Kipchak legacy
Printed From: History Community ~ All Empires
Category: Regional History or Period History
Forum Name: Ethnic History of Central Asia
Forum Discription: Discussions about the ethnic origins of Central Asian peoples. All topics related to ethnicity should go here.
URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=26071
Printed Date: 24-Apr-2024 at 08:35
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.56a - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Kipchak legacy
Posted By: calvo
Subject: Kipchak legacy
Date Posted: 06-Dec-2008 at 18:47
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The Kipchak khanate dominated the western steppe over a vast terroritory that stretched from Kazakhstan to Ukraine, but little has been documented about them apart from and odd few Russian accounts. After the Mongol conquest, the Kipchaks absorbed the conquerors into their ethnicity and they ruled the Golden Horde together, which was sometimes refered to as the "Kipchak khanate". were the Kipchaks pure nomads or were they sedentary, like the Bulgars? Are all modern-day nations that speak the Kipchak dialect of Turkic: Tatars, Bashkirs, Kazakhs, and Uzbeks descendant nations of the Kipchak? Could any of these nation actually trace their orgins to a Kipchak horde? Many Kipchaks also migrated to Eastern Europe, and there are theories that Balkan Turks could be descended from Kipchaks and Pechenegs rather than the later Ottomans; although there is no proof.
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Replies:
Posted By: Temujin
Date Posted: 06-Dec-2008 at 19:02
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Uzbeks speak a language of the Chaghatay branch, not Qypchaq. Qazaqs do descend mostly from Qypchaqs and also Chinggizid Mongols. Uzbeks though, also include Qypchaqs. |
Posted By: Evrenosgazi
Date Posted: 07-Dec-2008 at 09:35
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The Kıpchak`s are really interesting. They had dominated the western steppes for 300 years. Their millitary potential was crucial at that time. Kıpchaks were the one who had save byzantine empire from the patzinaks(Battle of Leuvounion 1091 I think). They were the trigger of the rising georgian power in the 12th century. Celaleddin Harezmshah`s army were mostly composed of Kıpchaks and this soldiers fight against mongols, seljuks, ayyubids, crusaders etc.. Byzantine`s, hungarians, bulgarians and habsburgs used them as valueable mercenaries.The eygptian states used them as military slaves(Baybars, Kutuz etc).This was the short summary of their millitary history.
The other interesting part is they spread so diversely that today their genes are circulating in most of the world. They were assimilated by different nations(Hungarians, Romanians, Bulgarians, Russians, Georgians, central asia nations, Turkey). I think that Kıpchaks subject needs much more research
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Posted By: calvo
Date Posted: 07-Dec-2008 at 11:26
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Were the Kipchaks a loose confederation of tribes united by the same language and customs, or were they a single state?
Could the Crimean Tatars considered to be a direct derivation of the Kipchaks?
The Volga Tatars claim to be derived from Bulgars rather than Kipchaks, yet their language is clearly Kipchak.
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Posted By: Bulldog
Date Posted: 07-Dec-2008 at 14:10
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An interesting but often forgotten legacy of the Kipchaks is their role in protecting Georgia, in the 11th Century 40 thousand Kipchak families were invited to Georgia with an agreement made that each family would train one soldier to fight for Georgia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kipchaks_in_Georgia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kipchaks_in_Georgia
P.s Calvo, read up on the "Dest-i Kipchak" it was the Kipchaks state. ------------- What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal. Albert Pine |
Posted By: Sarmat
Date Posted: 07-Dec-2008 at 16:07
It was rather a loose confederation. Crimean Tatars themselves are divided into 3 groups: Nogais, Tats, and city Tatars. While Nogais would the most who are related to Nomadic Kipchaks, the other 2 groups are heavily mixed with Greeks, Goths, Italians and Anatolian Turks. ------------- Σαυρομάτης 
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Posted By: Temujin
Date Posted: 07-Dec-2008 at 20:07
how is that a contradiction? Balkan Bulgarians speak a slavic language. |
Posted By: calvo
Date Posted: 08-Dec-2008 at 12:11
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The first generation of Mamluks in Egypt were also Kipchak prisoners. Their tactics were calvary based and heavily influenced by the steppes.
There "Kipchak" identity did not last much longer because later they became assimilated into Egyptian society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mamluk_identity - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mamluk_identity
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Posted By: Sarmat
Date Posted: 08-Dec-2008 at 13:16
One of the theories claims that the famous sultan, Beybars originates from a Kipchak tribe which survived up to our times in a Kazakh clan "Berish." ------------- Σαυρομάτης
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Posted By: Evrenosgazi
Date Posted: 08-Dec-2008 at 13:46
| They were mercenaries. They had fought for Mongols, Muslims, Russians, Byzantines, Balkan nations. I think the historians ignore this subject. My friends do you know any book about the kıpchaks? |
Posted By: Batu
Date Posted: 08-Dec-2008 at 21:39
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Codex Cumanicus is your answer Evrenosgazi.Kipchaks are also called Cumans.Codex Cumanicus was written by Venetians,I guess.
------------- A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari ) |
Posted By: Bulldog
Date Posted: 10-Dec-2008 at 15:42
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Pollitical history or Kipchaks
http://www.ozturkler.com/data_english/0001/0001_14_02_2.htm - http://www.ozturkler.com/data_english/0001/0001_14_02_2.htm ------------- What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal. Albert Pine |
Posted By: toyomotor
Date Posted: 11-Feb-2014 at 01:02
The Kipchaks NEVER absorbed the Mongols, rather they joined the Mongol White Horde which was raiding further and further into Central and Western Europe.
The Kipchaks were originally nomadic. Some fought alongside the Cumans as mercenaries for some of the Russian States.
The Kipchak Federation ended officially in about 1220, before the rise of the Mongols.
The modern Northwestern branch of the Turkic languages is often referred to as the Kipchak branch. The languages in this branch are mostly considered to be descendants of the Kipchak language, and the people who speak them may likewise be referred to as Kipchak peoples. Some of the groups traditionally included are the Siberian Tatars, Nogays. ------------- |