A new era of islamic calvinism??

Originally posted by ill_teknique - the sunna was written and composed by mortal fallible individuals who are no more special than anyone else why would not some of them be deviating from their original version.  And even al bukhari was a human being that might've been able to make a mistake.  The sunna is there for examples not to be prior to the qu'ran

I am not religious but I was born and baptized Christian Orthodox. Without wanting to offend anyone, let me say this: I have lost my conviction in monotheism. All three monotheistic religions (Christianity, Judaism, and Islam) carry within the seed of their own destruction which is this: that they are intolerant of others and all carry the element of forceful conversion which leads to persecution and war.
If anything, I am tending to side with the Nestorian heresy of the old days which claimed that the godhead is way too complex to be comprehended by our own miniscule human minds and one should focus on one's own personal being in order to attain enlightment. In other words, God is reachable and attainable indivindually by each one of us without the "assistance" of organized religion. But this would jeopardize the comfortable living that muftis, rabbis, and bishops have set up for themselves at the expense of the rest of society for  well over a thousand  years now so the status qvo  remains as is.

On Turkey:
Turkey will become more Islamisized only over the dead body of the Turkish military, proud safe keepers of the Kemalist ideals. I believe that  the sociological seed for  Turkey's  Islamic radicalization is there, but it will have to fight against the Kemalist establishment in order to survive. The military is the true power in Turkey, politically as well as economically. The military has replaced traditional Islamic dogmas with a hardcore, potent nationalism that puts the nation first and religion, well, somewhere back there. I don't see this changing in the next decade, sort of a  domestic Islamic uprising that the military would crush anyway.

Turkey will become more Islamisized only over the dead body of the Turkish military, proud safe keepers of the Kemalist ideals. I believe that  the sociological seed for  Turkey's  Islamic radicalization is there, but it will have to fight against the Kemalist establishment in order to survive. The military is the true power in Turkey, politically as well as economically.

Originally posted by sedamoun It's impossible to live exactly like during Mohamed's time (what the Talibans want). Christianity has evolved, just like Islam and Judaism since their creation.

Nice Shot! But nevertheless, by performing the hajj, one entails to an endless past of sins forgiven, just by swarming around the kabaa 7 times and kissing a rock which could possible be a meteorite from heaven as the legend fortails.

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim How So Omar? Care to elaborate on your statment please! In some religions the clergy has a direct say in your afterlife. Must be in communion with the church, or must be buired on church land etc. Islam rejects these ideas. The only person who can affect you state is yourself. Its your actions and your beliefs that will be judged. Not the opinions of a priest. There is you, there is God and no-one inbetween.

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim. I haven't heard that before. Do you have a quote from Quran? Even then, its God doing the forgiving not the clergy. Would you agree.. No, not really. Selling forgiveness at a price, is not the same as spending money to get to Hajj. Well, I suppose it depends on the motives of that person actually, but since only God is a judge of our intentions we get back to the no intercessors between you and God part. [/QUOTE       Its the same! $5000 spent to live in luxury while performing tawab. The more  money you have, the more sins forgiven. Why? Because those with a huge salary will be able to perform hajj on a yearly basis, compared to those who are poor and destitute.

Edited by DocStaph - 08-Sep-2006 at 19:47

Originally posted by DocStaph Its the same! $5000 spent to live in luxury while performing tawab. The more  money you have, the more sins forgiven. Why? Because those with a huge salary will be able to perform hajj on a yearly basis, compared to those who are poor and destitute.

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim Originally posted by DocStaph Its the same! $5000 spent to live in luxury while performing tawab. The more  money you have, the more sins forgiven. Why? Because those with a huge salary will be able to perform hajj on a yearly basis, compared to those who are poor and destitute. Sorry, doesn't work like that. Hajj is only compulsory if you can afford it, if you can't your excused and the only judge to whether you can afford it? God.

Originally posted by DocStaph Do you live by the words of the Quran?