US elections, Donald Trump
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URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=36191
Printed Date: 13-May-2024 at 17:07
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Topic: US elections, Donald Trump
Posted By: Mosquito
Subject: US elections, Donald Trump
Date Posted: 06-Apr-2016 at 14:08
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Popular in Poland blogger Max Kolonko gives D. Trump the title of Man of the year. US elections from Polish perspective.
Turn on the english subtitles (avaible on youtube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Exq2zJ2QA4 Any comments? ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Replies:
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 06-Apr-2016 at 19:42
Let the lunatic fringe have their man of the year. Even the Conservatives here in the UK wouldn't urinate on a burning Donald Trump if he was on fire. Truly a pariah who could only muster around forty six thousand signatures in a petition of support in allowing his entry into the UK after a petition asking for his ban got just over half a million signatures.  ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 01:55
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I think Trump is just a hoax to hand the election to the opponent or to distract from someone else, maybe like the word trump means in dictionary, or like the final trump(et) in Revelation/Apocalypse. Donald Duck came to mind too? I'm neither pro nor anti him. See my comment a couple of weeks ago at http://calltolight.org/2016/03/15/why-donald-trump-is-the-best-thing-to-ever-happen-to-the-usa/ I don't believe everything i see/hear in media (tv, papers, websites etc). |
Posted By: medenaywe
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 03:48
Pathological liar,prestigious title belongs to him!Other titles after graduation that follows.
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Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 07:26
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well, he runs in elections against the whole establishment and against all the liberal media, which are against him and conduct against him defamatory campaign.
Why do you think that other candidates who take money for the campaign from the great corporations or from Jewish owned law firms and banks are better? I belive that for many people in the USA Donald Trump is a real chance to change somthing in their country. Obama promissed it in the past but he was the same puppet of great corporations like those before him. At least Trump is too rich to get easily corrupted. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: red clay
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 12:12
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The "Donald" is a con man of the first order. He has appealed to every fringe agenda existing.
The liberal media is a term used by idiots like him. Even the conservative media is against him. Jewish owned law firms and banks? And a hearty "Sieg Heil" to you too. I was living near Atlantic City when Trump was actively building Casinos. He would open a casino and promptly file for bankruptcy. He ruined dozens of small contractors, some lost everything. I tend to agree with AR, Trump isn't serious. He has no intention of actually running for the office. He is running on ego only. He hasn't a snow balls chance in hell of winning a general election. ------------- "Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces". Unknown. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 16:00
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Saying the truth - that Jewish owned banks and law firms have huge influence on American goverment doesnt make anyone a nazist. "Sieg hail" is definatelly put in wrong place. It isint a secret that many important people in White House were working for Goldman-Sachs or will be working there after loosing their jobs in US administration. They do it all over the world, also in Europe. One our previous PM's was also working for them and he wasnt an economist nor any world class specialist but they did pay him huge salary, so one may ask why they do such things. Maybe for the same reasons for which Russians hired corrupted German chancellor Schroeder.
People like Trump always did exist in history. Even in ancient Rome. And even that time their candidatures for important offices were fiercly opposed by the establishment. 2000 years ago as well as now, the establishment didnt like "new people" (homo novus) especially if they were very rich, because such people were always too independent and less controlable by the political class. There is nothing that American establishment can offer to Trump, so once he will get the power he can act as he wish and it is thing that every establishment in every country and time hates most. Especially because so called "new people" dont have to play by the rules which the old establishment has enacted. https://prof77.wordpress.com/politics/an-updated-list-of-goldman-sachs-ties-to-the-obama-government-including-elena-kagan/ ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 07-Apr-2016 at 16:13
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TRUTH OR FALSE?
from: http://www.whiteoutpress.com/articles/q42012/list-of-goldman-sachs-employees-in-the-white-house/ Goldman Sachs Personnel in the Barack Obama White House Lael Brainard: Brainard is the United States Under Secretary of the Treasury for International Affairs in the administration of Obama. Gregory Craig: Former White House Counsel, Recently hired by Goldman Sachs. Thomas Donilon: Deputy National Security Adviser (despite having a career that is mostly involved with domestic politics). Donilon was a lawyer at O’Melveny and Myers and made almost $4 million representing meltdown clients including Penny Pritzker (of Chicago) and Goldman Sachs. William C. Dudley: President and Chief Executive Officer of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, partner and managing director at Goldman Sachs and was the firm’s chief U.S. economist for a decade. Douglas Elmendorf: Obama Director of the Congressional Budget Office in January 2009, replaced Furman as Director of the Hamilton Project (Note that the Hamilton Project was funded by Robert Rubin and Goldman Sachs). Rahm Emanuel: Obama Chief of Staff, on the payroll of Goldman Sachs receiving $3,000 per month from the firm to “introduce us to people", in the words of one Goldman Sachs partner at the time. Dianna Farrell: Obama Administration: Deputy Director, National Economic Council. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Financial Analyst. Stephen Friedman: Obama Administration: Chairman, President’s Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Board Member (Chairman 1990-94; Director 2005). Michael Frohman: Robert Rubin’s Chief of Staff while Rubin served as Secretary of the Treasury and an Obama “head hunter” according to “Rubin Proteges Change Their Tune as They Join Obama’s Team” in the New York Times. Anne Fudge: Appointed to Obama budget deficit reduction committee. Fudge has been the PR craftsman for some of America’s largest corporations. She sits, according to the Washington Post, as a Trustee of the Brookings Institution within which the Hamilton Project is embedded. Jason Furman: Directed economic policy for the Obama Presidential Campaign, served as the second Director of the Hamilton Project after Peter Orszag’s departure for the Obama administration. Mark Gallogly: Sits on the Hamilton Project’s advisory council. He is also, according to Wikipedia, currently a member of President Obama’s Economic Recovery Advisory Board. Timothy Geithner: Secretary of the Treasury, former President of the New York Fed. a former managing director of Goldman Sachs. Gary Gensler: Obama Administration: Commissioner of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Partner and Co-head of Finance. Michael Greenstone: The 4th Director of the Hamilton Project. Just as attorney Craig went from advising Obama to defending Goldman Sachs against the SEC complaint, Greenstone has used the revolving door to go from an Obama economic adviser position to one of the Goldman Sachs outlets - in this case its think tank embedded in the Brookings Institution and funded by Goldman Sachs and Robert Rubin. All 3 previous Directors of the Hamilton Project work in the Obama administration. Robert Hormats: Obama Administration: Undersecretary for Economic, Energy and Agricultural Affairs, State Department. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Vice Chairman, Goldman Sachs Group. Neel Kashkari: Served under Treasury Secretary Paulson (a former Goldman Sachs CEO) and was kept on by Obama after his inauguration for a limited period to work on TARP oversight. Former Vice President of Goldman Sachs in San Francisco where he led Goldman’s Information Technology Security Investment Banking practice. Karen Kornbluh: (Sometimes called "Obama’s brain") Obama Ambassador to the OECD. Was Deputy Chief of Staff to 'Mr. Goldman Sachs', Robert Rubin. Jacob "Jack" Lew: The United States Deputy Secretary of State for Management and Resources. According to Wikipedia, Lew sits on the Brookings-Rubin funded Hamilton Project Advisory Board. He also served with Robert Rubin in Bill Clinton’s cabinet as Director of OMB. David Lipton: Now on Obama’s National Economic Council and the National Security Council. Lipton worked with Larry Summers and Timothy Geithner on the US response to the Asian financial crisis of the 1990’s. MergeFoundations reports that Lipton worked closely with Robert Rubin. Emil Michael: White House Fellow. Former investment banker with Goldman Sachs. Eric Mindich: Former chief strategy officer of New York-based Goldman Sachs, started Eton Park in 2004 with $3.5 billion, at the time one of the biggest hedge-fund launches ever. Philip Murphy: Obama Administration: Ambassador to Germany. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Head of Goldman Sachs, Frankfurt. Barack Obama: Obama owes his career to Goldman Sachs which was not only his biggest financial contributor when he ran for the Presidency, but was also his biggest contributor when he ran for the US Senate. Peter Orszag: Obama Budget Director. Founding director of the Hamilton Project, funded by Goldman Sachs and Robert Rubin. Wikipedia indicates that Robert Rubin, Goldman’s ex-CEO, was one of Orszag’s mentors. Mark Patterson: Obama Administration: Chief of Staff to Treasury Secretary Timothy Geitner. Former Goldman Sachs Title: Lobbyist 2005-2008; Vice President for Government Relations. Mark Peterson: Chief of staff to Timothy Geithner. Goldman Sachs Vice President and lobbyist. Steve Ratner: The shady billionaire financier who Obama appointed as his “car czar” and who resigned after it was revealed that his company, the Quadrangle Group, was apparently involved in “pay to play” for a billion dollars or so of New York State pension funds, and was under possible indictment by the New York AG and the SEC. Sits on the Advisory Council of the Goldman funded Hamilton Project. Robert Reischauer: A member of the Medicare Payment Advisory Commission from 2000-2009 and was its Vice Chair from 2001-2008. He too sits on the Hamilton Project’s advisory board. Alice Rivlin: Obama named Alice Rivlin to his so-called Deficit Reduction Commission. James Rubin: Son of Robert Rubin. Served as a 'headhunter' for Obama per the New York Times article, "Rubin Proteges Change Their Tune as They Join Obama’s Team". Gene Sperling: Advisor to Timothy Geithner on bailouts. Sperling paid by Goldman Sachs for one year of consulting work. Adam Storch: Obama Managing Executive of the Security and Exchange Commission’s Division of Enforcement. Former Vice President in the Goldman Sachs Business Intelligence Group. Larry Summers: Obama chief economic adviser and head of the National Economic Counsel. Worked under Robert Rubin at Goldman Sachs. John Thain: Obama Administration: Advisor to Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner. Former Goldman Sachs Title: President and Chief Operating Officer (1999-2003). ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 02:12
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Mosquito: I don't think that anyone in the 2 mainstream parties and/or business is likely to be genuine hope of decent change, especially not Trump if he was building casinos like Red says & wikipedia says. (Though it is not impossible that someone could make it in through the main parties or business.) There is evidence that it may be the Vatican not the Jews or Goldman-Sachs who are behind alot of things, like the harlot Babylon in Revelation. It is not easy to tell who is behind all this globalism, corporatism, digitalisation, transhumanism, etc though (COS, or Masons, or Mosad, or Focus, or Jesuits or Opus Dei, or Prism, or KGB, or FRB, or Golden Triangle, etc). -> Romans/Imperials (Vatican/Papacy): Bernie Sanders: "... and this is not Judaism, this is what Pope Francis is talking about, that we can’t just worship billionaires and the making of more and more money." "Sanders's wife is Roman Catholic, and he has frequently expressed admiration for Pope Francis, saying that "the leader of the Catholic Church is raising profound issues." (Wikipedia.) "In December 2014, after the secret meetings, it was announced that Obama, with Pope Francis as an intermediary, had negotiated a restoration of relations with Cuba, after nearly sixty years of détente." (Wikipedia 'Barack Obama'.) "Trump retracted his criticism of the Pope: " I don't think this is a fight," said Trump. "I think he said something much softer than was originally reported by the media." " (Wikipedia, 'Donald Trump'.) There is Latin in the Image uploader of this forum. In the 2nd half of 2015, pro-Pope poster 'Kepha[s]' on christianityboard.com said to me "you will be assimilated". -> Jews: "Trump also has ties to the Jewish-American community." (wikipedia.) [Dave Weasel who attacked Trump in http://thevalleyreport.com/ may be Jewish?] "Sanders had a typical upbringing for his generation of American Jews: his father generally attended synagogue only on Yom Kippur; he attended public schools while his mother "chafed" at his yeshiva Sunday schooling at a Hebrew school; and their religious observances were mostly limited to Passover seders with their neighbors." (wikipedia.) Clinton: "Israel's new friend: Hillary, born-again Zionist". (wikipedia.) Lewinsky? -> Goldman Sachs: "Former Goldman executives who moved on to government positions include, but are not limited to, Robert Rubin and Henry Paulson who served as U.S. Secretaries of the Treasury under former Presidents Bill Clinton and George W. Bush, respectively; Mario Draghi, President of the European Central Bank, and Mark Carney, Governor of the Bank of Canada from 2008–13 and Governor of the Bank of England since July 2013." (wikipedia.) -> Soviets: Is Trump's wife's name Russian? |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 05:57
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Arthur-Robin
Im not an American so I watch those things from outside but I think USA needs change and Americans needs it. Obama has promissed them the change but in fact he was even more the puppet of great corporations and banks than presidents before him. In fact it are the great corporations who elect US congress and pay for it 1,5 Billion dollars as donations to candidates for their campaigns. I cannot say when but it is obvious that nowadays USA is not a democracy but oligarchy. And it is oligarchy that is ruling US goverment. The fact that Trump invested in casinos doesnt mean anything bad as long as they are legal. As for the Vatican - dont underestimate its power ;) Catholic Church is the worlds biggest real estates owner and got both funds and influence. Im neither pro nor against Trump. He dont run for the office in my country. But his case is very interesting. I think that it is obvious for anyone who can watch and think, that the whole establishment in the USA is against him.Both republican and democratic. Because he doesnt depend on any of them. He is even independent from the banks and corporations because got so much that they have nothing to offer him. In my opinion Trump is very similar to some politicians of the populares faction in ancient Rome. They were usually very rich and they also had all Roman establishment against them, so to get the power and keep it they had to appeal to normal Romans and to represent their interests. Novadays it means that Trump would be a guy who would side with those Americans who were ruined by crisis against the banks which now control the goverment. Such person is extremly dangerous for American elites and they cannot allow him to become president. So Trump is alone against all those great who represent great capital, media and politics while behind him are the people who are dissapointed by the way in which America is run for last decades. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 06:08
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I think that Trump can be easily compared to this ancient Roman politician. Just ignore military career because in Rome goverment offices were connected with the command in army:
From wiki: Gaius Flaminius Nepos was a politician and consul of the Roman Republic in the 3rd century BC. He was the greatest popular leader to challenge the authority of the Senate prior to the Gracchi a century later. In the aftermath of the First Punic War, Flaminius, a novus homo, was the leader of a reform movement that sought to reorganize state land in Italy. As tribune of the plebs in 232 BC, he passed a plebiscite that divided the Ager Gallicus (the land south of Ariminum, which had been conquered from the Gauls decades before) and gave it to poor families whose farms had fallen into ruin during the war. Contrary to the constitution and tradition, he did not seek consultation from the Senate, who would have been opposed to this decision. In 221, Flaminius was magister equitum to Marcus Minucius Rufus, then in 220 he was chosen as a censor along with Lucius Aemilius Papus. During his term, he arranged for the Via Flaminia to be built from Rome to Ariminum, established colonies at Cremona and Placentia, reorganized the Centuriate Assembly to give the poorer classes more voting power, and built the Circus Flaminius on the Campus Martius. In 218, while serving in the Senate, he was the only senator to support the Lex Claudia, which prohibited senators from participating in overseas trade. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 08:39
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It gets better and better: Ted Cruz is part Italian: "Cruz has said, "I'm Cuban, Irish, and Italian, and yet somehow I ended up Southern Baptist." Ted Cruz & Goldman Sachs: "In January 2016, The New York Times reported that Cruz and his wife had taken out low-interest loans from Goldman Sachs (where she worked) and Citibank...." "She [Cruz's wife] is currently taking leave from her position as head of the Southwest Region in the Investment Management Division of Goldman, Sachs & Co. and previously worked in the White House for Condoleezza Rice and in New York as an investment banker." Mosquito posted against Jews yet Trump has links with them: "Trump Drinks (an energy drink for the Israeli and Palestinian markets)" "In January 2013, Trump was a popular figure in Israel, and has, himself, owned land in Israel (the Elite Tower site). Trump released a video endorsing Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu during the 2013 Israeli elections." ----- I agree that it is interesting that alot of mainstream are seemingly anti Trump, but i am sceptical from the little i have seen (i am no fan of that sort of rich people, business people, casino builders, person who has had 3 marriages, mainstream party politicians, real estate agents, etc), though i have not seen any much of his manifesto policies. Just because he and his wife and daughter have blond hair (and blue? eyes) doesn't mean he is going to be a good change for usa. If people really want a decent change in USA then how about firstly stopping water fluoridation? If any politician was a hop of true change surely they would be stand up outright on issues like water fluoridation. Fluoridation also effects voters, as does the media. Does Trump say anything about the water if he really cares about common Americans? Mosquito no offense but you come across as possibly secretly pro Roman/Vatican? John Paul 2 was Polish too. The "popes" are really secret emperors/Caesars. ----- A freemason once told me that the Blue Masons KJV bible has list of Presidents who were masons. Does anyone have this list? (Please.) |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 10:42
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LoL
However, Im divorced and got a second wife. In the eyes of Church Im a sinner because my first marriage was catholic and for the church is still valid. I guess that when I will divorce again and marry third time, you will put me to the same category of people as Trump ;) (im not planning it but who knows) ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 10:47
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As for Trump caring for common Americans I didnt say that he really cares. But as it will be his electorate and he will want to be re-elected, he will have to fulfil at least part of his promisses.
Lets come back again to ancient Rome. Do you think that people like Flaminius or Caesar did really care about common people? I doubt, but they needed them to stay in power. So, there is a possibility that if Trump will become president, he will do for common Americans more than anyone before him during last 40 years. Not because he loves so much so called common people, but because everyone else will be against him. On the other hand, do you belive that any of the candidates for presidents, coming from the establishment, sponsored by institutions such as Goldman Sachs, will ever do somthing for common Americans, or will only try to secure the interests of great banks and establishment, which is paying them now and will pay them in the future as well. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 11:30
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Why do you keep mentioning ancient Rome? I didn't say anything about the Church. I don't think i am bad for not being a fan of prominent people who marry many times, especially when some of us have had no one. I dislike reading the psalms for the same reason (King David had ~12 wives.) I was not judging you or anyone else. All i meant is that one has to consider everything when it comes to voting for people (and i gave a list of half a dozen things for starters in Trumps case). Maybe you shouldn't marry if you don't care about your partner to stay with them. How can a person be a good change for USA if he/she doesn't care about common Americans? Anyone in government should care about what is best for the Whole nation/community which includes the common people. "As above, so below". If i was able to stand for president i would care about common people. I would be willing to do far better than Trump or any of them, the only question is if i would be able to. Who is to say that "everyone is against him" is not a fake/hoax? John Kasich "Religion ... formerly Roman Catholicism" "Kasich was raised a Catholic, but considers denominations irrelevant, and stated that "there's always going to be a part of me that considers myself a Catholic." these guys/gals of Goldman Sachs are certainly in many highish positions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_employees_of_Goldman_Sachs but i not sure that they are the One behind all though. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 08-Apr-2016 at 11:48
Because ancient Rome was a place where republican system originated from and I see many analogies between modern day USA and ancient Rome. The mechanics of politics didnt change much. And history is used to repeat itself.
Who says that I dont care. But life is not a fairy tale. Like many things people also change.
Because political interests of politicians can be combined with the interests of common people. Who is better: the one who doesnt care for people but is doing somthing for them because his political interest goes in pair with their economic interest or the one who cares a lot and does nothing for them? Every politician of American establishment seems to care a lot for the people, but once he get ower, he seems to care more for those who sponsored his campaign.
So you prefer the politicians who care a lot for people, but they take money for their campaigns from Goldman Sachs and after they are elected they pay back their debt to Goldman Sachs and others with the money of common people. And when the interests of common people are in conflict with the interestes of banks, they do somthing for banks and nothing for the people. Thats exactly what happend in the USA during last crisis. The common people did pay for huge bailouts to the banks while in the same time over 700.000 american famillies lost their houses. Who is the nation - the owners of banks or the common people?
Nobody has to say it. Just check it yourself. With every new succes of Trump his oppoents get more and more money for their campaigns. Everytime when Trump's popularity raises, the other candidates recive more and bigger donations from banks. Sponsored media try to discredit him even more and more (however I must admitt that he does a lot to help them). ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 09-Apr-2016 at 01:15
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I wish to be let out of this please, as i don't have the time and health to keep answering for myself. (How do i get myself into these situations all the time? I wouldn't have even been posting on here at all if it wasn't this cursed bent nose, fluoridated water, and other troubles stopping me from doing my paper studies off computer.) I could be wrong, I know that i am sometimes/often wrong, but i am not always/all wrong. I personally don't see Trump as a genuine great hope nation builder even if he says a few interesting things and even if alot of people don't seem to like him. Not that i am against him, just not for him. But i am pretty out of touch not having a tv, radio, papers, etc. I accept that everyone is entitled to their own opinions etc. I wouldn't vote for any of the 5 main candidates, unless i had only those 5 to choose from or unless tactical voting. Possibly maybe he is the best or least bad of the 5, but i am not sure myself.
Ah ok. Sorry I am a little bit paranoid ever since my popes/emperors discovery last year, and it seemed possibly strange. I wonder if that means that Caesar/"Cephas/Kepha"/Imperium is coming soon. We seem to be in Spenglar's winter phase. The bible's iron(-&-clay)/4th-beast phase. "Of the 22 civilizations that have appeared in history, nineteen of them collapsed when they reached the moral state the United States is in now." (- Arnold J. Toynbee.) (Modern Europe/world seemingly may be a composite of the Lion, Bear and Leopard (and Dragon)?) Ancient republican Rome had some good things and some bad things. USA has some good things and some bad things. Somethings may be similar, somethings are different. Trump doesn't seem much of a Cato to me other than somethings he says perhaps? He may have some good points, but he seemingly may also have some bad stuff.
Ok. It just came across like you were saying i am bad for not being a fan of people who have married 2 or 3 or more times like Trump, and the way you said it was as if you were casually promoting it which is like not caring about staying with someone. Some sources say that ancient Rome was very strong on family like the bible, in contrast to the likes of Carthage. Marriage and family is an important building block of Nation. I don't judge people that bad has happened to. It just seems a bad impression that Trump has had 3 wives/marriages, like Kasich has been married twice too.
Sure, it is true that there have been political leaders who have combined national interest and personal ambition. But i personally don't see Trump as being/doing that very much, except a few things he says maybe. But then i am out of touch, and maybe i am just prejudiced against rich business barons & upper middle class. I have not favorably mentioned or promoted anyone "who cares a lot and does nothing for them". I don't agree that every American politician cares alot for the people, though they may "seem" to. I not sure myself that politicians become corrupt (re care more for their sponsors) after they get into power, though it is human to not want to loose the position & pay. I think they are corrupt already before they get in. We both agree that ones that care about their sponsors rather than the nation/people are bad. I can not believe that anyone who has looked at Trump's biography ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump ) can believe or honestly/genuinely claim that he is a great national hope. It really comes down to what evidence is there and what do they stand for (all that they stand for), and why they are standing? Both what they say and what they do, all their life past and present, according to themselves and according to others, private life and public life, and their past record all the time in office if they have been. And if there are any other better candidates or not.
I agree that the interests of the bankers and bad politicians are in conflict with the interests of the nation/people. I never said i support/prefer any of the 5 mainstream candidates, or ones that take money from Goldman Sachs. The only person it could be said that i said i prefer is myself if i stood. I posted possible evidences against all the 5 main candidates and Obama. What i posted tended/seemed to support the claims about Goldman Sachs. I certainly do not like any politicians who are associated with the likes of Goldman Sachs etc. I don't see how they can care about the nation/people and be serving Goldman Sachs at the same time. Just because he doesn't seem to be in with Goldman Sachs doens't mean he isn't in with anyone else like say the Vatican, or organised crime, or masons, or just serving himself. We (all the Western World ) are in crisis now and have been for decades. Some of us suffer hell everyday. I don't even have clean water to drink/eat. "The real USA unemployment rate is 30%." I heard a year or so ago that there are homeless people in the USA. (Don't know if Obama change that?) No politician that doesn't take a stand outright against water fluoridation etc is in my good books.
We both agree that the bankers are not pro the nation/people. Economics does have a part to play in the nation, but they shouldn't be ruling it / we shouldn't be serving it. But, to my own view, Trump as a rich man, business man, real estate agent, property baron, casino builder, etc is closer to the bankers than the common people. So I personally don't see Trump being much of a representative of the whole Nation. As far as i can see, Trump is not that much of a Cato, or Rockwell, or Mussolini, or Jesus, or etc. This is just a quick imperfect comment: The Nation includes all decent citizens, and the common interest, like we are all one organic body. "As above, so below". Everyone has dignity, and is able and encouraged to be the best without harming/hindering other decent people or the whole, where the best are in government doing whats best for the common interest of the whole Nation. Rather than just a small percentage of rich/wealthy people harming and hurting us others.
Just because they don't like Trump and that the sponsors prefer others doesn't mean Trump is going to be a great national leader. Perhaps it could mean that he is the best of the 5 main candidates, but even that i am not sure of myself without knowing more. Perhaps if we could talk to him? Just because he doesn't seem to be in with Goldman Sachs doesn't mean he isn't pro any other possible shady groups/people. This reminds me of the Duterte article last year ( https://christiansaguyan.wordpress.com/2015/12/08/voting-for-duterte-a-biblical-response/ ). ----- p.s. "Clinton was also a member of the Order of DeMolay, a youth group affiliated with Freemasonry, but he never became a Freemason." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States_who_were_Freemasons |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 09-Apr-2016 at 22:59
Mosquito, you seem to be using the term "Jewish owned" as an adjective to add extra meaning to the following "law firms and banks". Can you explain why you're doing this. and why it wasn't appropriate to do the same to the great corporations, for example, Mosquito? I ask this as this tends to be the chew toy the rabid dogs of the nazi/neo-nazis brain dead goon squads nose around in the dirt for their gratification. It makes me laugh really, Mosquito, as many of them sing the virtues of their Christian backgrounds...etc...forgetting the Jesus being a good Jewish boy himself. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 07:17
It has nothing to do with nazi or neonazi ideologies. Its just a reality. Even Red did admitt here when I asked, that for 9 judges of highest court in USA the 4 are Jews. When a friend of mine had stipendium on Harvard University he came back to Poland quite astonished that about 75 % if not more students of law on Harvard were "American Jews". So concerning the fact that American Jews are a very small minority in the USA, they are in the same time the most influential. And the history which wasnt easy for them becuse they were a persecuated minority for more than a 1000 years made this nation, especially their disaspora outside Israel very conslidated and made them care for their own interests more than for the interests of their host country. Because Jewsih diaspora is in possesion of the biggest banks, massmedia and most important law firms in the USA, they have an influence on many things, starting from US gverment and its policy, ending on rewriting history and deciding what is politicaly correct and what is not. Even when it come to producing hollywood movies which promote one or other vision of history: for example movie "Defiance" -which show brothers Bielski as great heroes but says nothing about war crimes they have committed. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 13:18
I'm at a loss, Mosquito, as to your meaning behind highlighting an ethnicity's religion. What exactly are you saying these people are doing, and what proof do you have that proves without a shadow of a doubt they have committed such acts? Btw there's quite a difference between admitting and confirming, Mosquito. When you suggest "admitting" that applies there had been wrongdoing, which you have yet to prove even in the most minute fashion. Confirming information which was already a matter of public knowledge is what you were looking for for further reference. As for you trying, and may I say failing, to slur the Bielski Brother, that is already a very well know far-right conspiracy and slur which some tried to exploit just over a decade ago when someone said they believed they might have seen Bielski partisans with the Russian partisans in connection with the attack. Some others also came forward and said some looked like they were the Jewish partisans. All said there wasn't a belief Tuvia and his brothers were there. However the lies ar easy unravelled, Mosquito, and I once again say to you should distance yourself from the dirty scumbag far-right brainless goons. Three things about the claim. First, it is very plain from looking at photos of the partisans both Russian and Polish of that time, they looked remarkably similar, and that included the Polish Jewish partisans too. Second, the attack took place at night when it would have been even less likely to distinguish differences. Thirdly, and this is the critical evidence, the Bielski brothers and the Bielski partisans didn't even arrive in that area for another three months. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 16:13
Because what Im saying is not a "rhetoric" but plain facts and they can be verified.
Somtimes religion is equal to ethnicity. Why do you cant apply for the citisenship in Israel? Because to do it you must be a Jew. Doesnt matter where from, USA, Russia, Poland or Germany but you must be a Jew. Your ancestors can even live for 200 years in USA or for 700 in Poland and have no connection to the state of Israel but as long as you are a Jew, you will recive citisenship there.
Thank you for clarification. I always try to improve my english and right now disscussing on such forums is the only way I can practice it.
You are talking now about Naliboki massacre. Actually the part of Bielski's partisants wasnt positively for them verified. What is known for sure is that they together with Soviets did attack Polish Home Army forces and it is well verified. And several survivors witnessed that there were Bielski's partisans during massacre. As for the Jewish question. The Jews lived in my country much longer than USA exists, for over 700 years in big numbers and even longer in smaller communities. I dont talk about things I know nothing about. There were some great Jews in my country, some very patriotic Poles of Jewish descent but there were also some bad guys and even evil, as evil as the nazists themselves. For example - and this is not "a far right invention" which cannot be verified but you wont learn about it in the USA - after WW2 when F.D. Roosvelt sold Poland to Soviets in Yalta, Poland was ruled mostly by the criminal band of Jews. They tortured, send to Siberia and murdered hundrieds thousands of my countrymen and also members of some other nations. Today most of them is dead already. Poland tried to judge some remaining but they escaped either to Israel, USA or UK and those countries refused to give those murderers back to Poland claiming that they cant have a fair trial here. I think the best example is infamous mass-murderer Salomon Morel. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salomon_Morel During Stalinist period in communist Poland the goverment and apparatus of terror was run by Polish Jews. They were so ashamed that there are so few Poles between them that many of them even changed surnames for Polish. Want examples? To name the few who got their biographies in english: Julia Brystygier, nicknamed "Bloody Luna" a sadist Jewish woman who was personally torturing people, especially their genitals. In the instruction to her subordinates she did write: "In fact, the Polish intelligentsia as such is against the Communist system and basically, it is impossible to re-educate it. All that remains is to liquidate it. However, since we must not repeat the mistake of the Russians after the 1917 revolution, when all intelligentsia members were exterminated, and the country did not develop correctly afterwards, we have to create such a system of terror and pressure that the members of the intelligentsia would not dare to be politically active" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Brystiger Roman Romkowski - real name Natan Grünspan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Romkowski Józef Różański- real name Josek Goldberg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zef_R%C3%B3%C5%BCa%C5%84ski Anatol Fejgn - famous torturer https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatol_Fejgin Józef Światło - real name Izaak Fleischfarb - famous torturer and murderer who later escaped to the USA and lived there well until his death. "United States gave him political asylum with the full knowledge that "he would have to be protected for the rest of his life because the number of his victims and relatives of victims sworn to exact retribution was so great." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zef_%C5%9Awiat%C5%82o ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 18:02
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As for the brothers Bielski finally it is worth to add that they were also almost always drunk, bandits who raped many women and murdered many men. You can find such statements in the testimonies of Jewish survivors from their own band. Including description of murders. For example Leslie Bell,from New York, who described it in „Jewish Press”, daughter of one of survivors. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 18:36
As you've found such evidence we expect an url link for us to verify if you don't mind, Mosquito. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 19:18
Im basing my claims on the work of Polish historian Piotr Zychowicz. However after very short googling I found: "Lola had also witnessed the shooting of a Jewish partisan by Tuvia in the forest. And then there was the matter, mentioned earlier, of Yehuda’s dead teenage sister back in Novogrudek. According to Yehuda and the letter his father sent to his three sons in New York, Tuvia was involved in that heinous incident. So Lola and her family remained aloof, and contact was kept to a minimum in Israel and later in America." http://www.jewishpress.com/indepth/front-page/the-cousins-bielski/2008/11/19/ ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 19:27
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Mosquito, you have attempted to suggest hidden motives time and again, and not just on this thread but on others against people from certain ethnic groups. On its own to call it rhetoric. However my case to do so is strongly bolstered by the fact that at times you have been shown to use questionable material. Hardly “facts” or verifiable when you think about it are they, Mosquito?
Yawn! Irrelevant, Mosquito, religion is always equal to ethnicity, but in no way does this answer my question as to why you're highlighting the issue of religion/ethnicity as an adjective for the purposes of this thread. So answer me, Mosquito, why? ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 19:37
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I was talking about US elections and D. Trump. You are now talking about completely different things.
However when I was looking more on Bielski brother I found interesting article about one of the brothers, who didnt change much since the times he was living in the forest: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-495420/Jewish-hero-rescued-Jews-Nazis-charged-conning-Holocaust-survivor.html ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 19:45
Because there was always a group of Jewish citisens in every country where they lived who were a separate nation within a host nation. And they always cared for their interests more than for the interests of their countries. Their religion teach them to treat their people in better way than other people who can be exploited by them. Thats why they influenced US goverment to give them huge bailouts at the expense of American tax payers. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 19:49
Mosquito, if you're in any way intelligent enough to prove such a claim then do so! I await your proof. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:04
In what way has this to do with what you were suggesting, Mosquito? ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:06
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loans_and_interest_in_Judaism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_banking#Judaism "The Torah and later sections of the Hebrew Bible criticize interest-taking, but interpretations of the Biblical prohibition vary. One common understanding is that Jews are forbidden to charge interest upon loans made to other Jews, but obliged to charge interest on transactions with non-Jews, or Gentiles. Israelites were forbidden to charge interest on loans made to other Israelites, but allowed to charge interest on transactions with non-Israelites.... " ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:11
Yehuda Bielski after coming to Israel broke relations with Tuvie Bielski and Bro's because Tuvie murdered Jewish partisant and also was somehow involved in "heinous incident" in which died Yehuda's sister. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:16
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Not exactly true is it though, Mosquito? Again you're caught out trying to twist facts to suit your case. In 1945 due to many attacks on ethnic groups including those with German or Jewish names, because of the war and false claims of property reclamation the Polish National Council issued a name change decree in order to reduce these racial attacks. Millions of people changed their names. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:24
Attacks on them? Stalinist officials who were terrorising the whole country? Those Jews from Security Services who tortured, imprisoned and killed hundrieds thousands of people were afraid so much because had Jewish names? Natan Grünspan changed his name because lived in fear? The fact that commies who were going to rule Poland had mostly not Polish names had nothing to do with it? ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:35
------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:42
All women which wanted to be "saved" by Bielski brothers had to show themselves naked in front of all them. Then they were picking the best looking ones and forcing them to sex. Tuvie has already created a big harem for himself. Those who refused were being raped, especialy when Tuvie and his officers were drunk and they were drunk almost every night. Thats the story which wasnt in Hollywood movie. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:50
2.6 million Polish Jews changed their names! How on Earth can you claim they changed their names because they were so few? Rediculous! Attacks on them yes, and well documented by the same historian you quoted earlier amongst many with an upper estimate of 2000 Jewish fatalities at the time. The Polish Jewish names you quoted are all detestable creatures for sure, but you're not telling me they were the only Polish nationals involved with the soviet regime, and yet you would rather point the finger at other ethnic groups than look at your own and ponder their motivations. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 10-Apr-2016 at 20:58
Again please, Mosquito, your links as confirmation. What I have heard of Tuvia, to the consternation of his wife, was he was very much the lady's man with a huge number of non Jewish Polish women lining up for a good bit of this heroic figure. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 06:07
https://stopsyjonizmowi.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/bielski-pomagac3a9-c2acydom-ale-te-z-ich-wykorzystywac3a9.pdf EG - survivor from Bielski's camp, Jozef Marchwiński writes that ( he wrote in Polish, I have translated it myself into english): "Tuvia Bielski managed not only all the Jews in the camp, but also quite numerous and lovely harem - like King Saud of Saudi Arabia (...) a large group of beautiful women constantly surrounded Tevia Bielski and his brothers. Beauties which didnt know the hunger.They were always beautifully dressed and on their hands and necks were glowing expensive jewels and gems, their white hands didnt know the work." According to Leslie Bell, her mother Lola, wife of Yehuda Bielski, cousin of brothers Bielski, like all the women who were coming to the camp, had to take part in dissgusting ritual, undress in the front of all the men and give them her underwear. As for the reasons why the family of Yehuda broke relations with Bielski's brother, I found explanation in the above article. It seems that Tuvie has killed Yehuda's sister, long before the war. It doesnt mean that Tuvia wasnt a hero. He did save 1200 people. But during the war the people were not always definately evil or good, some were in between. Tuvia did help many people to survive but also exploited them. He also took part in actions against Polish Home Army, together with his Soviet firends, with whom he was also drinking a lot and Soviets valued Tuvia for being able to drink more than most of them. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 15:23
Must I tell you again, Mosquito, really??? If I tell you your link is to a site who are anti-Semitic Holocaust-denying New World Order conspiracy theorists, does that sound like a reliable source in any way or form? ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 16:06
I dont care for the site. In this case they have used the article of the historian whom I know and who is reliable. I have partly confirmed his claim by the article in Jewish Press which I have found and post the link here. The fact that someone who is not reliable is using materials of someone who is reliable, when it fits to his theories, doesnt make the second one not reliable. In the article the author gives names and also tells where are the documents which he has used. Piotr Zychowicz is a young famous in Poland historian of the new generation, known for writing controversial books. He has written several bestsellers including: "Madness 44" about Warsaw Rising, criticising Polish underground for starting uprising, "Ribbentrop-Back Pact" - in which he describes Polish - German relations between 1919 and 1939, suggesting that Poland should have joined 3rd Reich instead of fighting against it and after USA joined the war it should have betray Germany and change sides. And "Pilsudski-Lenin Pact or how the Poles saved bolsheviks" - which criticise Polish goverment for signing peace with Soviet Russia in 1921. 
 ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:03
Mosquito, if you don't care for the obviously anti-Semitic racist site then why on Earth did you think it would be alright to use it? Partly confirmed, is not confirmed, and stretched truth is little better, and that's all you've shown here in all of these posts put together side tracking away from the OP. Your Polish historian, Piotr Zychowicz, imagines it is possible to divorce the actions of the Third Reich in order to make an alliance? If so, and I don't say this about many, he's a fool, and what's more a dangerous fool. This kind of idiot is one step away from the apologist of atrocities, and would have sold out many of those fighting on their own side. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:12
You didnt read the book but already commented it? For your information, the allies of Germany in Europe were: Italy, Vichy France, Finland, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria. They all changed sides during the war. And in Poland allied with Germany for sure wouldnt die as many Polish citisens of all nationalisties as died in German and Soviet occuppied Poland. When a country is between Germany and Russia it cant fight against both because it end in disaster, and such disaster happend in my country. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:17
The difference, Mosquito, is that this idiot, Piotr Zychowicz, is putting out the idea after the fact, after the atrocities. A totally mind-blowing disregard to reality. Think about it for a second. The Polish death camp would have been actually Polish death camps.
 ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:23
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Reality is that my country lost 6 million people and was completelly obliterated. Italians lost only 450.000, Hungary 380.000, Finland 100.000.
If just one more million could have surivived, such alliance would have been worth trying. And probably there would have survive much more. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:24
Most likely there would have been no death camps in Poland at all. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:30
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And btw - if the USA and UK could have allied with equaly evil Soviet Union, we could have allied with Germany. Why do you see the evil only on the other side? ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:36
If you could turn a blind eye to the Nazis and become allies who knows what you would turn a blind eye to, Mosquito. It's a very slippery slope indeed. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:42
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Poland would have on the eastern front over a million of soldiers including Jews, fighting together with Germans against the Soviets. Germany wouldnt be able to dictate anything. Just like it wasnt able to dictate anything to Mussolini and Italians. Polish territory would be only a transit route for Germans, they wouldnt be able to do anything. Unlike in occupied Poland where they could have do whatever they wanted. The state canb protect its citisens only when exists and control its territory, not when is under enemy occupation.
Zychowicz also shows as example the case of cristal night in Germany. During incidents in Munchen Polish citisen who was a Jew was murdered by SA. Under preassure of Polish goverment Germans had to start investigation and make trial of SA-man who murdered him. The fact is that Poland is not a small country like Slovakia or Hungary. The Germans wouldnt be able to do anything without starting the war. They didnt want the war with Italy and for sure wouldnt start the war against its ally - Poland. ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:45
Somehow I think you're missing the point here. My guess is that the confirmation bias is well and truly engrained in your beliefs, but I shall endeavour. The point is here that even if I look back as an observer I don't see an evil regime hell bent on the final solution when looking at the Soviet Union. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 17:59
It started a war with the Soviet Union its ally at the time and they were far more powerful than you. Obvious really otherwise this little idea wouldn't be on the table. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 18:01
Mu guess is that your bias and beliefs comes from your lack of knowledge. Hollywood movies taught you that Germans were evil and Soviets were good guys and your allies. Did you ever heard that all my countrymen in Soviet Union before the war died in Soviet planned "final solution" known as Polish operation and that it happend before WW2? But I know that Jewish life for people like you is much more valuable than the Polish one. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Operation_of_the_NKVD_%281937%E2%80%9338%29 "The Operation was only a peak in the persecution of the Poles, which spanned more than a decade. As the Soviet statistics indicate, the number of ethnic Poles in the USSR dropped by 165,000 in that period. "It is estimated that Polish losses in the Ukrainian SSR were about 30%, while in the Belorussian SSR... the Polish minority was almost completely annihilated."Historian Michael Ellman asserts that the 'national operations', particularly the 'Polish operation', may constitute genocide as defined by the UN convention.His opinion is shared by Simon Sebag Montefiore, who calls the Polish operation of the NKVD 'a mini-genocide.'Polish writer and commentator, Dr Tomasz Sommer, also refers to the operation as a genocide, along with Prof. Marek Jan Chodakiewicz among others. Statistical extrapolation, wrote Jasiński, increases the number of Polish victims in 1937–1938 to around 200–250,000 depending on size of their families." ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 19:11
Your guess would be incorrect, Mosquito. The Soviets, in general, were not considered as heroes here, and much of my knowledge came from documentaries such as the famous series The World At War. [TUBE]m0mrOeJwXBI?list=PLYbocufkwRFBhtNDnrrsd3_tpgGCJNe27&related[/TUBE] As for the Polish Operation, I had known of its existence, yes, and would agree to it being an evil act. However, Mosquito, I can't ever remember it also being called a final solution like The Holocaust. My impression was that it was a purge of Soviet lands. I would have thought the Soviets allying with Polish partisans was a good indication that might have be the case. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |
Posted By: Mosquito
Date Posted: 11-Apr-2016 at 19:35
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Oh they were considered heroes, it has changed just during cold war. During the war your goverment was hiding all the facts about Soviet criminal regime which wasnt any better than Nazist 3rd Reich and most likely even worse if one take into consideration the number of murdered people.
And it doesnt matter how one calls his murderous activity, final solution, Polish or German operation. So dont tell me how evil one would have become if he had allied with the Germans against the Soviets. FDR was shaking hands with his dear friend Stalin so lets avoid double standards. [TUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcZNTtHOswg[/TUBE] ------------- "I am a pure-blooded Polish nobleman, without a single drop of bad blood, certainly not German blood" - Friedrich Nietzsche |
Posted By: TheAlaniDragonRising
Date Posted: 12-Apr-2016 at 06:11
Then you would have been fine being allied with the Nazis, Mosquito, with their belief that the Slavs were an inferior race? Oh yes and there's the little matter of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact with its secret clause which basically had the Soviets being invited into Poland by the Germans in order to divide it up between them. Then, of course, there would have been Danzig.... I get the impression the term naive as well as idiotic goes to that revisionist historian you seem to admire. Oh and yes, Mosquito, it would be nice if you didn't dip into what I can only describe as a Nazi/Far right-wing stockpile to spread your filth on this forum. Your filth because you identify with it or you wouldn't use it. As for the first part of your post. I would like to see evidence(again not from the Nazi stockpile) from a reliable source. The not disclosing of material which might result in the lowering of moral in war time is normal. However, I would be interested as a matter of interest, and for my great respect for the Polish nation, for you to show me evidence of British media at the time hearing of the events of the Polish operation. FDR shaking hands with his allies was for public consumption. I believe it is well known that the allies had little time for each other. As for double standards, they were working with what they had at the time, and without graphic images...etc.... Whereas we are talking here in retrospect which makes all the difference in the world. ------------- What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture. |