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Aryo
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Topic: What Is The True Name For Mesoamerica? Posted: 11-Jun-2007 at 20:08 |
The term "Mesoamerica" is very much of European origin. What is the true name of the Mesoamerica cultural sphere used by the Mesoamericans themselves? Is there any proto-mesoamerican language with a title a mesoamerican? What is the Mayan term for Mesoamerica? What do the Mayan people today call Mesoamerica (since Mayan today is still widely spoken in the Mayan region)?
Edited by Aryo - 11-Jun-2007 at 20:10
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Posted: 11-Jun-2007 at 23:09 |
Actually Mesoamerica is an archaelogical term, rather than geographical or political. In fact, Mexico is geographically in North America, and Central America has always been called like that. Because is odd to always say Mexico+Central America, the archaeologists invented Mesoamerica.
The same is true for the Peruvian region that most of the times are called the Andes, a region larger than Peru.
Now, for ancient people having a name for Mesoamerica, I doubt it. They have a narrower geographical scope. Besides, Olmecs, Mayans, Toltecs, Aztecs and the hundred of other people of the region, all spoke lots of different languages and much more dialects.
Pinguin
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edgewaters
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Posted: 13-Jun-2007 at 13:51 |
Mesoamerica is a modern blanket term to cover an area that the precolumbian inhabitants didn't recognize as being a single unit. As pinguin says, they had a narrower geographical scope, and with the myriad (many, many dozens just in the Mayan region alone) of languages, there were likely many different names for the same areas.
The Maya may or may not have had a name for their peninsular region, the Yucatan. It was divided into dozens of different city-states and cultures and languages so it is possible they knew no unitary name. The name "Yucatan" is Mayan; but it means "I don't understand you" and is a result of miscommunication and confusion on the part of the early European explorers.
The Aztec referred to the Valley of Mexico as the "heart of the one world". It signifies a concept similar to the notion of the "middle world" seen in some European cultures of the ancient world, or perhaps even something similar to the medieval notion of Jerusalem as the center of the world.
The Inca referred to their territory as Tawantin Suyu, the United Four Regions, corresponding to the four main districts or provinces of their empire.
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Posted: 13-Jun-2007 at 14:56 |
Originally posted by edgewaters
The Maya may or may not have had a name for their peninsular region, the Yucatan. |
They called it Uluumil Cutz Yetel Ceh, land of the deer and the turkey
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Posted: 13-Jun-2007 at 17:01 |
Does the name "Yucatan" come "Uluumil Cutz Yetel Ceh" or it has another origin?
To me, it seems is just a bad spelling of the Mayan name.
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Posted: 13-Jun-2007 at 20:46 |
As edgewaters said, it's probably derived from a Yucatec Maya phrase meaning 'I don't understand you'. I've also heard a theory that says it's derived from Nahuatl Yucatlan (forgot the meaning) but that appears less likely to me, since Yucatn was far outside the Aztec area of influence (and Nahuatl was not lingua franca in Yucatn either, like it was in for example Oaxaca and Jalisco).
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Aryo
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Posted: 19-Jun-2007 at 23:50 |
This makes me wonder what the Mayan word for Earth is. Anyone know?
Edited by Aryo - 19-Jun-2007 at 23:54
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Posted: 20-Jun-2007 at 18:21 |
Nobody has seen this wonderful glyphs, so I repeat the info here:
The Mayan word for earth, that also means land, is KAB. The sign is:
To say "my land" you have to say "in kab", literarily "my land", and written as follows:
You can find the dictionary on here:
Pinguin
Edited by pinguin - 22-Jun-2007 at 12:09
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edgewaters
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Posted: 25-Jun-2007 at 05:27 |
Originally posted by Mixcoatl
As edgewaters said, it's probably derived from a Yucatec Maya phrase meaning 'I don't understand you'. I've also heard a theory that says it's derived from Nahuatl Yucatlan (forgot the meaning) but that appears less likely to me, since Yucatn was far outside the Aztec area of influence (and Nahuatl was not lingua franca in Yucatn either, like it was in for example Oaxaca and Jalisco).
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Well, it is possible, though. I can never figure out where exactly this encounter was supposed to have taken place; Diaz doesn't mention it and I've never read Cortes' account. But I figure there are two possibilities for the Nahuatl idea.
One, they could have been merchants on the coastal trade routes, coming from or going to the Gulf coast of Mexico proper - in that case, they probably spoke Nahuatl.
Second, if the encounter happened anywhere in the vicinity of Mayapan or Chichen Itza - it might have been a Toltec loan-word, if Chichen Itza really was a product of some sort of Toltec migration.
There's a few other Nahuatl words that might qualify. Yeccaqui, to understand. Yectenehua, to bless. Yeyectli, pretty or nice. Yuhquin, this way. Etc. Any of these might have come up during that kind of an encounter.
Still I think it's from the Mayans though, but who knows for sure.
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Yaomitl
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Posted: 06-Jul-2007 at 08:57 |
Hardly an answer I guess, but the Mexica term is popularly held to have been Anahuac meaning the The Land Between the Waters. This, I've seen it stated, refers to the land between the Pacific and Atlantic oceans, although personally I'm not so sure. Anahuac seems to compound a-tl (water) with the suffix -nahuac which Frances Karttunen defines as near to, adjacent to, or within earshot - sounds more like the Valley of Mexico to me.
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"For as long as the world shall endure, the honour and the glory of Mexico-Tenochtitlan must never be forgotten."
- Chimalpahin Quautlehuanitzin
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