Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Pakistani Identity
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 8910
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Tiggs View Drop Down
Immortal Guard
Immortal Guard
Avatar

Joined: 25-Feb-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0 		  Quote Tiggs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Pakistani Identity
    Posted: 11-Aug-2007 at 15:37
Quite a bit of those Indus Valley Civilization era excavations come from the banks of saraswati river. Indus Valley Civilization is sort of a misnomer now. It should be called Indus/saraswati basin civilization.

http://www.ias.ac.in/currsci/oct25/articles20.htm
Back to Top
SpartaN117 View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai
Avatar

Joined: 10-Dec-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 120 		  Quote SpartaN117 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Aug-2007 at 17:29
The Civilisation is based around the Indus Valley. i.e Harappa and Mohenjo Daro. The reason for this name change proposed by India is very vague and based on very poor evidence imo.


Edited by SpartaN117 - 14-Aug-2007 at 17:32

PakHub.Info
Reclaiming Pakistans Identity
Join Us
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Aug-2007 at 01:39
Agreed. S Asia is a multicultural area. And several civilisations grew uo here, The Gangatic plain had it own civilisation. So did S India.
Back to Top
pumaaa123 View Drop Down
Knight
Knight


Joined: 31-May-2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 80 		  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2007 at 05:14

Its cant be a claim but it is what history getting perfected. It is like how in early days the world was first believed to be a flat surface. Later it was understood that the earth is round in shape. Further it was perfected to what it is understood now. The process is same that is actually the lifeline of history.

 

Before first dig out was carried out while British India none had any good idea about such one civilization. But when it was initially discovered, most of the sites were located alongside of Indus thus getting the name by it. But further studies revealed the sites being in Punjab, Rajasthan, Hariyana, Gujrat of todays indian side and even stretching its fingers to todays Mumbai, Afghan and Iran. Moreover the dead river tracks of saraswathi, which was main source for the civilization has given a node for further more revision over the civilization. These upcoming studies may tell why the civilization suddenly underwent a change being so big functioning like a modern-day state and so shall drive ahead to rename it according to the newer find outs.

 

Telling that people within a region had their own respective civilizations in nothing to do with history or any systematic study. Civilizations dont happen in that way.
Back to Top
MarcoPolo View Drop Down
Pretorian
Pretorian
Avatar

Joined: 05-Jul-2007
Location: Planet Earth
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 190 		  Quote MarcoPolo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2007 at 11:25
I dont see why there is a need to 'hijack' a cultural legacy which is based on the river Indus and lies in another country.  To do so is a distortion of facts and goes against all scientific norms.  The indus lies directly in the centre of Pakistan, hence its a Pakistan specific ancient civilization.  This argument against this fact is getting futile. 
Many ancient empires where based in one specific area and then exerted considerable influence to surrounding and far flung areas.  I dont see Afghanistan, or Iran trying to force the issue that Indus belongs to them when they equally ruled or were joined with the Pakistan region for extended periods of time as well as have ancient ruins associated with the Indus civilization(The trans indus region was the richest satrap of the Persian empire).  When identifying an ancient civilization one commonly sources its origin to where it was based and originated from, which in the case of the Indus Civilization is Pakistan.
To argue otherwise does not make any sense, particularly when using evidence based on mythology, hearsay,  and purported satelite imagery to prove the possible existance of another river which currently does not exist and 'may' have existed.  There is nothing more to say about this.
 
 
 
 
Back to Top
SpartaN117 View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai
Avatar

Joined: 10-Dec-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 120 		  Quote SpartaN117 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Aug-2007 at 18:38
Originally posted by pumaaa123

Its cant be a claim but it is what history getting perfected. It is like how in early days the world was first believed to be a flat surface. Later it was understood that the earth is round in shape. Further it was perfected to what it is understood now. The process is same that is actually the lifeline of history.

 

Before first dig out was carried out while British India none had any good idea about such one civilization. But when it was initially discovered, most of the sites were located alongside of Indus thus getting the name by it. But further studies revealed the sites being in Punjab, Rajasthan, Hariyana, Gujrat of todays indian side and even stretching its fingers to todays Mumbai, Afghan and Iran. Moreover the dead river tracks of saraswathi, which was main source for the civilization has given a node for further more revision over the civilization. These upcoming studies may tell why the civilization suddenly underwent a change being so big functioning like a modern-day state and so shall drive ahead to rename it according to the newer find outs.

 

Telling that people within a region had their own respective civilizations in nothing to do with history or any systematic study. Civilizations dont happen in that way.



Sorry but I dont agree with your perception of things. Consider this. The people of Pakistan have ALWAYS lived in the region of Pakistan for as far as written records go. Human Migration to South Asia happened 30 000 years ago. IVC existed only 5000 years ago. India and Pakistan by this time were inhabited.
You are assuming a mass migration happened? On what grounds? Any Evidence? And shouldnt the people have rebuilt equally great cities like Harappa and Mohenjo daro in South India?

PakHub.Info
Reclaiming Pakistans Identity
Join Us
Back to Top
pumaaa123 View Drop Down
Knight
Knight


Joined: 31-May-2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 80 		  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Aug-2007 at 06:28
 

Theres no Harappa or Mohanjo-daro down south because no civilization existed there.

 

Moreover, pl do go thru my post. Then add this. Physically the so-called Indus civilization lies between todays India and Pakistan.

 

According to last archaeological study, over 500 sites have been discovered along the dried-up beds of the Ghaggar-Saraswati River and its tributaries, higher than of along the Indus. Illustrative Maps below:
 
 
 
And it is not a claim over a land or territory.  As todays Indian populace from the civilization still follow their culture and rituals taught there, the heritage fit in first to them. To least, it is a shared heritage.
 
Back to Top
dubai View Drop Down
Janissary
Janissary


Joined: 10-Aug-2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28 		  Quote dubai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Aug-2007 at 14:44
^ indus valley civilization was based in the indus river, just like the egyptian was based on the nile. Most of what is india today was not part of it
Back to Top
SpartaN117 View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai
Avatar

Joined: 10-Dec-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 120 		  Quote SpartaN117 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Aug-2007 at 22:33
Originally posted by pumaaa123

 
And it is not a claim over a land or territory.  As todays Indian populace from the civilization still follow their culture and rituals taught there, the heritage fit in first to them. To least, it is a shared heritage.
 


I am sorry, but how on Earth do you know that???

Nothing is known about the people of Indus Valley. Why do you insist on passing your own hypothesis as established facts?

Nobody knows if they died, or moved. I am frankly amazed at all the conclusions out there based on nothing but opinions.

PakHub.Info
Reclaiming Pakistans Identity
Join Us
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 8910

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.