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Islamic culture and European Renaissance
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Beylerbeyi View Drop Down
Chieftain
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Posts: 1355 		  Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Islamic culture and European Renaissance
    Posted: 29-Mar-2006 at 15:04

Were there "scientists" in the modern sense of the term in ancient times?

No. That's why I called them philosophers.

I can't sum up Russo's book now, you have to read it if you are interested in this matter .

I would have if I had the time. 

Surely his thesis is controversial and not generally full accepted yet, but the simple statement that there was some kind of experimental science in hellenistic world is far less controversial.

There may be instances, but general character of Hellenistic 'natural philosophy' (proto-science) lacks experimentation.   

Nota bene: when we talk of hellenistic world the term "hellenistic" is used in a cultural not ethnic sense. There were "hellenistic" scientists from all over hellenistic kingdoms and from any ethnical group.

Yes, I use the term in the same way.

Finally this is a very short and incomplete list of hellenistic scientists well known to have performed some kind of experiments: Herophilus and Erasistratus in medicine, Archimedes, Hipparchus and Ctesibius in Phisics, Hero in Optics.

I am not sure what you consider 'experiments'. I am not really an expert on this era (or the Islamic one) but Hipparchus was an astronomer, wasn't he? What experiment did he do I wonder? Observation and modelling are not experimenting.
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Leonardo View Drop Down
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Posts: 778 		  Quote Leonardo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Mar-2006 at 15:47

 

No. That's why I called them philosophers.

So you are not up-to-date

 

I would have if I had the time. 

This is lame excuse

There may be instances, but general character of Hellenistic 'natural philosophy' (proto-science) lacks experimentation.   

This proofs that you don't know what are you talking about .

In fact, the hellenistic one was not a "natural philosophy" but, on the contrary, in many instances it was against natural philosophy, in particular against the natural philosophy of Aristoteles (this is well explained in the book of Russo ...).

I am not sure what you consider 'experiments'. I am not really an expert on this era (or the Islamic one) but Hipparchus was an astronomer, wasn't he? What experiment did he do I wonder? Observation and modelling are not experimenting.

 

You are right, Hipparchus was mainly an astronomer and one of the biggest ever lived. But he performed also some experiments in the field of gravitational Physics. Unfortunely all his works but one are lost and what we know about his scientific researches derives from secundary sources. In particular we know from the Greek philosopher Philoponus (who lived centuries after Hipparchus) that Hipparchus anticipated G. Galilei in his researches on falling bodies.

For more informations you have to read the book of Russo  

 

 



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Beylerbeyi View Drop Down
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Posts: 1355 		  Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Mar-2006 at 15:58

Don't push it, mate. Unlike you I am not claiming I am an expert because I read one book on the subject. Maybe you should read other books before making up your mind.



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Leonardo View Drop Down
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Posts: 778 		  Quote Leonardo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Mar-2006 at 16:07
Originally posted by Beylerbeyi

Don't push it, mate. Unlike you I am not claiming I am an expert because I read one book on the subject. Maybe you should read other books before making up your mind.

 

I don't claim either, but I have read more than one book on the subject



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