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 10:05 |
Originally posted by GR3Y077
If America is a 'civilization' how can it *not* be number one?
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"America"? Do you mean the U.S.? Well, if so, the United States is a country, not a civilization. The civilization to which belongs is called "Western".
Anyways, since the 19th century the U.S. has been quite inventive, indeed. It has my respects.
Pinguin
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Lmprs
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 07:29 |
Originally posted by GR3Y077
If America is a 'civilization' how can it *not* be number one? |
Maybe, just maybe some people think there are more inventive civilizations?
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GR3Y077
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Joined: 29-Aug-2006
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Posted: 07-Aug-2007 at 04:31 |
If America is a 'civilization' how can it *not* be number one?
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Posted: 04-Aug-2007 at 10:52 |
Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy
I think playing any stick and ball game will give you a good upper hand in trying another. Looks like it'd be a interesting game to try, but I'm guessing I'd have to get to Chile to try it.
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Yes. But at least you want to play standard hockey, you will have to ask permission to Mapuches to try . Not an easy task at all. Mapuches don't like outsiders: not chileans and not foreigners either. They haven't the "welcome" attitude of North American Indians at all . I tell you.
Pinguin
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SearchAndDestroy
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Posted: 04-Aug-2007 at 09:53 |
I think playing any stick and ball game will give you a good upper hand in trying another. Looks like it'd be a interesting game to try, but I'm guessing I'd have to get to Chile to try it.
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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Posted: 03-Aug-2007 at 21:37 |
Here I found some of the rules. It is not a standard game and the rules vary in different communities:
Paln
The game's length, number of participants of each team, and the number of goals, or line crossings, are previously accorded between the teams. Most games are played up to four line crossings, or a kon or kuden. To score, the pali must cross one of the narrower border lines of the paliwe. When the pali escapes the field, the game must recommence from the center of the field. When the game is played between two communities, the lonkos agree on the rules. The hosting community solemnly welcome their guests following the ancestral rules. They pray and dance around the rewe, or altar made up of canelo branches and white and black flags, being grateful for the celebration and pleading for the sake of the game. Once the palin is over, no mattering its result, the hosting community entertains its guests with food and drinks.
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Curiosly enough, Chilean are good for roller hockey and field hockey, perhaps it comes in the blood . Ice hockey is also played in Punta Arenas, close to Antartic.
This is our roller hockey female team, worldchampion in 2006:
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SearchAndDestroy
Caliph
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Posted: 03-Aug-2007 at 20:30 |
Alot of players, and a long narrow field to play on. Is it some sort of advancing play, or can all the players move freely through the field?
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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Posted: 03-Aug-2007 at 15:22 |
Try this youtubes that show the game of palin (Mapuche Hockey)
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Posted: 03-Aug-2007 at 15:16 |
Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy
Kinda hard to understand how it's played. Sounds like a long game too. Can take a whole afternoon to play. |
It is similar to field hockey. The ball is made of wood. The have two goals at the end of the fields.
Actually the point I tried to make is quite simple: games like hockey have been invented several times in different places and cultures.
In particular, Mapuche's hockey is a pre-colombian field game like Mesoamerican ball game and Canadian Lacroise.
Pinguin
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SearchAndDestroy
Caliph
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Posted: 03-Aug-2007 at 14:31 |
Kinda hard to understand how it's played. Sounds like a long game too. Can take a whole afternoon to play.
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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