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yan.
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Topic: The scourge of god Posted: 15-Apr-2005 at 17:10 |
Who was it? Attila or Genghis Khan - or none of them?
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Feramez
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Posted: 15-Apr-2005 at 20:25 |
The Europeans gave that title to Atilla.
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Tobodai
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Posted: 16-Apr-2005 at 22:40 |
No actually I am pretty sure the title was originally given to Timur Lenk by Christopher Marlowe, and then much later after that it was erroneously applied to Atilla.
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"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
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yan.
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Posted: 17-Apr-2005 at 08:56 |
On the web it seems like Timur is said to have called himself 'the scourge of god' in Damascus, while Genghis is said to have said something like "I am the scourge of God. If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me." in Bukhara.
The second "quote" looks clearly like european wishful thinking. Just wondering what the primary source for that speech is.
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Posted: 17-Apr-2005 at 16:03 |
ATTILA was the scourge of god
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Feramez
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Posted: 17-Apr-2005 at 23:10 |
That speech is known to be by Cengiz Han, but not with the scourge of god part you put in the begining. I'm just about 100% sure Atilla was the scourge of god.
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yan.
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Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 04:27 |
Originally posted by Feramez
That speech is known to be by Cengiz Han, but not with the scourge of god part you put in the begining. |
By what source?
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Feramez
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Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 11:40 |
Who knows? I don't remember every source I look into. This is something that I just know. You asked a question, I answered with full confidence in my answer, believe it or don't believe it, that's up to you.
Edited by Feramez
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yan.
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Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 13:54 |
Could it have been Juvaini? Really just courious, maybe I'll try and find out by myself tomorrow : ) .
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Feramez
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Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 22:52 |
What's Juvaini?
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Imperator Invictus
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Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 22:59 |
Chingiz Qaan called himself the "Flail of God," not the Scourge of God, according to one translation of his quotes.
I think Attila's Scourge of God title comes from a 16th century
medalion, which may have gotten it from somewhere else. I don't think
he was called by that earlier.
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Scytho-Sarmatian
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 04:35 |
Did the Romans have any nickname for Attila? Or, was he just referred to as Attila?
"Excuse me for living, Attila."
--Line from a T.V. show I saw years ago.
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 06:56 |
Originally posted by Scytho-Sarmatian
"Excuse me for living, Attila."
--Line from a T.V. show I saw years ago.
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Should continue as
" .....and excuse me speaking to you like my existence is not enough."
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Imperator Invictus
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 12:30 |
Did the Romans have any nickname for Attila? Or, was he just referred to as Attila? |
No, just Attila Rex Hunnorum
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Temujin
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 13:54 |
Originally posted by Tobodai
No actually I am pretty sure the title was originally given to Timur Lenk by Christopher Marlowe, and then much later after that it was erroneously applied to Atilla. |
correct.
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yan.
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 14:10 |
Originally posted by Imperator Invictus
Chingiz Qaan called himself the "Flail of God," not the Scourge of God, according to one translation of his quotes.
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What's the correct english translation of 'flagellum dei' (Attila's purported byname) then? Not flail of god as well?
Juvaini used to be governor of Bagdad, a long time ago. And he seems indeed to be the primary source for that "god sent me to punish you" quote.
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Imperator Invictus
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 16:10 |
flagellum -i n. [a whip , scourge; the thong of a javelin; a
young sprout, vine-shoot]; plur. [the arms of a polypus]; fig., [the
sting of conscience].
Dei means "of God"
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yan.
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 16:51 |
Originally posted by Imperator Invictus
flagellum -i n. [a whip , scourge; the thong of a javelin; a young sprout, vine-shoot]; plur. [the arms of a polypus]; fig., [the sting of conscience].
Dei means "of God"
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I suspected flagellum could be translated into flail as well, but I am somewhat ignorant on such details. Anyway, the more important question would be whether what Juvaini wrote in Persian really translates to flail rather than scourge.
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opuslola
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Posted: 23-Aug-2010 at 19:11 |
What a wonderful claptrap of bull!
As an example from the above post;
"Originally posted by Imperator Invictus
flagellum -i n. [a whip , scourge; the thong of a javelin; a young sprout, vine-shoot]; plur. [the arms of a polypus]; fig., [the sting of conscience].
Dei means "of God"
I suspected flagellum could be translated into flail as well, but I am somewhat ignorant on such details. Anyway, the more important question would be whether what Juvaini wrote in Persian really translates to flail rather than scourge."
It seems most obvious to me that to "flail" would be an alternative word for "scourge!" Actually I would suggest that when one takes the decision to punish ones body, then one would use a "flail" or "Whip" or a "cat o'nine tales", etc., to beat their own bodies, and the after math of such a beating are the scars, which would, in my humble opinion, merely be called the "Scorge!"
But, as always, I could well be wrong, since I did not look up a single word!
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p,c,ma
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Posted: 10-Sep-2010 at 18:05 |
The name the scourge of god was given to Atilla by the church to explain why Rome could not beat them, and god did not protect them. So they said he was a punishment for their sins.
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