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opuslola
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Topic: 'HUMAN' MIGRATION Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 13:06 |
TGS wrote;
"Also, as cryptic mentioned, homo sapiens were not the only intelligent beings on the planet. Neanthertals and the recently discovered "hobbit" species were two different non-human intelligent beings that went extinct."
While most people believe the above to be true, not all experts believe it! There is a rather large group that believes that the Neanderthal actually merged with Homo Sapiens!
More information can be found at some of the following sites;
http://www.google.com/search?q=neanderthal+merged+with+homo+sapiens&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7SUNA
Regards,
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medenaywe
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Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 13:11 |
But we are talking about "when it happens"...How is ,i beleive ,complex mix of doers...and the timing is also essential... http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Healthday/story?id=4506938&page=1 But we need date.year. when first ape "decide" to be human...Like scouts honest...will not hung on trees anymore..
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Cryptic
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Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 15:26 |
Originally posted by opuslola
TGS wrote; "Also, as cryptic mentioned, homo sapiens were not the only intelligent beings on the planet. Neanthertals and the recently discovered "hobbit" species were two different non-human intelligent beings that went extinct."
While most people believe the above to be true, not all experts believe it! There is a rather large group that believes that the Neanderthal actually merged with Homo Sapiens!
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Good point. For years the experts said that there was no chance of humans and Neandertals mixing. Now, new DNA tests suggests that mixing occured. Also there has been a fossil discovery in Spain of a young girl that appears to have both human and Neandertal physical features.
Originally posted by TheGreatSimba
Also, as cryptic mentioned, homo sapiens were not the only intelligent beings on the planet. Neanthertals and the recently discovered "hobbit" species were two different non-human intelligent beings that went extinct.
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As a side note there are signs that Home Erectus lasted alot longer than previously thought. Our ancestors probably also met some Homo Erectus remnant populations in Indonesia and northeren China. It looks like the global "wildman" legends are based on distant fact.
Edited by Cryptic - 13-Nov-2010 at 15:42
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TheGreatSimba
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Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 15:34 |
I dont think there is any real solid evidence to suggest that Neanderthals and humans interbred, and if they did, their offspring probably would not have been able to reproduce (much like how a horse and a donkey can produce a mule, but mules themselves cannot reproduce).
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I use CAPS for emphasis, not yelling. Just don't want to have to click the bold button every time.
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Cryptic
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Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 15:41 |
Originally posted by TheGreatSimba
I dont think there is any real solid evidence to suggest that Neanderthals and humans interbred, and if they did, their offspring probably would not have been able to reproduce (much like how a horse and a donkey can produce a mule, but mules themselves cannot reproduce). |
I think this was the most likely result. Human nature being what it is, I think it is a good bet that some early humans took Neandertal slaves or concubines. Especially as it now appears that the Neandertals were more intelligent (and thus being able to adapt more to human groups) than previously thought.
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medenaywe
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Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 16:19 |
Human communities always expell units that have not match with ordinary member look or behaviour...all mutations good or bad were not always accepted in early tribal communities.And we have to accept that law of incest dates from closest past in our human known history.People that were result of incest and abnormal were expelled from communities...Neandertals and hobbits are part of some evolution but still Is not clear, were they expelled like "unordinary" trials ,that have mixed among themself centuries ago or those types are straight line from very beggining of humanity?We are looking for the links before...People we have homo sapiens for milions of years and deviations on which we have to devalve his existance... And incest like we know today was not always someones will...Lions population was once almost wiped out...and have a "incest" period of reproduction that damages the sperm of lions...they beleive that is reason that they have low reproductive efficiency...
Edited by medenaywe - 13-Nov-2010 at 16:24
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BIG D
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:05 |
Opus, ty---exactly what I intended to get from the post<> more theories to think over...very interesting, also because of the thought of 'when /where/how' were the first 'humans'
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BIG D
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:09 |
Originally posted by TheGreatSimba
I dont think there is any real solid evidence to suggest that Neanderthals and humans interbred, and if they did, their offspring probably would not have been able to reproduce (much like how a horse and a donkey can produce a mule, but mules themselves cannot reproduce). |
I agree, maybe a few interbred, ...I see conflict between them, <> different peoples, as we see in History
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TheGreatSimba
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:09 |
Anyone can come up with a "theory", but is there any evidence to back it up?
I dont think anyone can deny that Humans originated in Africa, the evidence is overwhelming and unmatched by any other theory.
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I use CAPS for emphasis, not yelling. Just don't want to have to click the bold button every time.
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BIG D
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:12 |
Originally posted by medenaywe
Human communities always expell units that have not match with ordinary member look or behaviour...all mutations good or bad were not always accepted in early tribal communities.And we have to accept that law of incest dates from closest past in our human known history.People that were result of incest and abnormal were expelled from communities...Neandertals and hobbits are part of some evolution but still Is not clear, were they expelled like "unordinary" trials ,that have mixed among themself centuries ago or those types are straight line from very beggining of humanity?We are looking for the links before...People we have homo sapiens for milions of years and deviations on which we have to devalve his existance... And incest like we know today was not always someones will...Lions population was once almost wiped out...and have a "incest" period of reproduction that damages the sperm of lions...they beleive that is reason that they have low reproductive efficiency...
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very interesting...does not incest today usually end up in a 'bad' mutation??---
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medenaywe
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:33 |
Yes m8...thats happens also with Dare devil population in Australia...Isolated they have not chances to combine their geenes and were on the edge of wipe out...Hobbits were somewhere on isolated isles of Micronesia/Indonesia...and Neanderthals during the glacial period were separated small group in coastal area...result is same for all...
Edited by medenaywe - 14-Nov-2010 at 10:38
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opuslola
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:44 |
Concerning incest! Actually a lot of it depends upon your definition of incest. There have been studies of some family units, that have practiced a form of incest over several generations whereby there were no regressive traits in appearance.
And if one considers that third and fouth cousins are OK, then there is this study;
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=when-incest-is-best-kissi
Now, as to whether or not long term incest (10 generations or more) might well produce regressive traits is another story?
But, I would suggest that if the original couple carried few or no regressive traits, then there exists the reality that over a number of generations the children of this admixture seems to breed true!
Regards,
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medenaywe
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:47 |
rule rules always,exept if you do not create extraordinary Pitbull,and mix mother Staford geens with his sons..But rest 6 dogs from one birth are always with abnormalities...statistic..
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medenaywe
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 10:55 |
that do not means always bad mutations...white colour once was "abnormal",like picture from cave says that...members with this "abnormalities" were also expelled out of communities.. Invisible part that suffers is immune system...That happens to Dare devil...tasmanian....
Edited by medenaywe - 14-Nov-2010 at 11:08
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opuslola
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 11:46 |
Medenaywe, you wrote;
"that do not means always bad mutations...white colour once was "abnormal",like picture from cave says that...members with this "abnormalities" were also expelled out of communities.."
Your statement above seems to border upon racism!
Is that your aim?
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medenaywe
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 12:01 |
That means that abnormal means mutation,someone that do not match with look and behaviour of majority...unfortunately...but abnormal do not means always that this mutation will not be advance in the future,first bird with wings,look abnormal but...
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medenaywe
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 12:03 |
and about colour...all we have geens of all colours...conditions activate/deactivate them..
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Cryptic
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 21:24 |
Originally posted by opuslola
Medenaywe, you wrote; "that do not means always bad mutations...white colour once was "abnormal",like picture from cave says that...members with this "abnormalities" were also expelled out of communities.."
Your statement above seems to border upon racism!
Is that your aim?
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How is that rascist? It is historical fact. Even today, some tribal peoples in Tanzania expel or kill albinos. As late as WWII, rural Tanzanians viewed Europeans as only partially human (light skin resembled dead people) and believed that the British consumed the blood raised for the war effort. Of course, some Europeans viewed Africans in the same light.
Originally posted by medenaywe
.People that were result of incest and abnormal were expelled from communities...Neandertals and hobbits are part of some evolution but still Is not clear, were they expelled like "unordinary" trials ,that have mixed among themself centuries ago or those types are straight line from very beggining of humanity? |
While human societies regularly expelled unordianry people (one island off of British Columbia was the souce of many bigfoot legends and was used by local tribes as a banishment place for the mentally ill, chronic birth defects, sex deviants etc, Hobbits and Neandertals are on completely seperate evolutionary lines from humans.
As to hypothetical, but highly probable Neandertal - human mixes, I imagine that human reaction varied. Some were expelled, others retained as semi slaves, while others may have been relatively accepted. It probably depended alot on the individual tribe and how human the mixed individual looked.
Edited by Cryptic - 14-Nov-2010 at 23:54
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Sillyduffa
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 23:26 |
They recently drafted the neanderthal genome and found that 1-4% of neanderthal dna can be found in modern humans, with red hair and blue eyes possibly deriving from neanderthals. Here is a link to the press release info http://www.eva.mpg.de/neandertal/index.html
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opuslola
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Posted: 14-Nov-2010 at 23:56 |
Based upon the above (if it is correct?), I then, rest my case! Concerning, that is, my mention that some science believes that the Neanderthals merely were merged into modern mankind!
Regards,
Edited by opuslola - 14-Nov-2010 at 23:59
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