Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

What about a Roma people ("Gipsy") state?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>
Poll Question: Where to etsablish it?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
7 [63.64%]
0 [0.00%]
1 [9.09%]
1 [9.09%]
0 [0.00%]
0 [0.00%]
0 [0.00%]
2 [18.18%]
0 [0.00%]
You can not vote in this poll

Author
red clay View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar
Tomato Master Emeritus

Joined: 14-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10226
  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: What about a Roma people ("Gipsy") state?
    Posted: 22-Nov-2018 at 10:40
The UN officially recognizes the Roma as an independent cultural entity. They have representation in General Council.
"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
Back to Top
medenaywe View Drop Down
AE Moderator
AE Moderator
Avatar
Master of Meanings

Joined: 06-Nov-2010
Location: /
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 17086
  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Oct-2018 at 11:25
Multiple identity .theft! 
Na"De"Na"J=From Worshiping =Praising God-Compensation=Refund=Tax-Bank=Money=Cash=Coin originated-positioned-suited... Population=People-Mortality=Lethality-Action=Activity=Business=Trade=Culture(Ja)
Back to Top
Ollios View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 22-Feb-2011
Location: Diyar-ı Rum
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1130
  Quote Ollios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Sep-2014 at 05:43
Originally posted by medenaywe

India can support them.Here they declare themselves Turks also.


Turk???
Ellerin Kabe'si var,
Benim Kabem İnsandır
Back to Top
medenaywe View Drop Down
AE Moderator
AE Moderator
Avatar
Master of Meanings

Joined: 06-Nov-2010
Location: /
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 17086
  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2014 at 15:38
India can support them.Here they declare themselves Turks also.
Back to Top
Ollios View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 22-Feb-2011
Location: Diyar-ı Rum
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1130
  Quote Ollios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2014 at 15:33
Three ideas are acceptable for me
Ellerin Kabe'si var,
Benim Kabem İnsandır
Back to Top
Mountain Man View Drop Down
General
General
Avatar

Joined: 16-Aug-2012
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 873
  Quote Mountain Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2014 at 14:07
If you are without a country, you are without a voice in modern affairs.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Back to Top
Centrix Vigilis View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar

Joined: 18-Aug-2006
Location: The Llano
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7392
  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2014 at 04:07
The question is why?

Historically, they disassociate themselves with any sovereign homeland identification in general. Why now a need to dictate to them a 'state'... if their traditional love of independence and freedom doesn't require it or a majority voice amongst them has yet to demand it.

Would the world enslave them to a status they don't seek?

Sounds if not patronizing then dictatorial to me.


Iow. when has anyone, other than the Roma, been determined to be the spokesman for or representative of the Roma.

By what authority is it... that they should be subject to the whims of the non Roma; who would then dictate their future. There lies the conditions and factors that once had the Roma as second class citizens and slaves.


"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

Back to Top
Don Quixote View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar

Retired AE Moderator

Joined: 29-Dec-2010
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4734
  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2014 at 21:22
The Gypsy population in Bulgaria is largely antisocial, and from what I have read similar populations in other countries are asocial, if not downright antisocial. There are few Gypsy intellectuals in Bulgaria, but ironically they are not accepted by the mainstream Gypsy population and considered outcasts by the mainstream Bulgarian one; so their situation is one of isolation and loneliness. I cannot imagine a Roma state organized along social lines to start with.
Back to Top
Ollios View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 22-Feb-2011
Location: Diyar-ı Rum
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1130
  Quote Ollios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2014 at 14:17
The country should be in Romania or Bulgaria but there is huge different between Jews and Gypsy

There is no common religion, neighter common language/languages such as Yiddish and Ladino  for Jews. However language division is more powerful in gypsy.
Ellerin Kabe'si var,
Benim Kabem İnsandır
Back to Top
medenaywe View Drop Down
AE Moderator
AE Moderator
Avatar
Master of Meanings

Joined: 06-Nov-2010
Location: /
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 17086
  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2014 at 04:25
They have it here:(with intentions to cover all theritory of state)Smile
Back to Top
Flipper View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar

Joined: 23-Apr-2006
Location: Flipper HQ
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1813
  Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-May-2008 at 16:59
I believe that the creation of a Roma state is wrong. It's creation could be an oppresive act to the inhabitants of the area appointed, unless it was a wasteland which would also be discriminating for the Romas. Roma people should feel that the country they live in is their home. A creation of a Roma state would proove, that the home feeling has failed and that we treat them as second category citizens. 


Så nu tar jag fram (k)niven va!
Back to Top
Flipper View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar

Joined: 23-Apr-2006
Location: Flipper HQ
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1813
  Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-May-2008 at 12:11
Originally posted by Chilbudios

More importantly, I don't see the State as a solution for the Roma. I mean, now more than ever the technological possibilities exist for a nomadic life (wireless communication). The Roma should be able to develop a on-the-move-cottage-industry (if need be with a bit of state support) rather than given the opportunity to have a state.
Most Roma people I know are not nomadic. Actually I'm certain that most Roma people in Romania live in villages and cities, not in tents.


Indeed, that is a bias most people have. The largest percentage of Roma live like everyone else. However, people tend to identify as Roma only those living in tents.


Så nu tar jag fram (k)niven va!
Back to Top
Richard XIII View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel
Avatar

Joined: 06-Jun-2005
Location: Romania
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 651
  Quote Richard XIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-May-2008 at 11:31
They slowly move in Italy. 
"I want to know God's thoughts...
...the rest are details."

Albert Einstein
Back to Top
Majkes View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar
Imperial Ambassador

Joined: 06-May-2006
Location: Poland
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1144
  Quote Majkes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 21:50
Never heard about Roma want a separate state for themselves. I rather see nationalistic ideas very far away from Roma's culture and customs. Creating such state in Scandinavia or Russia would be crazy. Roma are not Eskimos, they won't live igloos. Second thing Russia and any other European country will not agree for something like that.
All reasons You mentioned why Romania will not agree for Roma state, perfectly fit any other Balkan country.
Anyway what European Roma need is not a separate country but help from the states where they live and as well from the whole EU to increase their level of education and standard of living.
Back to Top
Spartakus View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar
Avatar
terörist

Joined: 22-Nov-2004
Location: Greece/Hellas
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4489
  Quote Spartakus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 09:42
Can you guys speak with evidence? Chilbudios, if you have any problem with this man, bring proofs , links etc. The same for Menumorut. If we discussed this way in all topics, as you do, then the forum would have collapsed in one day. Stop referring to personalities and agendas, and , finally, bring material to discuss.

Concerning the subject of the topic. There is no way to create a gypsy State in the Balkans,because none of the Balkan States is willing to allow such a thing.


Edited by Spartakus - 12-May-2008 at 09:42
"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996)
Back to Top
Menumorut View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 02-Jun-2006
Location: Romania
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1423
  Quote Menumorut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 03:38
Whatever agenda and social life I have I said I wouldn't dare to estimate the number of Roma people (and many other things, actually) based only on that.


I'm tired of your atitude of 'moderating' me, you make me feel I'm not wanted on this forum, this may be true so I'll take a break.

Edited by Menumorut - 12-May-2008 at 03:39

Back to Top
Sarmat View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 31-May-2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3113
  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 03:36
Originally posted by Menumorut


Russia has large territories due to imperialist expansion, in Balkans is too narrow, this was the idea. But I didn't think this without the wish of the Russian people. If they don't want this, should not happen.
 
Then, please also add USA, Canada and Brazil to the list of "the large territories due to imperialist expansion."
 
I wonder if there are any actual Roma among the participants of these thread. It's funny how non-Roma are trying to make Roma happy, by offering them an independent state, without knowing the opinion of actual Roma. LOL
 
Interesting observation is that they never had a state, yet their culture and identiy is intact. "Permanent state" is not really what "Gypsy soul" is about. Are there any international Roma group which advocate for the creation of a separate state at all?
Σαυρομάτης
Back to Top
Chilbudios View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar

Joined: 11-May-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1900
  Quote Chilbudios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 03:30

Whatever agenda and social life I have I said I wouldn't dare to estimate the number of Roma people (and many other things, actually) based only on that.

 
Back to Top
Menumorut View Drop Down
Chieftain
Chieftain
Avatar

Joined: 02-Jun-2006
Location: Romania
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1423
  Quote Menumorut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 03:15
OK, you have a perfect agenda and a rich social life, now are the guard keeping the forum clean of me?

Back to Top
Chilbudios View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke
Avatar

Joined: 11-May-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1900
  Quote Chilbudios Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-May-2008 at 02:56
Originally posted by Menumorut

As I sayed, I changed (I may say deeply) since then. Anyway, I found bad your way of denouncing me.

I don't answer more at the other two paragraphs since you started again to dissect my messages in an inutile way.
The things you have said on this thread are essentially those you said last year on that forum. Whatever has changed in you, it is not about the seeing Gypsies everywhere and looking for solutions to send them away from the society you live in. And since you insisted to provide your personal experience as evidence, I think is fair both for me and for other readers to know your agenda.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.156 seconds.